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Subject: Age of Steam Third Edition for 2007! rss

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Nick Johnson
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“Age of Steam® Third Edition”

Mayfair Games proudly announces that it will publish Martin Wallace’s “Age of Steam®” board game in late 2007! We’ll call the game “Age of Steam® Third Edition.”

Developed with updated color rules and beautiful new components, Age of Steam® Third Edition will deliver the ultimate railway game experience. Martin designed the new rules to make the game more approachable for beginners and casual gamers. Advanced rules for expert players will satisfy railway game enthusiasts looking for a more complex and challenging game.

Martin notes that the new game:
“…is just as challenging as the original, but plays in a shorter time and is much more welcoming to new players…”
Age of Steam® Third Edition will be fully compatible with earlier expansions, so owners of these products can still use all of their old maps. Old maps fit right on top of the new board. You won’t obscure the information and displays used in the third edition, for they appear around the edge of the new, larger game board.

Improved components include double-sided track tiles and complete sets of track with printed town symbols, so no more town discs are required. The game will include two maps. One covers the northeastern U.S. and part of southeastern Canada and is suitable for three to four players. The other map covers Germany’s Ruhr Valley, the area around Essen. It’s suitable for four to five players.

You’ll see that we’ve replaced the random introduction of new goods cubes with a new (basic and advanced rules) action called “City Growth.” Revised income reduction will smooth game play. To keep every game competitive, game leaders face increased maintenance costs and greater penalties for borrowing money. We’ll make all the rules available for download on our website with the release of the game.

Mayfair Games will also be releasing guidelines for creating your own expansion maps. We hope to encourage third-party expansions by allowing the use of a “Seal of Approval.” We’ll invite prospective publishers of Age of Steam® expansions to contact Mayfair Games for our Seal of Approval guidelines.

If all goes to plan, you’ll see Age of Steam® Third Edition toward the end of 2007!
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Well done !
 
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Philip Johnson
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Nickcatan wrote:
To keep every game competitive, game leaders face increased maintenance costs and greater penalties for borrowing money.

Blech.
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Jeff Michaud
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This is going to be confusing with the reprint of AoS 2nd edition and AoS 3rd edition both coming out this year...

For those of us who already own AoS 2nd edition (1st printing I believe), will we be able to play it using the rules from the 3rd edition? (and vice versa, those buying 3rd edition be able to play with 2nd edition rules... or is that what the "advanced rules" for 3rd edition are?)

Jeff
 
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Richard Dewsbery
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Yes, yes, and yes.

You can play the new edition using old expansion boards, or you could play the new edition using the old rules, or you could play your old edition with the new rules.
 
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Richard Hutnik
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IcemanCU wrote:
Nickcatan wrote:
To keep every game competitive, game leaders face increased maintenance costs and greater penalties for borrowing money.

Blech.

What is that blech about? That is how AoS had always been. Railroad Tycoon got away from that.
 
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Anthony Simons
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docreason wrote:
IcemanCU wrote:
Nickcatan wrote:
To keep every game competitive, game leaders face increased maintenance costs and greater penalties for borrowing money.

Blech.

What is that blech about? That is how AoS had always been. Railroad Tycoon got away from that.

Actually, no it hasn't. Game leaders pay the same costs as everybody else in AoS as it is; hence the presence of the oft-maligned income reduction rule.

RT never really dealt with the problem of reigning in the leaders and instead intoduced random unknowns which ensured nobody could be certain who the leader was (only who the trailers are).

The new system I know nothing about other than what has been said on the forums here; I do know income reduction is no longer there so perhaps increased maintenance and greater dividends have a better effect.

Of course none of this banter translates that "blech"; it's just an aside.
 
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Richard Dewsbery
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Why don't people wait and see what the rules actually say, and how the various mechanics actually work, instead of reading FAR TOO MUCH into just a few words. Especially if you're going to judge something as "blech" when you're actually maligning a mechanic that isn't in the game!

Game leaders pay as much as anyone else for their expenses, but there are two mechanisms to prevent a runaway income increase which both also work as a sort of "catch up" in certain circumstances. If played skilfully, the leader can mitigate the effects of one of the mechanisms, but not the other, and only at the expense of further large-scale growth. You'll see what I mean when it is published, and porbably not before.

Every game of it that I've played so far has been close, but with victory going to the player who played the best. Sometimes that's been the early leader, other times it has been through other players catching up and passing an early leader. But every time, it's been down to skill and judgment (so I haven't won very often).
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J C Lawrence
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Re-ordering your text slightly.

RDewsbery wrote:
...victory going to the player who played the best.

While this is attractive.

RDewsbery wrote:
Every game of it that I've played so far has been close...

This isn't.

One of my primary complaints on Blue Moon City (for instance) is that I've never seen a game end, experienced players, newbies or mixed, without every player being about to win on their next turn. That's one hell of a game interest killer.
 
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clearclaw wrote:
One of my primary complaints on Blue Moon City (for instance) is that I've never seen a game end, experienced players, newbies or mixed, without every player being about to win on their next turn. That's one hell of a game interest killer.

I think you're using a different criterion for "close". If the outcome of BMC is 17-17-17-17, i.e., every player finished in 17 turns and the outcome came down to the tiebreak of the first player, then that is certainly an extreme version of "close". But if a VP game finishes with scores like 156-153-149-147, people would generally call that "very close", yet there may be appreciable differences of skill represented by those separations.

P.S. Your experience in Blue Moon City doesn't match mine. What happened in the games that I've played is that people take chances to try to win a turn earlier, and when those don't pay off, they may end up several turns from victory at the end.
 
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DaviddesJ wrote:
I think you're using a different criterion for "close".

You're probably right. Accepted.

Quote:
P.S. Your experience in Blue Moon City doesn't match mine. What happened in the games that I've played is that people take chances to try to win a turn earlier, and when those don't pay off, they may end up several turns from victory at the end.

This may be. My experience with BMC isn't very broad: ~6 games.
 
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Sadly, there are many who identify so closely with their games that any change is seen as an attack on their very soul. Fortunately, I identify more strongly with my aged cheese collection and the tv series "Ugly Betty."

 
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I personally can't really see how anyone could have a problem with Age of Steam "classic", Age of Steam "revised" and Railroad Tycoon "2" all being printed over the next 12 months or so (except maybe wanting them sooner).

That's 3 flavors to suit almost everyone that's even remotely interested in what the AoS "system" has to offer.
 
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nexttothemoon wrote:
I personally can't really see how anyone could have a problem with Age of Steam "classic", Age of Steam "revised" and Railroad Tycoon "2" all being printed over the next 12 months or so (except maybe wanting them sooner).

Suppose there were 92 different versions of Age of Steam on the market, all with varying rulesets. Can you understand why someone might not like that? Or do you really believe that more choices are always good?
 
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Darren M
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Yep... more is better.

There's already 27000+ games on BGG and more added every week and still more being published every year so I'd say most people seem to like choices and variety.
 
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nexttothemoon wrote:
There's already 27000+ games on BGG and more added every week and still more being published every year so I'd say most people seem to like choices and variety.

The question isn't about "most people". Your claim was that not even one person could possibly prefer that there be a smaller variety of similar games.
 
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generalpf wrote:
nexttothemoon wrote:
Yep... more is better.

There's already 27000+ games on BGG and more added every week and still more being published every year so I'd say most people seem to like choices and variety.
That's not 27,000+ versions of the same game though. Having multiple version of the same game is stupid and leads to confusion when players of each version meet to play at the same table.

My feeling on this is that if someone is smart enough to play Age of Steam, which seems to generate cult-like devotion, then they can probably figure out the differences between "Classic" and "Lite."
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craniac wrote:
My feeling on this is that if someone is smart enough to play Age of Steam, which seems to generate cult-like devotion, then they can probably figure out the differences between "Classic" and "Lite."

The reason that people don't like a proliferation of different versions is not because they have trouble figuring out the differences between them.
 
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nexttothemoon wrote:
I personally can't really see how anyone could have a problem with Age of Steam "classic", Age of Steam "revised" and Railroad Tycoon "2" all being printed over the next 12 months or so (except maybe wanting them sooner).

That's 3 flavors to suit almost everyone that's even remotely interested in what the AoS "system" has to offer.

Actually, I can easily see the publishers of Age of Steam "classic", Age of Steam "revised" and Railroad Tycoon "2" having a problem with them all being printed over the next 12 months or so.

Good luck with those original sales projections.
 
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Tim Steen
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Quote:
The reason that people don't like a proliferation of different versions is not because they have trouble figuring out the differences between them.

But that is what people keep saying...

Ok, then why is proliferation of different versions bad, exactly?

If there are 92 versions, and you only want the first one, that's great. How is me liking the 92nd version a problem to you? I don't see how your playing experience is ruined by this.
 
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timsteen wrote:
Ok, then why is proliferation of different versions bad, exactly?

Several different ways.

It can make it harder to find opponents for the particular version that you prefer. This is most significant for people who like to play one particular game in depth, so that they learn a lot about how to play the game well, and who want to have opponents who also know how to play the game well.

It can make it harder to get other people to play the game in other ways, too. If they have already learned a slightly different version of the game, then they may not want to learn another version, or they may find it confusing to keep them straight. That's different from me finding it confusing.

It can reduce volume for sales of any particular version of the game, thus making it more expensive, harder to find, more likely to go out of print, less likely to be translated into additional languages and available in different countries, etc.

It can reduce third-party support for the game, particularly significant for a game like Age of Steam that has many different maps from different third-party designers. If the market is fragmented, that likely means less variety of maps for any particular version.

And so on.
 
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At least as far as both the AoS versions are concerned it has been stated that maps are usable with both Winsome AoS and Mayfair AoS. This must be a good thing for the 3rd party map-designers.
 
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andyl wrote:
At least as far as both the AoS versions are concerned it has been stated that maps are usable with both Winsome AoS and Mayfair AoS. This must be a good thing for the 3rd party map-designers.

It's only a good thing if the maps are not only "usable", but also balanced and interesting, with both rulesets.

I think we won't know if that's true until we see the rules.
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generalpf wrote:
timsteen wrote:
If there are 92 versions, and you only want the first one, that's great. How is me liking the 92nd version a problem to you? I don't see how your playing experience is ruined by this.
Good luck running an Age of Steam tournament that's fair to everyone.

They will probably just use the original Winsome AoS.
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/1487734#1487734
 
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DaviddesJ wrote:
andyl wrote:
At least as far as both the AoS versions are concerned it has been stated that maps are usable with both Winsome AoS and Mayfair AoS. This must be a good thing for the 3rd party map-designers.

It's only a good thing if the maps are not only "usable", but also balanced and interesting, with both rulesets.

I think we won't know if that's true until we see the rules.

We cannot be certain, but since they have already indicated backwards compatibility (that's usability covered) it seems extremely unlikely that any of the core track-building, link ownership and goods shipment rules have changed significantly enough to make balance and interest a problem.

There would have to be rules tweaks for any particular special rules used in the third party maps; these would be minor adaptations for unofficial expansions anyway and not something I would see as a real problem.
 
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