$5.00
$20.00
$15.00
Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
68 Posts
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 

Kingdom Death: Monster» Forums » General

Subject: the new survival of the fittest rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Hugh Jorgan
msg tools
t3clis wrote:
it's actually quite good. I wonder if PoSun doesn't get too easy with it, but it's a welcome change, and one much asked for.
on a side note... was that a Phoenix armor survivor in a dynamic pose? can't wait for it


I don't think it's for the Phoenix... Gryphon perhaps? <gasp>!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
nota realname
Australia
Alaska
flag msg tools
But its still roll twice and take the lowest.

That will still kill more survivors then anything else if you take it. that is a 19% chance of a 1 right there, and a grand total of 41% of 3 and under.

First time round we took it without really comprehending what we had done, our population swiftly declined between monsters as we breed ourselves to extinction. thus ended SPARTATOWN.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
clarence
United States
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I like the new version.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James
United States
Maryland
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
whipko wrote:
I like the new version.


What new version?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
clarence
United States
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Vonderbread wrote:
whipko wrote:
I like the new version.


What new version?


https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/poots/kingdom-death-mon...

go to the end.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alessio Massuoli
Italy
Terni
Umbria
flag msg tools
They await the King
badge
The Snarky Sloth
mbmbmbmbmb
it's actually quite good. I wonder if PoSun doesn't get too easy with it, but it's a welcome change, and one much asked for.
on a side note... was that a Phoenix armor survivor in a dynamic pose? can't wait for it
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
The mini looks awesome! Can't wait to grab it.

And the boost SoTF gets seems really thematic but the odds still suck I guess.

The math tells that you have following chances on getting given results

1 19% (-2p)
2+3 32% (-1p)
4+5+6 33% (+1p)
7+8 12% (+1p)
9 3% (+2p)
10 1% (+2p or +1p = savior if you have Hovel = 1,5p)

Combining the results you get:

19% -2p
32% -1p
45% +1p
3% +2p
1% +1,5p (it's +2 or +1 depending on the Hovel innovation so I count it as 1,5)

If you sum the odds it means that in a long run you will loose people (expected population change is -0,175 survovors per roll), because you have 51% chances to loose rather then gain population. And this is the main mechanic that let's you repopulate!

So in the long run you should not use it, meaning you have no mechanic at all to repopulate.

Let's compare the results you get with Protect the Young (I'm assuming the higher number is picked at all times).


1 1% -2
2+3 8% -1
4+5+6 27% +1
7+8 28% +1
9 17% +2
10 19% +1,5p

Combining the results you get:

1% -2p
8% -1p
56% +1p
17% +2p
19% +1,5

This means that expected population change is +1,075 and actually you can actually make it higher by choosing twins over savior.

So just to summarize.

ProtectTheYoung = +1,075
SurvivalOfTheFittest = -0,175

Broken as hell, because SotF should be above 0. It should be somewhere around 0,5 actually to give you a proper chance to repopulate. I think you should roll with one dice which gives you:


1 10% -2
2+3 20% -1
4+5+6 30% +1
7+8 20% +1
9 10% +2
10 10% +1,5p

Combining to

10% -2p
20% -1p
50% +1p
10% +2p
10% +1,5

This gives you a +0,45 people per roll and it just makes sense for the main repopulating mechanic to just give you a chance to repopulate.

I guess the new rule does change the odds letting you reroll one dice, but it's only if you assume that the given parents did not lost their once per lifetime reroll already.

I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on this. Any ideas? Does anyone know Poots thoughts on this?










8 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
ArtSchool
Spain
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
t3clis wrote:
it's actually quite good. I wonder if PoSun doesn't get too easy with it, but it's a welcome change, and one much asked for.
on a side note... was that a Phoenix armor survivor in a dynamic pose? can't wait for it


It's still hard to go with, but the fact that everyone gets +1 strength and evasion and that "saving throw" roll makes it a much more interesting choice...play it safe with affection or push your luck with survival of the fittest...

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
ArtSchool
Spain
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
t3clis wrote:
it's actually quite good. I wonder if PoSun doesn't get too easy with it, but it's a welcome change, and one much asked for.
on a side note... was that a Phoenix armor survivor in a dynamic pose? can't wait for it


Yeah, was wondering the same...aghh can't wait...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stuart Martyn
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Styfen wrote:
hwknight wrote:
t3clis wrote:
it's actually quite good. I wonder if PoSun doesn't get too easy with it, but it's a welcome change, and one much asked for.
on a side note... was that a Phoenix armor survivor in a dynamic pose? can't wait for it


I don't think it's for the Phoenix... Gryphon perhaps? <gasp>!

It's definitely Phoenix armour in a new sculpt.

As for the new SoTF. I suspect that one of the effects it will have is causing a settlement to rotate the breeders from one generation to the next, stopping breeding when an intimacy roll is failed and moving on to a new breeding pair. Using extra reroll on intimacy means it's a super safe way to breed now.


That's true, I'd missed that, especially if you favour having non-hunters breed (so their rerolls aren't as precious a resource).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
That is an interesting option. I will try to find some patience and do the math considering you have 1 or 2 rerolls. I'm curious what will it show.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lonny x
msg tools
mbmbmbmb
"Once per lifetime, a survivor may reroll a single roll result." Does that mean all survivors are born with this ability or is this a one time thing for the entire settlement?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
Every survivor can do it once per lifetime.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stevenson Junior
Czech Republic
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
How will the new Survival of the Fittest look combined with Face Painting innovation percent-wise?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
S W
msg tools
Can a survivor use his once per lifetime reroll on the intimacy table? And if so, is it either parent, the female parent or the putative child who is rolling?

I feel like you probably can't use the reroll here but if you can, and you assume one reroll is available per intimacy, and you always use it to avoid death only during intimacy, it changes the maths considerably.

Face painting also turns SoTF into a net positive, although it's fiddly to pull off

*edit* I started writing this this morning and finished without reading the posts above: Sorry!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Nathan Scott
United States
New Jersey
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
StevensonJunior wrote:
How will the new Survival of the Fittest look combined with Face Painting innovation percent-wise?


This is exactly what has to be done. While odd, face paint also never states that it can only be applied only once. Save your love juice, face paint 3 times, drink it all and away you go with no risk of death.

Even without love juice, face paint 2-3 times before trying for new births. It makes intimacy more rare, more endeavor expensive, but would also be synergistic with collective toil and other endeavor boosting effects.

I never really tested out a campaign with the storing of LJ and face paint 2-3 times plan. Old survival of the fittest wasn't strong enough to warrant it. It was back in the "to do" queue of mine. Now it may float to the top.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
If you face paint once then the chances changes dramatically:

2+3 36% -1p
4+5+6 39% 1p
7+8 16% 1p
9+11 6% 2p
10 3% 1,5p

It gives you a + 0,36p per roll, and the chance to loose someone goes down from 51% to just 36%.

So I guess face-painting is basically essential when picking SotF and makes this playable again, the down side being the fact that you need two endeavours (more if you roll poorly on facepainting) instead of one to get a kid.

But I guess it's fine and you really get hardcore survivors with this new SotF. Hmmmmm. I wonder if it is not overpowered now? Damn. Now I wish I hadn't already started a new campaign two weeks ago. I would definitely try that one!

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacob Schoberg
United States
Elkhorn
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
when i get home, i'm so tired
badge
just roll over, please. i'm so tired. just roll over, please. i'm so tired.
mbmbmbmbmb
Actually a viable choice now. Totally dig the extra reroll. And yes, using it on the intimacy table is a pretty safe way to get some safe(ish) births.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alessio Massuoli
Italy
Terni
Umbria
flag msg tools
They await the King
badge
The Snarky Sloth
mbmbmbmbmb
question: when you reroll, you reroll ALL the dice in the roll (ie. two dice on intimacy sotf), or you can (and should) roll just one die?

this alters probability significantly
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
Good question. I think in this case you only reroll one dice, because it's not a one roll compromised of two dices but these are two separate rolls.

It says on a card: roll twice and pick a lower result.

At least this is what I would play here - rules as written. If you wanted to reroll i.e. your AGE table roll you would reroll two dices as it was one roll.


Another question arises though:

Can I reroll any roll or just a roll that is specifically connected with a given survivor? For example: can I reroll Armored Strangers event table roll?

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Nathan Ehlers
United States
Cleveland
Ohio
flag msg tools
I love you!
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Even if the trend line pulls towards zero, you aren't really managing a population. You're playing a game. My meaning is you only need a finite number of survivors to "win" the game. So if your especially tough civilization only needs 10 fit survivors to best all the monsters in the box, then the bad odds on the roll doesn't mean that you shouldn't play with it.

I imagine the decision made in play test is you have less people killed in other ways due to increased stats so it balances. But that's just speculation.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
The problem is you often loose survivors because of story, hunt or timetable events and you can't do anything about it. The stats mean nothing. So you need to repopulate.

Let's just look at Armoured Strangers event at year six (just two years after the Butcher fight!).

You have 8 (or more) people in settlement? They will punish you. Roll a dice. 1-4? Loose 5 people. Now there are only 3 of you! Not enough to form a full party.

Want to repopulate? Roll twice. 10! Yes! And... 1. No! Bad luck. Lost 2 people.

Now you have a one survivor that you can just send on a final hunt and see him being eaten by a Lion.

With two just two bed rolls you lost 6 sessions of playing time and your friends don't want to start over again. You are screwed.

P.S. I hate Armoured Stranger and the Kings Man.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
Styfen wrote:
t3clis wrote:
question: when you reroll, you reroll ALL the dice in the roll (ie. two dice on intimacy sotf), or you can (and should) roll just one die?

this alters probability significantly

I'm confident that you reroll both dice. We're rerolling the single roll result, which is the result of the two dice. If it was reroll one dice it should say, reroll one dice.

The question for me is, who is actually rolling on the table? I'd guess it's the one who triggered the event in the first place, but I'm not sure. It also matters because of Otherworldly Luck.


This is not a single roll result. It says on a card: roll twice not roll 2d10 or roll two dices.

Roll twice means that you roll and then you roll again thus there are 2 different rolls. So you can reroll one of them.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
ArtSchool
Spain
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
kurczaczekx wrote:
Styfen wrote:
t3clis wrote:
question: when you reroll, you reroll ALL the dice in the roll (ie. two dice on intimacy sotf), or you can (and should) roll just one die?

this alters probability significantly

I'm confident that you reroll both dice. We're rerolling the single roll result, which is the result of the two dice. If it was reroll one dice it should say, reroll one dice.

The question for me is, who is actually rolling on the table? I'd guess it's the one who triggered the event in the first place, but I'm not sure. It also matters because of Otherworldly Luck.


This is not a single roll result. It says on a card: roll twice not roll 2d10 or roll two dices.

Roll twice means that you roll and then you roll again thus there are 2 different rolls. So you can reroll one of them.



I fully agree with this interpretation of the rule. Just one die has to be rolled, for the event is configured as two separate rolls. Edit: reminds me of good old D&D saving throws.


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
The Awaited King
msg tools
mbmbmb
I have a new question though. If you reroll only a single dice when do I have to decide about it?

Can I roll dice and then the other dice. And the decide that I want to reroll the first dice?

Or do I have to decide just after the first roll that I want to reroll? Heh?

Lots of questions
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.