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Subject: Unresolved Spells - Pandora rss

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Jacob
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Are Face down spells considered unresolved?

Ruling needed: if my opponent used dirty cheat to cheat in Pandora and flips Equilibrium off the top of the signature deck, is Pandora resolved at this point? if not; Pandora is the only unresolved spell in play, in which case does Equilibrium become Pandora and then you flip another spell? Now, as all unresolved spells then become Pandora does this include face down spells which are then forced to become Pandora?

Pandora: "Draw a random signature spell from the deck and immediately resolve it. That spell will also receive +1 to the NV of its FX. Return the spell to the deck afterwards."

Equilibrium: "Choose an unresolved spell played this phase. Resolve all unresolved spells, and this card, as if they were the chosen spell."
 
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Stephen Gibson
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Jamcob wrote:
Are Face down spells considered unresolved?

Ruling needed: if my opponent used dirty cheat to cheat in Pandora and flips Equilibrium off the top of the signature deck, is Pandora resolved at this point? if not; Pandora is the only unresolved spell in play, in which case does Equilibrium become Pandora and then you flip another spell? Now, as all unresolved spells then become Pandora does this include face down spells which are then forced to become Pandora?

Pandora: "Draw a random signature spell from the deck and immediately resolve it. That spell will also receive +1 to the NV of its FX. Return the spell to the deck afterwards."

Equilibrium: "Choose an unresolved spell played this phase. Resolve all unresolved spells, and this card, as if they were the chosen spell."


An unresolved card is any card that has been played that turn that has not yet been resolved, so face down cards would count.

If you cheat with Pandora, and get Equilibrium, then Pandora is resolved, and with Equilibrium you will have to pick one of the face down cards. Which is essentially forcing the turn into the After Phase.

So everyone's cards would then become whatever was chosen with Equilibrium, and you'd all have to roll to see who's resolves first.


Hope that makes sense It's certainly a tricky situation, and I apologize for any confusion.
 
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Jacob
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Thanks Stephen.

So I'm assuming equilibrium in this case could accidentally target a face down item?

Or is it that once equilibrium is revealed you would immediately reveal all face down spells and then pick? However, I assume that if all cards were items, Equilibrium would just fail to resolve and return to the deck?

Sorry, just trying to get my head around this.
 
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Jacob
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Jamcob wrote:
Thanks Stephen.

So I'm assuming equilibrium in this case could accidentally target a face down item?

Or is it that once equilibrium is revealed you would immediately reveal all face down spells and then pick? However, I assume that if all cards were items, Equilibrium would just fail to resolve and return to the deck?

Sorry, just trying to get my head around this.


Just playing devils advocate...

Unless of course Equilibrium needs an Errata to say "Choose an unresolved CARD played this phase. Resolve all unresolved CARDS, and this card, as if they were the chosen CARD." ?

Then of course there would be issues with combine items... So for example, player A plays Earth, player B plays Wind combined with the dart item card.

Dirty Cheat the Equilibrium and pick the earth and now the darts and wind become earth and go into a weird 3 way face off between two players... That might cause more problems.
 
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Stephen Gibson
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Jamcob wrote:
Jamcob wrote:
Thanks Stephen.

So I'm assuming equilibrium in this case could accidentally target a face down item?

Or is it that once equilibrium is revealed you would immediately reveal all face down spells and then pick? However, I assume that if all cards were items, Equilibrium would just fail to resolve and return to the deck?

Sorry, just trying to get my head around this.


Just playing devils advocate...

Unless of course Equilibrium needs an Errata to say "Choose an unresolved CARD played this phase. Resolve all unresolved CARDS, and this card, as if they were the chosen CARD." ?

Then of course there would be issues with combine items... So for example, player A plays Earth, player B plays Wind combined with the dart item card.

Dirty Cheat the Equilibrium and pick the earth and now the darts and wind become earth and go into a weird 3 way face off between two players... That might cause more problems.


Yeah good point.

So, I'd probably have to errata the definition of Unresolved to be this:

"Any card that has been played and turned faced up that has not yet had its FX resolved".

Thus Equilibrium would do nothing when cheating with it, and it'd avoid these messy situations.

Good job finding this fault! Thank you!
 
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Jacob
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No worries. Got any jobs going? lol
 
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Jacob
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ssgibson wrote:
Jamcob wrote:
Jamcob wrote:
Thanks Stephen.

So I'm assuming equilibrium in this case could accidentally target a face down item?

Or is it that once equilibrium is revealed you would immediately reveal all face down spells and then pick? However, I assume that if all cards were items, Equilibrium would just fail to resolve and return to the deck?

Sorry, just trying to get my head around this.


Just playing devils advocate...

Unless of course Equilibrium needs an Errata to say "Choose an unresolved CARD played this phase. Resolve all unresolved CARDS, and this card, as if they were the chosen CARD." ?

Then of course there would be issues with combine items... So for example, player A plays Earth, player B plays Wind combined with the dart item card.

Dirty Cheat the Equilibrium and pick the earth and now the darts and wind become earth and go into a weird 3 way face off between two players... That might cause more problems.


Yeah good point.

So, I'd probably have to errata the definition of Unresolved to be this:

"Any card that has been played and turned faced up that has not yet had its FX resolved".

Thus Equilibrium would do nothing when cheating with it, and it'd avoid these messy situations.

Good job finding this fault! Thank you!


Well I think you have several options,

You could allow Equilibrium to pick a face down card, go to Aftermath and either apply FX or allow Equilibrium to fizzle if the player chose an item by accident.

Or have it say: "Flip all unresolved face-down spells face-up. Choose an unresolved spell played this phase. Resolve all unresolved spells, and this card, as if they were the chosen spell."

Or have it say: "Choose an unresolved face-up spell played this phase. Resolve all unresolved spells, and this card, as if they were the chosen spell."

I think the latter is what you mean right?
 
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Stephen Gibson
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No I mean, I'd change the definition of "unresolved" in the game, and leave Equilibrium's wording the same.

I hadn't considered a spell might have to interact with a face-down unresolved card, Equilibrium being cheated is the only instance of that I can think of.

So changing the game's definition of unresolved to refer to "face-up" would fix everything and break nothing, as it was always supposed unresolved cards were face up.
 
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Jacob
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ssgibson wrote:
No I mean, I'd change the definition of "unresolved" in the game, and leave Equilibrium's wording the same.

I hadn't considered a spell might have to interact with a face-down unresolved card, Equilibrium being cheated is the only instance of that I can think of.

So changing the game's definition of unresolved to refer to "face-up" would fix everything and break nothing, as it was always supposed unresolved cards were face up.


Ah, good call. Would that mean that face-down cards are not considered spells at all? and they are simply face-down cards until revealed?

Also would this mean that cheating in Hush would be pointless?
 
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