Mac Mcleod
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I mean, republicans knew they had issues in 2012 with hispanics and said they would do better.

Then 2016 and they attacked hispanics and courted white voters while selecting a horrific candidate with regard to candidates.

If they can redeem themselves with hispanics, do you think they can do it by 2020?


Republicans had minor issues with female voters in 2008 and 2012 but with trump, they have done significant damage with the female voting block. Are women just leery/disgusted/worried about Trump or will they be sensitized to republican misogyny now and permanently support democrats slightly over republicans (say 5%-10% so 55/45 to 60/40 for next few elections).

For many millennials and GenZ this was a formative election. Some GenZ were hardened in their alt-right views (which started on 4chan). This is young white males and females. But it looks like a majority are voting democratic. Is this likely to set their party preference for the next 12-16 years?

Finally, we are sort of overdue for a recession. This could make for a rough Clinton presidency. Many people vote economically. No question here just an observation.


Personally, my vote for republicans is mainly based on the "policy of no". If they drop the "policy of no", I could go back to voting for select republicans but as long as they maintain it, I view them as unfit for government at any level.
 
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Chief Slovenly
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Re: Is the various vote segments redeemable for republcans?
1. I think the speculation that Republicans have 187'ed themselves into electoral oblivion are slightly overblown.

2. However, I also think the slow-motion trainwreck has been set in motion -- Republican grassroots primary voters, by simple majorities, had immigration as their top issue; illegal immigrants and refugees were the prime drivers. Conservative media again found an animating issue, and Trump was the salesman who came along and found an untapped market -- few other Republican candidates, if any, spoke to the Breitbart-huffing base like he did. Add the Obama birth certificate cherry on top and you have the alt-right racists' dream candidate.

3. Trump, after all is said and done, will be responsible for Democratic gains in both the Senate and the House, possibly to the point of taking the upper chamber -- because he's such a fucknut. But what he's done is picked off all the Republicans who were in swing distiricts, or were moderates to begin with: he's left Paul Ryan, whose speakership was already a bit shaky, with an even more ungovernable Republican Freedom Caucus.

4. Therefore over the next 4 years, the Republicans in Congress will be even more beholden to their rabid constituencies, where blowing up the institution and grinding the gears of government to so much copper filament is seen as a positive virtue.

5. To everybody else, though, who has a stake in government outcomes -- women, Latinos, gay people, or maybe just those of us who'd like to see the Great Republican Puppet Show of FREEDOM toned down a few notches -- the new Republican Caucus on Meth will follow their pet issues right off a cliff.

6. If they can follow the 2012 blueprint and put down the White Grievance bong for 5 minutes, then they've got a shot at repairing themselves in 8 years or even maybe next cycle.

7. As it is there's way too much money in monetizing people's conservative outrage back at them.

C'est la vie.
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Robert Wesley
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Re: Is the various vote segments redeemable for republcans?
Yeah, them "deplorables" NEEDS being there with one another and far-alt RIGHT-AWAY from 'decent society'.
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Re: Is the various vote segments redeemable for republcans?
Voters have short memories but long allegiances. Hispanics and women will continue to vote Democrat overall because of their past allegiances rather than because of Donald Trump.

There are also internal dynamics to consider. There's very little Republicans can do to change the dynamic with women because their party structure is tied so closely to the pro-life movement. Bush II thought he could lead conservatives to the well on immigration reform but failed, and he was about as well positioned as one could get on that issue.

Anything involving the internet is suspect. Its personal anonymity allows people to act in ways they wouldn't normally act and say things they wouldn't normally say.

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J.D. Hall
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To actually answer the question instead of throw partisan BS against the wall:

I don't think the Republicans attempts to connect with the various groups Mac listed are irredeemable. What it will take, though, is returning to the Goldwater standard of Republicanism -- small, efficient government, staunchly and consistently defending civil and human rights for all citizens, being careful stewards of the nation's resources, being reluctant to being drawn into foreign conflicts but standing with our allies, being pro-business in a way that does not favor the rich over everyone else.

In short, insist evangelicals cool it, force the Tea Partiers to actually make sense occasionally, embrace the idea of compromise, and actually look at Ronald Reagan's record instead of the myth created by Rush Limbaugh and his legion of idiots.
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Mac Mcleod
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SPIGuy wrote:
Voters have short memories but long allegiances. Hispanics and women will continue to vote Democrat overall because of their past allegiances rather than because of Donald Trump.

There are also internal dynamics to consider. There's very little Republicans can do to change the dynamic with women because their party structure is tied so closely to the pro-life movement. Bush II thought he could lead conservatives to the well on immigration reform but failed, and he was about as well positioned as one could get on that issue.

Anything involving the internet is suspect. Its personal anonymity allows people to act in ways they wouldn't normally act and say things they wouldn't normally say.



I think there is room in the republican party for lots of women who are pro-life and for women who are conservative and for whom pro-choice isn't a single issue vote. I don't think there is room in the republican party for candidates who are callous about sexual assault, sexual harassment, callous comments about rape, and general misogynistic comments. Basically male republican representatives (and staff) need a massive empathy transplant.

Thank you Ima for a good example of what I'm talking about. Well timed, sir.
 
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Voting patterns have completely shifted in the past and they will again in the future. When (or if) the Republicans start consistently losing elections they'll eventually change course. Party politics isn't as set in stone as it might seem. The 2020 redistricting process could completely change how both parties operate if there is significant movement to reduce gerrymandering, for example.
 
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Pontifex Maximus
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maxo-texas wrote:
I mean, republicans knew they had issues in 2012 with hispanics and said they would do better.

Then 2016 and they attacked hispanics and courted white voters while selecting a horrific candidate with regard to candidates.

If they can redeem themselves with hispanics, do you think they can do it by 2020?


Republicans had minor issues with female voters in 2008 and 2012 but with trump, they have done significant damage with the female voting block. Are women just leery/disgusted/worried about Trump or will they be sensitized to republican misogyny now and permanently support democrats slightly over republicans (say 5%-10% so 55/45 to 60/40 for next few elections).

For many millennials and GenZ this was a formative election. Some GenZ were hardened in their alt-right views (which started on 4chan). This is young white males and females. But it looks like a majority are voting democratic. Is this likely to set their party preference for the next 12-16 years?

Finally, we are sort of overdue for a recession. This could make for a rough Clinton presidency. Many people vote economically. No question here just an observation.


Personally, my vote for republicans is mainly based on the "policy of no". If they drop the "policy of no", I could go back to voting for select republicans but as long as they maintain it, I view them as unfit for government at any level.


The problem will be that the GOP in Congress will be less moderate than now. Given that, and the fact that The Donald is making noises like he wants to still have a hand in GOP politics after the elections there does not seem to be any redemption at hand for the GOP for at least the next 2 election cycles. We already have Senators stating they will not consider any nominations to the SCOTUS from Clinton under any circumstances, and Congresspersons promising wall to wall investigations and impeachment months before her first day in office.

It will take a couple of cycles of electoral thumping before whats left of the GOP comes to its senses. Question is, will that be too late
 
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Xuzu Horror
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ImaSokpupet wrote:
Quote:
Thank you Ima for a good example of what I'm talking about. Well timed, sir.
In your OP, you claim that Trump might do some sort of damage to the Rep brand, resulting in a huge split in the womon vote. Pew says it has always been this way, "Women lean Democratic by 52%-36%," and have for quite some time.

Am I a good example because pussies will be blinded to the truth, because they are more concerned with feelings?

maxo wrote:
Republicans had minor issues with female voters in 2008 and 2012 but with trump, they have done significant damage with the female voting block. Are women just leery/disgusted/worried about Trump or will they be sensitized to republican misogyny now and permanently support democrats slightly over republicans (say 5%-10% so 55/45 to 60/40 for next few elections).


I would say he was talking about this:

ImaSokpupet wrote:
Women have leaned D rather than R for quite some time. Mostly with unappealing women, unable to marry.


Insulting people is rarely a good way to win them over.
 
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Mac Mcleod
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I wish to cede my remaining two minutes to Imasockpuppet please. He's making my point so much more effectively than I could.
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if you live long enough hero's become the villain of the story . In 60 years time half of todays youth will be 'conservative'.

Whatever the definiton of that word is for that period.
 
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