$35.00
Recommend
18 
 Thumb up
 Hide
111 Posts
1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5  Next »   | 

Scythe» Forums » General

Subject: The game that offers everything and delivers next to nothing.... rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Don Smith
Canada
Calgary
Alberta
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
With the hype over Scythe, I swallowed the Kool-Aid and bought it.

I read the rules and as I was doing so I kept thinking "that's a cool mechanic" and "that's interesting". Then, as the variety of mechanics kept piling up, I thought "this is might be a fruit (point) salad mess".

Characters that can "quest" (encounters) - unique character/faction boards - asymmetric set up - various ways to "engine build" - interaction on the board and via adjacent player production bonus - a Factory space in the middle of the map to entice you there - mechs which give you special unique powers - buildings which give you special abilities - combat using BOTH cards and a combat wheel - popularity and power - oh my!

When I actually got around to playing it, Scythe was under-whelming. Your action choices are pretty scripted. Move to where you can produce workers - then produce - then upgrade - then move some more and produce some more and upgrade/enlist/deploy until the game (mercifully) ends.

It's not a bad game but it's not really that good. Save your money and don't drink any more of the Kool-Aid.

Not recommended.

39 
 Thumb up
2.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Garth Tams
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Bold post, but to be honest, I have that feeling from reading the rules as well. Scythe has not seen the table yet, and at this point I do not have any urge to let it either. I am tempted to put on the Jack Vasel auction, see if someone else can enjoy it more.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Russell
United States
Clarkston
Michigan
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Want to sell your copy?
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Craig Johnson
United Kingdom
Penzance
Cornwall
flag msg tools
The Chicken of DOOOOOOOOOOM!!!!
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
I don't quite get the point of this post. You're basically saying you bought Scythe and didn't like it. It's clearly not a style of game you enjoy; fair enough. I bought Scythe and loved it. After many plays at all player counts I still love it and it's entered my top ten.
I've also bought games based on the hype and realised I'd made a mistake: Star Wars X-Wing for example: hated it. Boring, random and too long... In my opinion. Many other people love it. They're not 'drinking the Kool Aid', they just have different tastes to me.
I don't see the point of writing a post about how dull X-Wing is because it's clearly not dull for many people. Same for Scythe.
64 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alain Houle
Canada
Etobicoke
Ontario
flag msg tools
9 HIGH
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
I'm in Canada and eagerly awaiting a copy. Can i cancel that order and relieve you of your copy?
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryce K. Nielsen
United States
Elk Ridge
Utah
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Craigus69 wrote:
I don't quite get the point of this post.

Um, I think the point of the post was to review the game. I mean, I guess it was posted in the wrong forum? Or do you only want to see positive, glowing reviews?

-shnar
42 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Reverend Uncle Bastard
Canada
Toronto
Ontario
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
shnar wrote:
Craigus69 wrote:
I don't quite get the point of this post.

Um, I think the point of the post was to review the game. I mean, I guess it was posted in the wrong forum? Or do you only want to see positive, glowing reviews?

-shnar


Happy to see positive and negative reviews, but "scripted, didn't like it" is too brief to be of use to anyone.
53 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonathan Challis
United Kingdom
Inkpen
West Berkshire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
I love it, but then I love point-salad-euros and there are elements of that to this.

The biggest issues is if people think it's a 4x - that's the only Kool-Aid being drunk. The designer thinks it's a different take on 4x, the community is mostly of the opinion that's confusing, and it's a 2.5x at best.

It is a great game, if you like this sort of game - which is a euro resource optimisation engine game. If you don't like that sort of game, then it was never for you - but there has been so much printed about this, rulebooks, gameplay and reviews about it - I have no sympathy really for someone thinking it's something else.
10 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Gordy
United States
Eden Prairie
Minnesota
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
You know, I have heard conversations around this game being scripted, and though I do agree that the first couple of turns have an optimal way to get things moving, in the multitude of plays I have unde my belt, I never felt the game was scripted past the first couple of turns. I think it opens up and becomes a combination of strategic and tactical decisions based on what everyone is doing).

And to be blunt, it is not uncommon for games with engine building to be somewhat similar in the first few rounds as you get your engine up and running.

I am completely open to reviews that are either good or bad. I don't appreciate reviews that are attacking the game for its popularity or hype (with little support of what actually is negative in the game) or on the flip side reviews that are fanboyish without actually addressing some of the questions in the game. And for this game I have seen many of both, as well as some real thought out positive and negative and even neutral reviews.

By the way, I am not saying the OP fits into any of these categories, I just wanted to respond to his concern around the game feeling scripted by sharing my opinion that I can understand that statement in the first couple of turns but that the game opens up as you start to build your engine.
13 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patrick G.
United States
Glenshaw
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
Does your religion have lightsabers? Nope? Didn't think so.
badge
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals." Agent K. Oh my what he would think of people had he known about what the internet would become.....
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
The game is a decent game. I don't feel it's as scripted as some people claim.. but if you aren't playing it opportunistically(scripted) you better have a good long term plan.
However, this game is NOT what it was promised to be. It is point salad. It is not 4X. I personally had been excited for this game since I saw the first post about it almost 2 years ago. When I finally got it I was disappointed. I would not have been had the hype not been built up in certain ways.
I give props to the OP for making his statements about. It's good advice to anyone that avidly avoids such mechanics.
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Wood
United States
Davis
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
reverendunclebastard wrote:
shnar wrote:
Craigus69 wrote:
I don't quite get the point of this post.

Um, I think the point of the post was to review the game. I mean, I guess it was posted in the wrong forum? Or do you only want to see positive, glowing reviews?

-shnar


Happy to see positive and negative reviews, but "scripted, didn't like it" is too brief to be of use to anyone.


It told me a lot, being experienced with others that earn that description.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Wood
United States
Davis
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
This thread should go to Reviews
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
Norway
Oslo
Unspecified
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Cinnibar wrote:
This thread should go to Reviews

It's morphed more into a discussion about reviews and expectations now.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Fabrice Dubois
France
La Garenne Colombes
Hauts de Seine
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Mabuchi wrote:
Bold post, but to be honest, I have that feeling from reading the rules as well. Scythe has not seen the table yet, and at this point I do not have any urge to let it either. I am tempted to put on the Jack Vasel auction, see if someone else can enjoy it more.

Every thoughts is respectable and i am always looking for "negative-but-developed" thoughts/reviews (i think that we really need them here).

But saying that the game is bland/uninteresting without having played it....
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Randal Divinski
United States
Natick
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
What seems odd is that the author is familiar enough with BGG to post here, and aware that a lot has been written about Scythe ("hype"), and yet bought the game without reading any of the many reviews and comments that mirror his criticism.

Wouldn't it make more sense to actually read up on the game before buying it? Certainly there are more positive reviews than negative, but there is no excuse for being "surprised" by what the author sees as the game's flaws. It's all been said before.

So, fine if it is not your cup of tea. But the whining about being "tricked" into buying it falls flat. That's what I am not buying.
19 
 Thumb up
0.01
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Greg
United States
Lowell
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
That "Don't drink the kool-aid" bullshit can be said about any game that has sold well.

Not every game is for everyone and that is fine. I mean, I played Twilight Struggle once and didn't see why it was at the top of BGG ranking for so long, but I never considered calling people that liked it "kool-aid drinkers".

Whatever, he didnt like it. Every game is not liked by someone, so no biggie.
20 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jay K
United Kingdom
West Malling
Kent
flag msg tools
designer
Nothing to see here. Please move on
badge
It's about time!
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
I always like to see reviews that critique hyped games, but I am confused! Is this a review or not? It certainly seems to be billed as a review but it comes across more as a moan.

That said, potentially valid points are made. Having played the game a few times, I can see why some people feel it is scripted. Now what we need is examples to back up the argument. For me the review, if it is indeed a review, is too brief and doesn't provide sufficient substance to allow someone on the fence about whether to buy the game, to make a decision either way.

Shame, opportunity missed in my opinion.

And by the way I love the game and all its "mess" of mechanics. I see these as incredibly thematic.
12 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Shawn George
United States
Toledo
Ohio
flag msg tools
"It's all right up to the eyebrows, then it just goes haywire! Look at the eyebrows. These are attack eyebrows. You can take bottle tops off with these!"
badge
Trust your Doctor.
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
JadedGamer wrote:
Cinnibar wrote:
This thread should go to Reviews

It's morphed more into a discussion about reviews and expectations now.


It's a series of reviews on a review.
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Kuhn
United States
Garner
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
reverendunclebastard wrote:
shnar wrote:
Craigus69 wrote:
I don't quite get the point of this post.

Um, I think the point of the post was to review the game. I mean, I guess it was posted in the wrong forum? Or do you only want to see positive, glowing reviews?

-shnar


Happy to see positive and negative reviews, but "scripted, didn't like it" is too brief to be of use to anyone.


I disagree. He said enough about the aspects that drew him into the game, and what he thought was going to appeal to him, but ultimately fell flat.

Skimpy? Yes. Irrelevant? That's a bit of a stretch. Yes, this would have been better left to the comments section of the ratings with a score, but I think bashing him for the post is a little much.

Also, for piling on the guy about not doing research into the game? How much hype about a game does there need to be before you start to feel the pull? There is so much glowing praise for the game floating around that I am sure a lot of folks feel like it's a pretty safe bet. He states that right in the first sentence, as well.

I can sympathize, I feel more or less the same way about this one. Lots of interesting stuff, but not much there. I think the OP could have done himself more favors by fleshing this out (a lot), or relegating it to the comments section.

But I think such data points are useful. Instead, we could try to draw his thoughts out more fully and engage, than just bashing him outright. I dunno, maybe I'm just a little overly sensitive to knee-jerk bashing after this damn election.
14 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Greg
United States
Lowell
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Xookliba wrote:


But I think such data points are useful. Instead, we could try to draw his thoughts out more fully and engage, than just bashing him outright. I dunno, maybe I'm just a little overly sensitive to knee-jerk bashing after this damn election.


Well the OP didn't do himself any favors by suggesting that people liking the game are Kool-Aid drinkers.
24 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Meeple Up
United States
Utah
flag msg tools
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Kelanen wrote:
The biggest issues is if people think it's a 4x - that's the only Kool-Aid being drunk. The designer thinks it's a different take on 4x, the community is mostly of the opinion that's confusing, and it's a 2.5x at best.

The designer seems to be confused about this kind of thing quite often. I remember him trying to call viticulture a legacy game because you could add modules to it...

This causes a disconnect between what someone thinks they are buying and what they actually receive. Ideally, everyone does enough research before buying, but that's not always the case.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonathan Challis
United Kingdom
Inkpen
West Berkshire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
MeepleUp wrote:
Kelanen wrote:
The biggest issues is if people think it's a 4x - that's the only Kool-Aid being drunk. The designer thinks it's a different take on 4x, the community is mostly of the opinion that's confusing, and it's a 2.5x at best.

The designer seems to be confused about this kind of thing quite often. I remember him trying to call viticulture a legacy game because you could add modules to it...

This causes a disconnect between what someone thinks they are buying and what they actually receive. Ideally, everyone does enough research before buying, but that's not always the case.


Agreed. Words have generally understood meanings - when you decide to subvert those meanings as part of a one-person crusade to change/enhance/expand/redefine that meaning, you don't achieve any of that, you just confuse the hell out of people.
10 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
C Bazler
United States
Rochester
New York
flag msg tools
"Come, and trip it as you go..."
badge
"...on the light fantastic toe."
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
JK777 wrote:
I always like to see reviews that critique hyped games, but I am confused! Is this a review or not? It certainly seems to be billed as a review but it comes across more as a moan.

That said, potentially valid points are made. Having played the game a few times, I can see why some people feel it is scripted. Now what we need is examples to back up the argument. For me the review, if it is indeed a review, is too brief and doesn't provide sufficient substance to allow someone on the fence about whether to buy the game, to make a decision either way.

Shame, opportunity missed in my opinion.

And by the way I love the game and all its "mess" of mechanics. I see these as incredibly thematic.


I also love the game, but I do think it is "scripted" in the sense that, by the end of the game, everyone has usually maxed out all but one of their upgrades/techs and so each game feels very similar.

For example, there's not really a "mech strategy," in which you can use all of your resources to go heavy into mechs (which then becomes your dominant path to victory), because you kind of need to do a little of everything. Almost everyone builds all of their mechs by the end of the game: the only difference is the order they do it. So each game feels kind of "samey."

I think expansions could improve this by making specializing more unique (i.e. providing more opportunities to score within each specialization), and then making it more difficult to specialize. This would mean players would be restricted to choosing one scoring path over the others, and would vary the gameplay from game to game.

5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Garth Tams
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
fdubois wrote:


But saying that the game is bland/uninteresting without having played it....


Reading the rules a few times has given me no incentive to play it. Quite the opposite response to games like 18OE, Arkwright, etc, which from reading the rules had me very excited to play it.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Garth Tams
Canada
Edmonton
Alberta
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: The game that offers everything and delivers nothing....
Hahma wrote:
Xookliba wrote:


But I think such data points are useful. Instead, we could try to draw his thoughts out more fully and engage, than just bashing him outright. I dunno, maybe I'm just a little overly sensitive to knee-jerk bashing after this damn election.


Well the OP didn't do himself any favors by suggesting that people liking the game are Kool-Aid drinkers.


I have never heard that expression before. Personally, I enjoy the koolaid.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.