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SeaFall» Forums » Rules

Subject: Is raiding without gaining cargo and enmity broken? rss

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Michael Synodis
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Just played our second game. The prologue ended as I was getting my ship in shape to make money trading, so for the second game I focused solely on victory points. I found the fastest way to get them is to repeatedly raid low difficulty locations and then choose not to take their goods. According to the errata I read, this means I still get a victory point, but no enmity. I reached the victory point goal so fast, two of the four milestone cards went unclaimed and half the players ended up with a good deal less points than me.

Raiding for fast, cheap victory points with no enmity penalty seems broken. But maybe in later games it isn't? What do you guys who have played the game further than me think? My group was thinking of having a house rule that says you gain enmity even if you don't claim a good from a successful raid.
 
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David desJardins
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That's not the intention of the rules and you can't do that.
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AJ Harris
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It IS broken...which is why Rob said it isn't allowed, haha. I'm not sure which errata you are talking about, because the only questions I've read have had to do with "successfully" raiding a province, but not technically having enough successes to plunder anything (due to an upgraded field, etc.).

You, friend, definitely played incorrectly...
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J Kaemmer
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Mad Mage wrote:
Just played our second game. The prologue ended as I was getting my ship in shape to make money trading, so for the second game I focused solely on victory points. I found the fastest way to get them is to repeatedly raid low difficulty locations and then choose not to take their goods. According to the errata I read, this means I still get a victory point, but no enmity. I reached the victory point goal so fast, two of the four milestone cards went unclaimed and half the players ended up with a good deal less points than me.

Raiding for fast, cheap victory points with no enmity penalty seems broken. But maybe in later games it isn't? What do you guys who have played the game further than me think? My group was thinking of having a house rule that says you gain enmity even if you don't claim a good from a successful raid.


Yes there was a thread where JR Honeycutt said that was the correct interpretation of the rules as written, but Rob Daviau later corrected this and said that if you CHOOSE to not take plunder you do not gain any glory.

So if you raided a province but did not have enough successes to raid any locations, you would still gain the glory. However, if you COULD raid something, you are obligated to take the reward, else you forego the Glory!
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David desJardins
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iswearihaveajob wrote:
So if you raided a province but did not have enough successes to raid any locations, you would still gain the glory. However, if you COULD raid something, you are obligated to take the reward, else you forego the Glory!


I doubt it. That seems a baroque interpretation and, as always, we're reading a lot into ambiguous brief comments. You have to wonder why the people who design and publish a game can't just give clear answers to the most frequent questions.
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Frank Pelkofer
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iswearihaveajob wrote:
Mad Mage wrote:
Just played our second game. The prologue ended as I was getting my ship in shape to make money trading, so for the second game I focused solely on victory points. I found the fastest way to get them is to repeatedly raid low difficulty locations and then choose not to take their goods. According to the errata I read, this means I still get a victory point, but no enmity. I reached the victory point goal so fast, two of the four milestone cards went unclaimed and half the players ended up with a good deal less points than me.

Raiding for fast, cheap victory points with no enmity penalty seems broken. But maybe in later games it isn't? What do you guys who have played the game further than me think? My group was thinking of having a house rule that says you gain enmity even if you don't claim a good from a successful raid.


Yes there was a thread where JR Honeycutt said that was the correct interpretation of the rules as written, but Rob Daviau later corrected this and said that if you CHOOSE to not take plunder you do not gain any glory.

So if you raided a province but did not have enough successes to raid any locations, you would still gain the glory. However, if you COULD raid something, you are obligated to take the reward, else you forego the Glory!


I'm pretty sure no one ever said you could raid an island site without leaving enmity. Those rules are separate from the rules for raiding a province. They are clear as written. If you don't sink, and have at least 1 success, you leave an enmity and you plunder something if it's available in the supply.

There was some debate about what happens when you raid a province and don't get enough successes or don't like what you can plunder with the number of successes you have. Rob Daviau recently clarified that you get no glory if you don't leave enmity.
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j n
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Just copying this from the unofficial FAQ (http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1606358/captains-log-unoffic...):

Quote:
------------ Forwarded Message -----------
From: RobDaviau
To: PBrennan
Date: 2016-11-07 07:50:58
Subject: Re:Seafall - Province Raid Question


PBrennan wrote:

If you raid a province and roll just 1 success, but everything on the province board requires 2 successes or more to plunder, what happens? The answer given is that you get 1 glory for a successful raid but don’t get to plunder, therefore no enmity goes out. Correct so far?


Let's say that you gain neither glory nor plunder. That the definition of a successful raid requires plunder. This is a little loophole that I should've found but didn't.


PBrennan wrote:

The further question (to which there seems to be no official answer yet) is, because the province site rules say “after a successful raid, you may plunder one site on the province board”, can you choose not to plunder even if you’ve rolled enough successes to plunder an eligible province site, in order to gain glory without placing enmity?


No! This would create the raid engine you described, which seems unthematic and not fun.
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Michael Synodis
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Thanks for the clarification.
 
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Becq Starforged
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Yeah, Rob over-ruled the previous rules call, as noted above -- basically, plundering is now part of the success criteria for purposes of gaining glory. I added the correction discussed above ... late last week, I think, and the Captain's Log FAQ should be correct now.

I actually kind of liked the idea of "counting coup" for a glory point (which is only slightly better than doing absolutely nothing, after all), but the designer spoke, and the errata reflects that.
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