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BattleLore: Call to Arms» Forums » Rules

Subject: CtA question about Scenario #1 rss

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Chris Perry
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My wife and I played "First Encounter" last night. The rule book suggested to play it in Impromptu mode and the set-up page specified that there was to be no War Council. Fine, we said. We like all aspects of the game, including Historical battles. (Or semi-historical, as the case turns out).

After going through the Impromptu deployment, I had dwarves and she had goblins. Good, I thought. She also had a green-bannered creature, and the only green creature around is the spider (I think). Not so historical, but we like all these units so we were still happy. Still, no War Council and thus no lore... right?

Anyway, as soon as my first unit was webbed I said, "Hey! How on earth can I un-web him if I don't collect lore?" We also realized that there was no game mechanic for collecting lore outside of a War Council.

So, what can I do in this case?

Thanks,

Chris

By the way, she eventually beat me 6-5. :-(
 
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Nick Floyd
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Maybe THIS is the reason I thought that the CtA "A" decks were historical figures only and had no fantasy elements! That's the way they should have been IMO.

I have played BL with my 9 year old using the spider but no Lore Council. We both collected Lore just for the purpose of ordering the spider out of section and freeing guys from the web. I guess that is how I would play it. Funny that it wasn't adressed in the rules. Sometimes I think DoW throws a game together and other times it seems like they playtest and design to a wonderful extreme. That is not the only hole in the CtA rules.
 
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Steve Zamborsky
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I don't know if there's an official rule for this case, but my wife and I ran into the exact same thing playing this scenario. I made up this rule on the spot, and it seemed to work just fine:

"If a unit is caught in a web and is ordered, before it attempts to move (or battle, if not moving), roll one die: if a lore or its banner color is rolled, remove the web token; the unit is no longer caught in a web."

Does anyone know if there's something official to handle this without a war council?

-Z
 
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dave boulton
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how about on any activation of the wbbed unit roll dice for its banner type (possibly with an additonal 1 for cavalry) and any lore symbol rolled means release?
 
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John Earles
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Why not just play with the standard "Lore accumulation" rules?

Every time you roll a Lore symbol in battle you collect a Lore token. You could even add in the end-of-turn Lore Replenishment step (although this may just be overkill as you are not playing Lore cards). You should collect plenty of Lore tokens.

Either that or assume you cannot deploy a Creature in a non-Lore game. After all, Creatures were not introduced into the basic game until you were using the "Single Wizard" War Council setup.
 
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Chris Perry
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Part of the problem of using the regular lore rules is that they are intended to generate enough lore for using lore cards as well as managing creatures. In other words, since we aren't using lore cards, but we're using creatures, we'll be generating a ton of lore to spend on the creature (or, as an opponent, to spend on unwebbing). In other words, it makes the cost of the different powers almost meaningless because you have so much lore at hand that you may as well not even pay a lore cost.
 
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Chad Walton
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I don't think one should field a creature. The card with the creature deployed should be your reserve card.
 
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Eric Hautemont
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In this scenario, if you field the Spider (or another Creature, for that matter), since there are no War Councils, you should only collect Lore tokens when the Creature rolls Lore symbols during her battles. She can then use these Lore symbols to activate her Special Powers, or these Lore symbols can be stashed away in her Master's reserve goblet, for her to be activated out of section (though experience will show you that's usually not a good use of said tokens, when the only source of potential Lore is her battle dice).

As for a unit that is webbed, it frees itself by being ordered and rolling its normal battle dice (ie green 2, blue 3, red 4). if at least one Lore symbol is rolled, the unit is freed and can then move during the movement phase and battle during the battle phase, like an ordered unit that wouldn't have been webbed in the first place.

The nice thing about this is that it also works thematically, in that the stronger a unit, the greater the likelyhood it will free itself up. Finally note that all other Lore rolled by the unit attempting to free itself (if it rolls more than one Lore during its attempt) is not taken into account (and does not generate any tokens).

When playing Creatures in Medieval mode with no War Council, only the Creatures can generate their own Lore. You do not get Lore at the end of the turn, etc...

Hope this helps,

eric @ DoW
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Chris Perry
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These rules do help. Thanks! This addresses all of my concerns, including the one about generating unnecessarily excessive lore.

Best rule suggestion yet. I guess this is why you guys are the designers... :-)
 
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Joachim Pehl
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chrislperry wrote:
These rules do help. Thanks! This addresses all of my concerns, including the one about generating unnecessarily excessive lore.

Best rule suggestion yet. I guess this is why you guys are the designers... :-)

Yup th service from DoW is great.
But the CtA rulebook is really bad, so many open questions, considering creatures gulp
 
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AxonDomini
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Erich wrote:
As for a unit that is webbed, it frees itself by being ordered and rolling its normal battle dice (ie green 2, blue 3, red 4). if at least one Lore symbol is rolled, the unit is freed and can then move during the movement phase and battle during the battle phase, like an ordered unit that wouldn't have been webbed in the first place.

The nice thing about this is that it also works thematically, in that the stronger a unit, the greater the likelyhood it will free itself up. Finally note that all other Lore rolled by the unit attempting to free itself (if it rolls more than one Lore during its attempt) is not taken into account (and does not generate any tokens).

Thanks for the clarification. I do think it's worth noting that this rule effectively make the spider more powerful in non-lore scenarios. In a lore scenario, a player will almost always have a spare lore in their goblet to free their unit, so it's pretty easy to free a unit from the web (assuming you have the proper section card, of course). In a non-lore scenario, you have to hope that you roll at least one lore when you order the unit. In effect, webbing in a non-lore scenario may cause the owner of the webbed unit to waste one or more orders as they try to free their unit, while in a lore scenario there is no such possibility. This makes the spider a much more attractive choice when playing a non-lore CtA game.
 
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G. Uitz
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Erich wrote:
In this scenario, if you field the Spider (or another Creature, for that matter), since there are no War Councils, you should only collect Lore tokens when the Creature rolls Lore symbols during her battles. She can then use these Lore symbols to activate her Special Powers, or these Lore symbols can be stashed away in her Master's reserve goblet, for her to be activated out of section (though experience will show you that's usually not a good use of said tokens, when the only source of potential Lore is her battle dice).

...

When playing Creatures in Medieval mode with no War Council, only the Creatures can generate their own Lore. You do not get Lore at the end of the turn, etc...

Hope this helps,

eric @ DoW

This makes perfect sense for the Spider and the Hill Giant, but will that work for the Earth Elemental, too? It needs lore for every hex moved. In Lore games this means a constant struggle whether to use the collected lore for playing lore cards or moving the Earth Elemental. I only fear that with the suggested method, the EE will be a sitting duck.

Dark.
 
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