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Subject: Trade/Tribal Relations. Yue Jin. Flipped Tokens. Tashi CI rss

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steve jenkins
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When resolving, is a player allowed to improve tribal relations, bring them back to his supply, and then trade those same weapons away?

At what point does Yue Jin have to declare he is using one of his tokens to join the alliance? The card states it is after the alliance space has been chosen. Does this mean directly after the space has been chosen, or at any time after?

When a card refers to "flipped tokens" on the development spaces, does this include an empty space after a token has been moved up? The manual has a graphic showing one of these space is equivalent to a token, but I am unsure.

What is the point in Taisha Ci's power? It seems very weak, when would you ever use it? The only thing I can think of, is to allow you to join the alliance, but since it is only on the round you recruit him... it frankly seems rubbish.
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Neil Helmer
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I'm fairly certain it would be legal to Trade Weapons used first for Tribal Relations, as execution of actions during the Resolution Phase could allow for the weapons to return to the player's supply first.

Yu Jin may spend a token to join the alliance any time during the Conflict phase before placing a General token on the Alliance Action space.

Flipped tokens on a Development Space might better be expressed as Revealed - the space is developed whether the token has been cashed in or still remains above in the Treasury or Granary space.

I do feel Taishi Ci's power is a little underwhelming, but thematically fits his place within the novel's narrative.

Enjoy this amazing game!
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codepeach71 wrote:
When resolving, is a player allowed to improve tribal relations, bring them back to his supply, and then trade those same weapons away?

Yes, this is allowed.

Quoting from "Take Actions" on the bottom left of page 11 of the rules:

If a player has won more than one action space, the player determines the sequence in which these actions are taken.

codepeach71 wrote:
At what point does Yue Jin have to declare he is using one of his tokens to join the alliance? The card states it is after the alliance space has been chosen. Does this mean directly after the space has been chosen, or at any time after?

I believe you are referring to Yu Jin, not Yue Jin (yes, there are two Wei generals with rather similar names). Here is Yu Jin's skill:

Forebearance – At the end of the round when Yu Jin is recruited, place 2 Wei bid tokens on this card. During each Conflict Phase, after the alliance action space has been selected, he may return 1 of these Wei bid tokens to join the alliance.

The decision has to be made immediately after the alliance action space is chosen but before any bidding has taken place.

codepeach71 wrote:
When a card refers to "flipped tokens" on the development spaces, does this include an empty space after a token has been moved up? The manual has a graphic showing one of these space is equivalent to a token, but I am unsure.

No, it does not include an empty space after the marketplace/farm token has been moved to the treasury/granary.

For the record, the generals affected by this are Zhang Zhao (Wu), Zhang Hong (Wu), Ding Feng (Wu) and Zhuge Liang (Shu)

codepeach71 wrote:
What is the point in Taisha Ci's power? It seems very weak, when would you ever use it? The only thing I can think of, is to allow you to join the alliance, but since it is only on the round you recruit him... it frankly seems rubbish.

The skills of generals with administration of 5 or combat of 5 are likely to be weaker than those of other generals, for the sake of balance. I should also point out that Taishi Ci has leadership 2, which makes him very useful for stationing at border locations and for taking the improve tribal relations action.

Taishi Ci's skill comes in useful if you want to get a trained and equipped army unit out really quickly. An example would be combining his use with Ling Cao. Another possibility is towards the late game (say you recruited him in round 9) when you need a trained and equipped army unit out quickly for use in round 10.

Integrity – If Taishi Ci is not assigned during the Conflict Phase of the round when he is recruited, he receives 1 trained army and 1 weapon of his choice at the end of that round.

Naval Mastery – At the end of each round after Ling Cao has been stationed with a naval unit, if Wu did not take the "improve tribal relations action" that round, Wu’s tribal relations level is increased by 1 (or maintained at 12) instead.


Edit: Added leadership 2 of Taishi Ci point.
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Jean-Yves Moyen
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Just to add on Taishi Ci (the rest being already answered with the usual celerity of our beloved designers), I do not feel he is that weak.

Indeed, it's a Combat 5 general and that is already good enough. Remember that a 4 general can be outbid by a single enemy general (hence without any real extra costs for your opponent) while a 5 general requires two generals, a PS, the emperor, Cao Cao's power, or whatever trick you may think of. And thus outbidding a 5 cost something to your opponent. I usually try to get 5's in my initial set of generals just because that's a way to aggressively take a bidding space (or to keep a threat over space where your opponents put a 4). Especially when my opponent are going to have the last bid (and thus, any 4 can be outbid unexpectedly). And conversely, if I have the possibility to outbid with just one general, I usually do it even if the action is not that great but just for the sake of denying it to my opponent. So having a 5 is already good in itself.

Next, he also has a leadership of 2. 5 Combat + 2 leadership means you can put the same computation in battle. He cannot be outbid in battle by just one general (and his troops). You want to win against him, you're going to pay (PS, two generals, emperor, whatever). And of course, the possibility to station 2 armies means you'll get 2VPs each turn. I try to not station armies one by one except in the end game (to trigger the end or steal border victories) or in special cases (Ling Cao, Hao Zhao, Han Dang, …)

Finally, his power is not that bad. Getting 1 trained army immediately is actually great. Plus the weapon to get with. If you get him on turn 1, you're just guaranteed to station somebody on turn 2 without the need to win 3 space (recruit, train, weapon) which are often quite disputed early on. Stationing on turn 2 means getting VPs from turn 2 onward. And of course, the combos with Ling Cao (Tribal relations is not an problem anymore) or Han Dang (launch your economy faster that you'd think possible) among others are cool. Plus having one less general means staying in the alliance longer. The alliance is good. Alternatively, trained army + weapons means you can from turn 2 onward improve you tribal relation for free (without actually spending gold) which is also very good. On first turn, Taishi Ci is often among the top generals I'm going to recruit if playing Wu.

Later on, when you already have some trained armies, his power is not so good indeed. Many generals have powers whose interest changes as the game goes (eg, Ling Cao sucks if drawn on turn 9, Zhao Yun is mostly useful for a surprise game-ending attack and not so good early, …)

And thematically, Taishi Ci's power is one of the best. And thematically, he is indeed 'recruited' very early by Sun Ce and basically disappears from the novel after that…
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Keng Leong Yeo
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Jym77 wrote:
Just to add on Taishi Ci (the rest being already answered with the usual celerity of our beloved designers), I do not feel he is that weak.

Indeed, it's a Combat 5 general and that is already good enough. Remember that a 4 general can be outbid by a single enemy general (hence without any real extra costs for your opponent) while a 5 general requires two generals, a PS, the emperor, Cao Cao's power, or whatever trick you may think of. And thus outbidding a 5 cost something to your opponent. I usually try to get 5's in my initial set of generals just because that's a way to aggressively take a bidding space (or to keep a threat over space where your opponents put a 4). Especially when my opponent are going to have the last bid (and thus, any 4 can be outbid unexpectedly). And conversely, if I have the possibility to outbid with just one general, I usually do it even if the action is not that great but just for the sake of denying it to my opponent. So having a 5 is already good in itself.

Next, he also has a leadership of 2. 5 Combat + 2 leadership means you can put the same computation in battle. He cannot be outbid in battle by just one general (and his troops). You want to win against him, you're going to pay (PS, two generals, emperor, whatever). And of course, the possibility to station 2 armies means you'll get 2VPs each turn. I try to not station armies one by one except in the end game (to trigger the end or steal border victories) or in special cases (Ling Cao, Hao Zhao, Han Dang, …)

Finally, his power is not that bad. Getting 1 trained army immediately is actually great. Plus the weapon to get with. If you get him on turn 1, you're just guaranteed to station somebody on turn 2 without the need to win 3 space (recruit, train, weapon) which are often quite disputed early on. Stationing on turn 2 means getting VPs from turn 2 onward. And of course, the combos with Ling Cao (Tribal relations is not an problem anymore) or Han Dang (launch your economy faster that you'd think possible) among others are cool. Plus having one less general means staying in the alliance longer. The alliance is good. Alternatively, trained army + weapons means you can from turn 2 onward improve you tribal relation for free (without actually spending gold) which is also very good. On first turn, Taishi Ci is often among the top generals I'm going to recruit if playing Wu.

Later on, when you already have some trained armies, his power is not so good indeed. Many generals have powers whose interest changes as the game goes (eg, Ling Cao sucks if drawn on turn 9, Zhao Yun is mostly useful for a surprise game-ending attack and not so good early, …)

And thematically, Taishi Ci's power is one of the best. And thematically, he is indeed 'recruited' very early by Sun Ce and basically disappears from the novel after that…

Both designers salute this analysis. meeple Probably Taishi Ci does so too!

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steve jenkins
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I agree entirely about a general with 5 admin/combat being much more powerful than a 4. In regards to them having weaker powers, I think the following generals with 5 points might have something to say about that! (paraphrased for brevity)

Cao Cao - Wins ties.

Dong Yun - When Dong Yun takes the trade action, he may pay 1 popular support to harvest and collect tax

Huang Zong - When Huang Zong is stationed with archers, he may station a third archer

Zhuge Liang - When developing farm/marketplace gain 2 rice/gold if there are less than 2 tokens after taking the action.

Sima Yi - Draws both a Separation + Unification card when importing technology

Plus many others I haven't mentioned. I am only a dozen or so games in, so I might be overstating these powers somewhat. I probably have underestimated Taishi Ci's power as well. I considered it slightly useful if you wanted to sneak into the alliance, but did not consider the speed at which you have an army ready to go. That being said - stationing 1 army on turn 2 does provide a nice flow of points, but without a relevant power (Hao Zhao, Ling Cao, Han Dang...), it will quickly be eclipsed by 2 armies stationed on turn 3/4, and still leaves you without a general.

It seems there is an absolute wealth of knowledge about the game out there, it's a shame it's not all collected in one place. I would especially like to hear peoples thoughts on the differences between states. What they excel at compared to others, and where they are not as strong.

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Keng Leong Yeo
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codepeach71 wrote:
I am only a dozen or so games in, ...

We are always happy to find out that our game is getting multiple plays! meeple

codepeach71 wrote:
It seems there is an absolute wealth of knowledge about the game out there, it's a shame it's not all collected in one place. I would especially like to hear peoples thoughts on the differences between states. What they excel at compared to others, and where they are not as strong.

I have been maintaining a thread that collates most of the Three Kingdoms Redux related material we know exists (most of it is produced by us ). Here is the link to the thread:

Collation of Three Kingdoms Redux material

You will find lots of background information on the game and era it is based on, our designing and publishing journey, game reviews and such there.

There hasn't been much discussion about the differences between the states though.
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Jean-Yves Moyen
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Concerning the power of some of the 5's you quoted:
* Cao Cao: may well be the best general in the game (well, maybe Huang Gai is better).
* Dong Yun: 1PS is 1 action, so it's storing one action early to use it later. Plus Trade is not a very good action and you don't do it that often.
* Huang Zhong: also very powerful. Requires a bit of preparation to work, but indeed a very good general. Shu generals tend to be better than other imho. Still, he can also be useless if drawn late…
* Zhuge Liang: he's Zhuge Liang, he's suppose to be good But actually his power requires you to collect/harvest after two develops and thus prevents a developing rush… (you're spending 1/3 develop actions to collect, instead of the minimal 1/5)
* Sima Yi: unless you also have a way to build a lot of SE (Hao Zhao), you're not going to need that much. It's cool to remove the choice of deck, and to have more choice of SE to build, but you'll end up with some SE in your hand in the end of the game anyway. Of course, Sima Yi + Hao Zhao on turn 1 is a crazy combo. But is it really better than, say, Taishi Ci + Ling Cao?

Then, of course, yes, all generals are not as good, and not at the same point in the game, and a big part of the game is to decide who to recruit depending on the combos you'll be able to build. As I said, Taishi Ci is probably not somebody I'll recruit on turn 5 or 9 (unless I really need that last trained army), but he is among the top choices on turn 1. Same goes with Sima Yi, while Zhuge Liang can be good at any point in the game… Huang Zhong also requires a bit of building and can just be useless on turn 9 (if all your archery locations are already taken) or even on turn 5 (if you don't have crossbow and thus will give time to your opponents to steal the last archery spots).

And of course, we all have different way of playing each country, and thus different favourite generals. So, I'll certainly won't "blame" you for not liking Taishi Ci…

codepeach71 wrote:
That being said - stationing 1 army on turn 2 does provide a nice flow of points, but without a relevant power (Hao Zhao, Ling Cao, Han Dang...), it will quickly be eclipsed by 2 armies stationed on turn 3/4, and still leaves you without a general.

True, of course, but Taishi Ci does not prevents you from also stationing on turn 3 or 4. And Wu, depending on its draw, can have a very good economy without problem (Han Dang, Zhou Yu). Station 3 armies by turn 3 and you'll see your opponents becoming crazy trying to station troops before being prepared…

I tend to see beginners waiting a long time before stationing troops (ie building economy first). Well, with 12 games you're not a beginner anymore. But it is certainly possible, especially with Wu, to rush the borders first and try and prevent the economy from crumbling next. And it is fun to see your opponents trying to figure out how to block your VP machine so early.

Quote:
It seems there is an absolute wealth of knowledge about the game out there, it's a shame it's not all collected in one place. I would especially like to hear peoples thoughts on the differences between states. What they excel at compared to others, and where they are not as strong.

Yes, as any deep games, the strategies are many and I certainly do not claim to have found all of them (I still suck at playing Shu, for some reasons). And obviously, writing a full compendium of strategical advice is a monumental task… So that's probably why nobody had time to do it yet.
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steve jenkins
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Yeoster wrote:
We are always happy to find out that our game is getting multiple plays

You will be pleased to know it is a staple at our table then. If there are 3 players present, it will be 3 kingdoms, no competition.

Yeoster wrote:
I have been maintaining a thread that collates most of the Three Kingdoms Redux related material we know exists (most of it is produced by us )

Thanks. But I was particularly interested in strategy. Being involved in game balance, you must know a few tricks!

Jym77 wrote:
Concerning the power of some of the 5's you quoted

Dong Yun: There are many other ways to get popular support. I like his power, because the domestic development spaces are quite heavily contested in our games. The times you manage to win one, could be used to put you further ahead in that scoring category instead of harvesting/tax. Even assuming you did spend an action to recieve a popular support, that's 3 actions for the price of 2 (Trade + Harvest + Collect Tax) without "wasting" a (rather expensive) development spot.

I'm surprised you say trade isn't a very good action. Trading & Selling weapons is the primary source of income when we play. Often it's contested because there is a player who requires it in order to pay upkeep. -3vp per is very harsh

Zhuge Liang: If he comes out early on I find him very useful. +8 resources at the start can save you an action or 2. I often see the first tax/harvest at around 2-3, as that's when armies begin to get stationed, and upkeep is required.

Sima Yi: I brought Sima up because he has very nice stats. I think I like him especially, as I like fishing through the separation deck, even though often you won't be able to build what you pull. With Hao Zhao though, yes, he is fantastic.

Like you said though, it all depends on when they are drawn, and what else is going on the game.

Jym77 wrote:
True, of course, but Taishi Ci does not prevents you from also stationing on turn 3 or 4

You are down a general doing this. You might have 3 stationed by turn 3, but they have 4 by 5. Roughly balances out in points depending on length, and you lost a couple of general actions having stationed earlier.

If you recieved Taishi Ci during the first draft, without Ling Cao, Han Dang or similar, would you still consider him a top choice?


Jym77 wrote:
I still suck at playing Shu
Wu is my kryptonite. I feel like I am constantly getting outbid because I never seem to draw enough 5's. Also don't care much for Sun Jians power. Especially compared to Cao Cao. I very much agree with you regarding Cao Cao/Huang Gai being 2 of the best. Huang Gai is often a perfect answer to Cao Cao.



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codepeach71 wrote:
Yeoster wrote:
We are always happy to find out that our game is getting multiple plays

You will be pleased to know it is a staple at our table then. If there are 3 players present, it will be 3 kingdoms, no competition.

Game ratings, especially those coupled with comments, and feedback such as this always makes our day. Thanks... cry
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Jean-Yves Moyen
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Interesting how we do have such opposed views on some points… Thanks for the discussion.

Concerning Trade, I do say it's not such a good action because it's basically something we'll do once or twice each game but that's all. Yes, trading 6 weapons for 8 golds and 8 rices (iirc) is a great way of having resources, but you don't need to do that every single turn. So in my games, I do not see a heavy contest on Trade, and I do not see players doing it that much. That's why I tend to consider Dong Yun as not so good. At most, I'm going to use his power twice. And if I start to Trade a lot, I'm probably not going to need to Collect that much (since I usually Trade to generate resources). As for as "collect while doing something else" is concerned, I much prefer Cao Hong (iirc) who Collect when Controlling the emperor.

Concerning Taishi Ci, yes, I'll probably pick him on turn 1 even without the obvious combos. As you say, you don't draw enough 5's with Wu, here's one Of course, this depends on my other draws (Huang Gai + Zhuge Jin + Sun Ce would be better, typically…) Wu wants to station on turn 2, more than the other players, just for the sake of staying in the alliance on turns 4-5…

Concerning playing Wu, I'm obviously in a different situation than you as I do consider that I know sufficiently well how to play it that I'd now rather play another country just for the change…
Wu is an extremely strong military power for some obvious and some less obvious reasons (did you notice that both its doubled border locations (ship and crossbow) are produced on the same space while the others share two horse locations?) I tend to play it very agressivly, maybe trying to rush the end before round 9. It does require a bit of negotiation with Shu for the alliance action (and obviously Zhuge Jin is extremely good). And yes, Sun Jian basically has a crappy power. Station him early (historically, he dies even before Shu exists…) but not too early (as he's still a 5 Combat and you need that).
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Hugues Richard
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There's a price to pay for total military synergie and whether Taishi Ci pays too much entirely depends on the set-up. Unlike Xiahou Dun who conditionally trade his second weapon to train an army but doesn't give you anything more for doing it, Taishi Ci gives you an edge unconditionally. Saying that he's great since he wins you 3 synergistic half actions though is also ignoring the environment, the fact that you don't compete to deny someone something either and Xiahou Dun's pretty bad to begin with.

See, recruiting generals like Gu Yong, Jiang Qin or Sun Ce, not recruiting Han Dang or Ling Cao and constructing the Barter market, Hereditary army system, Weapon trading post or Training ground will proportionally diminish the value of Taishi Ci and his light always seems very dim when Jiang Wan is around. But how good is Zhou Yu without Sun Quan or Lu Meng, Sima Yi without Hao Zhao or Xun You and Liu Ye?

So, Taishi Ci doesn't strike me as a must have guy but when you compare him to other 5-2s, only Sun Ce is better... and most Shu generals if they can win an action space. Ci Would have been a strong contender if not for a slight typo in his skill:

Integrity – If Taishi Ci's not assigned during the Conflict Phase of the round when he is recruited, he receives 1 trained army and 1 weapon of his choice at the end of that round phase. He was gone for a day, not 5 years...

Anyway, every time I read some like "this dude ain't good", my short answer is always "but he doesn't blow like Xu Huang" for whom I petition to either be War 5 or have a horn, a blowpipe, a kazoo or some kind of wind instrument instead of an axe in second edition.

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Hugues Richard
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Jym77 wrote:
Wu is an extremely strong military power for some obvious and some less obvious reasons (did you notice that both its doubled border locations (ship and crossbow) are produced on the same space while the others share two horse locations?)

Can you please enlighten me as to why having double border locations weapon types produced on the same space is good for Wu? IMO, it's quite the opposite since it makes that weapon space a must win action space for Wu and easily jerked by Wei having first bid.
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Yeoster wrote:
I believe you are referring to Yu Jin, not Yue Jin (yes, there are two Wei generals with rather similar names). Here is Yu Jin's skill:

Forebearance – At the end of the round when Yu Jin is recruited, place 2 Wei bid tokens on this card. During each Conflict Phase, after the alliance action space has been selected, he may return 1 of these Wei bid tokens to join the alliance.

The decision has to be made immediately after the alliance action space is chosen but before any bidding has taken place.


Thx for the clarification Yeo but if he makes the decision immediately before any bidding, does he also move immediately, being the first on the alliance space? And if so, does it start the bidding phase or is it still before the bidding phase? I'm asking because if this doesn't start the bidding phase, Wei could be forced to play 2 generals in a row meaning that Yu Jin's skill denies Wei of slow playing Cao Cao that turn.
Reading Yu Jin textually makes me believe he moves when discarding, rather or not this starts the bidding phase, but the compendium makes me doubt a lil'. It says "All 3 states may take the alliance action as long as each state assigns 1 general to the action space." It could have been written "All 3 states may take the alliance action as long as Wu and Shu assign 1 general each to the action space" instead so there's no implying possibility that Wei could discard a Jin token but not join the alliance later.
I'm actually confused between those 3 possibilities.
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Oninohugo wrote:
Thx for the clarification Yeo but if he makes the decision immediately before any bidding, does he also move immediately, being the first on the alliance space? And if so, does it start the bidding phase or is it still before the bidding phase? I'm asking because if this doesn't start the bidding phase, Wei could be forced to play 2 generals in a row meaning that Yu Jin's skill denies Wei of slow playing Cao Cao that turn.
Reading Yu Jin textually makes me believe he moves when discarding, rather or not this starts the bidding phase, but the compendium makes me doubt a lil'. It says "All 3 states may take the alliance action as long as each state assigns 1 general to the action space." It could have been written "All 3 states may take the alliance action as long as Wu and Shu assign 1 general each to the action space" instead so there's no implying possibility that Wei could discard a Jin token but not join the alliance later.
I'm actually confused between those 3 possibilities.

With regards to Yu Jin's skill, here is what happens in the round in chronological order:

1) At the start of the round, the two allianced states, Wu and Shu, discusses and decides on the alliance action space. The alliance token is placed on the chosen action space.

2) The Wei player, if he still has bid tokens on Yu Jin's general card, has to decide immediately if he wants to join the alliance. If he/she does, discard one of the Wei bid tokens on Yu Jin's general card.

3a) If the Wei player decides not to join the alliance, bidding starts and continues as per normal.

3b) If the Wei player decides to join the alliance, bidding starts and the alliance action space is now an open action space to all three players.

Yu Jin does not have to be placed on the alliance action space. Activation of Yu Jin's skill also does not make Wei place any general out of turn. Bidding order remains the same and bidding continues as per normal; the only change in that round is the alliance action space is now an open action space to all three players.
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Jean-Yves Moyen
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Oninohugo wrote:
Jym77 wrote:
Wu is an extremely strong military power for some obvious and some less obvious reasons (did you notice that both its doubled border locations (ship and crossbow) are produced on the same space while the others share two horse locations?)

Can you please enlighten me as to why having double border locations weapon types produced on the same space is good for Wu? IMO, it's quite the opposite since it makes that weapon space a must win action space for Wu and easily jerked by Wei having first bid.

It simplifies weapons management. You only need to store 2 kind of weapons and you can go all the game (depending on what happen, obviously) while other states need to get more balance between the 4 kinds of weapons.

And of course, you still have 4 locations with the other weapons, so if Wei tries too hard to steal the vessel/crossbow action every turn, you can still use the other one.

Well, obviously, our mileages do vary (always the sign of a deep game when several experienced players have different strategical views). In my case, I feel that when I'm playing Wu the weapon management part of the game is simplified and I have to think less about it.
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Hugues Richard
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Yeoster wrote:
3b) If the Wei player decides to join the alliance, bidding starts and the alliance action space is now an open action space to all three players.
Yu Jin does not have to be placed on the alliance action space.

An open action space! So you can discard the token and place Yang Xiu or Liu Ye on the alliance space? Oooohhh! He's so much better, actually using everyone around him. How fitting for Yu Jin! Glad we didn't play him wrong though not to his full potential yet. This could be made clearer in future printing or am I the only one assuming he’s the one and only to ally reading the card? Just like you said it or "Wei can join the alliance" would leave no doubt. my bad also for missing that Yu Jin thread 2 years ago.

Jym77 wrote:
Well, obviously, our mileages do vary (always the sign of a deep game when several experienced players have different strategical views). In my case, I feel that when I'm playing Wu the weapon management part of the game is simplified and I have to think less about it.

If Wu would have been the least warmongering faction, having 6-4 borders instead of 5-5 could be detrimental. As things are, having a Warlord, double weapon spaces (producing/trading) and an easier time conquering early with supporting Zhou Yu, Han Dang or Lu Fan, I concur to your point of view: a subtle positive indeed.
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Oninohugo wrote:

An open action space! So you can discard the token and place Yang Xiu or Liu Ye on the alliance space? Oooohhh! He's so much better, actually using everyone around him. How fitting for Yu Jin! Glad we didn't play him wrong though not to his full potential yet. This could be made clearer in future printing or am I the only one assuming he’s the one and only to ally reading the card? Just like you said it or "Wei can join the alliance" would leave no doubt. my bad also for missing that Yu Jin thread 2 years ago.

We have added this clarification within the compendium, which will be included in the second edition. Thank you for highlighting this point.
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