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Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: Shadows of the Past» Forums » Rules

Subject: Moving onto/through cars rss

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Victor The Geek
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Maybe I missed this somewhere in the rules, but I'm wondering how moving onto and through cars works. Most of my confusion is whether or not the car is considered a single space. Here are some possible ways of viewing the movement.


Example 1 - Car is 2 spaces
1) It costs 2 movement to move onto the car because it's a yellow "slow" terrain.
2) It costs 2 movement to move into the second car space because it's another yellow "slow" terrain.
3) It costs 1 movement to move off the car.




Example 2 - Car is 2 spaces
1) It costs 2 movement to move onto the car because it's a yellow "slow" terrain.
2) It costs 1 movement to move into the second car space but since the turtle is already on the car, it's easier to move along the car.
3) It costs 1 movement to move off the car.




Example 3 - Car is 1 space
1) It costs 2 movement to move onto the car because it's a yellow "slow" terrain.
2) It costs 1 movement to move off the car.



My thought is that it works like example 3, but that doesn't make sense since it should take more effort to move over a car. If the car wasn't there, the turtle would still spend 3 movement. So does movement actually work like example 1? If so, the car token should have a dashed/dotted line splitting the car into 2 spaces.
 
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John Troutman
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I've been playing it like Example 2, for what it's worth. But that's not an official ruling.
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Matthew Cary
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In another thread someone asked this about Fire Escapes & Kevin stated that they were two spaces, both of which had yellow borders, so moving from one end of a fire escape to the other costs two movement.

By that logic, I'm fairly sure that example 1 is correct.

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Donn Hardy
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Imagine that the first slow movement is getting up onto the car. The second slow movement is getting over the hump between the hood and the trunk.
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Victor The Geek
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Jhamin wrote:
In another thread someone asked this about Fire Escapes & Kevin stated that they were two spaces, both of which had yellow borders, so moving from one end of a fire escape to the other costs two movement.

By that logic, I'm fairly sure that example 1 is correct.



Can you link to the post that states this? I've searched the BGG forums and I can't seem to find the thread.
 
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Scott Miller
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Example 1 makes the most sense in terms of vehicles. Cars are not sturdy platforms to walk on; the metal is curved, slippery, and in some spots flexible. Just because you're already on one doesn't suddenly make it easy to walk.
 
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Paul H
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We have been ruling to use Example 2 in our games as the border is defined. I would be willing to recalibrate for Example 1 as well.
 
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Matthew Cary
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VictorTheGeek wrote:

Can you link to the post that states this? I've searched the BGG forums and I can't seem to find the thread.


It looks like it wasn't from the BGG forum, it is from the semi-official facebook group:




https://www.facebook.com/groups/TMNTShadowsOfThePast/search/...
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Matthew Cary
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Rraahk wrote:
We have been ruling to use Example 2 in our games as the border is defined. I would be willing to recalibrate for Example 1 as well.


I've heard a number of anecdotal accounts of people who feel the game is really unbalanced because characters run all over the place and it is too hard to stop anyone from running up to the boss and KOing them, or to stop targets from getting away.

It seems like the intended rules make movement a lot stickier. As this is what the designer is saying, I'm betting the scenarios are balanced around it.
 
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Victor The Geek
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Jhamin wrote:
VictorTheGeek wrote:

Can you link to the post that states this? I've searched the BGG forums and I can't seem to find the thread.


It looks like it wasn't from the BGG forum, it is from the semi-official facebook group:




https://www.facebook.com/groups/TMNTShadowsOfThePast/search/...


Thanks for the info! Exactly what I was looking for.
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Scott Miller
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Jhamin wrote:
It seems like the intended rules make movement a lot stickier. As this is what the designer is saying, I'm betting the scenarios are balanced around it.

Indeed. It seems that most of the complaints have involved forgotten/misunderstood rules, poor strategies, occasionally luck, and/or KS-exclusive scenarios which may not have had quite as rigorous playtesting. The base scenarios tend to make heavy use of terrain, probably for this very reason. (The only battle I've seen that does truly seem unbalanced is the final battle in Rooftop Rush, but that may have been intended for Ultimate Shredder.)

It's also a major factor in having only two map tiles per battle -- it takes quite a while to make it all the way across them if terrain and breakaway rules are employed correctly.
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AGN1964 AGN1964
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We played (1). I would also like to see the official ruling, as there is clearly disagreement.
 
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Donn Hardy
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AGN1964 wrote:
We played (1). I would also like to see the official ruling, as there is clearly disagreement.


Um. What is more official than a ruling from Kevin Wilson?
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I wish the boards were made like this too. The 90 yellow squares together detracts from the board artwork and makes it hard to focus on the board. One yellow outline around all the squares that are in the difficult terrain would have been sufficient. Imperial assault is a good example of this.
 
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Ed K
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Just played thru the first scenario and was concerned about the car terrain, but upon close inspection of the tiles and the game board for other "yellow" bordered things, I agree with example 2.

The cars should cost 2 (1 move +1 slow penalty) to jump on, and only 1 to move along, and 1 to jump off of. The car has a yellow border around the whole thing but no line between the 2 spaces (exactly like fire escapes) as opposed to stairs having yellow around each square that would make them 2 each to move down or up.
 
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Kevin Wilson
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Example 1 is correct, sorry Ed. The dividing line on the token was just left off by the graphic designer for aesthetics, I'd guess, but both spaces of the cars are slow terrain, and there's no discount for moving from 1 space of slow terrain to another space of slow terrain.

Usually, if you always treat each individual space on the board as separate, you won't go wrong.
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Ed K
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OK, thanks. That's another bad production error! I had a long rant about all of the production errors, but I vented it to myself. Still like the game, but, WOW!!
 
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Lokke Thundrir
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Guys, a little off topic: has anyone replaced the board cars with miniature ones? I'd like to buy some proper car models and paint them, but don't know what scale I'd look for. Does anybody have an idea?
 
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Donn Hardy
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payday4ray wrote:
Guys, a little off topic: has anyone replaced the board cars with miniature ones? I'd like to buy some proper car models and paint them, but don't know what scale I'd look for. Does anybody have an idea?


My main concern would be that the minis have to stand on them. I'm not sure how many car models would support that easily.
 
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Scott Miller
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donnbobhardy wrote:
My main concern would be that the minis have to stand on them. I'm not sure how many car models would support that easily.

I've had the same thought. Thing is, I've always thought cars should be unstable terrain rather than slow terrain. Granted, I'm not a ninja, but I can't imagine trying to fight from on top of a car. They're slick and unstable. Whereas Luke Duke didn't slow down any getting to the other side of the General Lee.



And if they were unstable terrain, the ability for a model to support a miniature would be irrelevant (well, except for Mikey).
 
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Lokke Thundrir
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PRSthruVOX wrote:
donnbobhardy wrote:
My main concern would be that the minis have to stand on them. I'm not sure how many car models would support that easily.

I've had the same thought. Thing is, I've always thought cars should be unstable terrain rather than slow terrain. Granted, I'm not a ninja, but I can't imagine trying to fight from on top of a car. They're slick and unstable. Whereas Luke Duke didn't slow down any getting to the other side of the General Lee.
And if they were unstable terrain, the ability for a model to support a miniature would be irrelevant (well, except for Mikey).

That shouldn't be too much of a trouble, as long as the cars have pretty flat roof. Anyways, it seems cars with 1/72 scale should work pretty well, being around 5cm long.
 
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Scott Miller
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payday4ray wrote:
That shouldn't be too much of a trouble, as long as the cars have pretty flat roof.

I guess you've had different experiences than I have. My experience is that the roof doesn't support weight very well at all, the trunk is too small and the hood is too slick and usually curved. I've never been able to do more than stand still on a car. There's a reason they make truck beds the way they do.
 
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