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Arkham Horror: The Card Game» Forums » General

Subject: Where's the rest of the box? rss

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dark angel
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I'm sure someone else must have noted this gripe already but I will moan nevertheless. Why is the box so small. Experience of Lord if the Rings tells me that it is a challenge to house the coming storm of purchases so why has FFG shrunk the LCG box for Arkham? If they think it will turn the screwv to make me buy two cores they were wrong
 
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Scourn1
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You want a bigger box for more unused space?

40k debuted the smaller LCG box.

They realized you can put everything you need in a smaller box. Save space means they can store more, which means more sales. Its also a nice move for your FLGS as their space is usually highly more limited.

Don't understand how smaller box = they want you to buy more cores?
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Claude Hemberger
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Size of the box has a huge impact on the costs. Because if you can double the amount of games per pallet, you divide the shipping costs by 2.
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mathew rynich
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I think it has a lot to do with shelf space. These games take up a lot of real estate in retail shelves. I've heard that as a concern before from retailers. It's possible the new box size was meant to help out in that regard. Also they fit pretty much the same amount of stuff in the smaller boxes so it probably was a good decision. It does make it harder to use a core box as a storage device for the game though. In fact with just two cores that box is already packed so I'm currently considering what I'm gonna do for long term storage.
 
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Dreux Barbier
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I'd personally like it in a long card box, with extra space for the expansions, because they always end up in one of those boxes anyway. I guess the shelf presence wouldn't be as good that way though.
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John Zoidberg
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FFG know this game is dying so there was no need to use a bigger box.
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G N
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MOTUX wrote:
FFG know this game is dying so there was no need to use a bigger box.


It should probably have come in a coffin shape box.

I think this is the same size box as Warhammer Quest card game was too.
 
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Rob Rob
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Shelf space yes. Of course it means you're out of storage space within the first couple of expansions. I find it odd FFG doesn't take advantage of the sales opportunity in officially licensed oversized boxes, e.g. Smash Up: The Big Geeky Box, etc...
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Joe Robertson
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I also do not like the size of the box. Its pretty much useless to store cards in because it is not deep enough to lay them on their side. No insert can really help that either.
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Rosen Crantz
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agreed. I actually use the LotR LCG core boxes to store my cards. I wish the Arkham core box was the same size... Oh well. Hobby lobby artist case it is...
 
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Donny Behne
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FFG takes up absurd amounts of shelf space in game stores. They know every new SKU is a new box and pushes something else out. By making the box smaller, it encourages stores to keep their products on the shelf longer. Less waste is also good.
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Mihnea Cateanu
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phillosmaster wrote:
I think it has a lot to do with shelf space. These games take up a lot of real estate in retail shelves. I've heard that as a concern before from retailers. It's possible the new box size was meant to help out in that regard. Also they fit pretty much the same amount of stuff in the smaller boxes so it probably was a good decision. It does make it harder to use a core box as a storage device for the game though. In fact with just two cores that box is already packed so I'm currently considering what I'm gonna do for long term storage.



I don`t get this about shelf space. A lot of games come in boxes much, much bigger than needed, presumably so they are more visible to the customers. Now FFG goes to the opposite extreme, making it ridiculously small given the amount of content that will follow. Surely just another 3-4 centimeters of depth needed to store the cards upright (I actually measured) would not have been an insurmountable problem for shelving it right? To me this box is simply a bad design choice.

While we`re at it, if they absolutely cannot fit a cloth bag without afecting the profit margin just increase the MSRP by 2-3$ (it`s not like this game is very cheap to begin with)...but give us a bag. Sure, you can sell us a big velvet bag with eldritch art for 20$ afterwards, but give me a simple black bag in the box.

Otherwise, great production (and game) thumbsup

/edit: actually my point about boxes full of air reminded of one of the worst offenders that I have (Deus)...I think I`ll switch the boxes around for the 2 games
 
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Hedyn Brand
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I love these boxes. It means ordering from abroad moves one or two shipping classes down from many stores, making it cheaper for me.
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Drew
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It is funny that many products have overly large boxes simply to convince consumers they are getting something big, usually these boxes are not meant for storage and are thrown away after purchase.

But us gamers really demand much from our boxes. We want them to look nice, fit well on a typical Ikea shelf, handle expansions, help organize, fit sleeved cards, and fit any extra pimping components.

The new smaller FFG box is useless. If the desire is to save on shipping then put it in a box just big enough to fit the cards. Dump the tokens for dice. Publish the rules online as living rules without separate FAQs.

Or make core and deluxe boxes more like card boxes and big enough to hold a whole cycle unsleeved. Sell that as a feature.
 
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mathew rynich
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mihnea_1309 wrote:
phillosmaster wrote:
I think it has a lot to do with shelf space. These games take up a lot of real estate in retail shelves. I've heard that as a concern before from retailers. It's possible the new box size was meant to help out in that regard. Also they fit pretty much the same amount of stuff in the smaller boxes so it probably was a good decision. It does make it harder to use a core box as a storage device for the game though. In fact with just two cores that box is already packed so I'm currently considering what I'm gonna do for long term storage.



I don`t get this about shelf space. A lot of games come in boxes much, much bigger than needed, presumably so they are more visible to the customers. Now FFG goes to the opposite extreme, making it ridiculously small given the amount of content that will follow. Surely just another 3-4 centimeters of depth needed to store the cards upright (I actually measured) would not have been an insurmountable problem for shelving it right? To me this box is simply a bad design choice.

While we`re at it, if they absolutely cannot fit a cloth bag without afecting the profit margin just increase the MSRP by 2-3$ (it`s not like this game is very cheap to begin with)...but give us a bag. Sure, you can sell us a big velvet bag with eldritch art for 20$ afterwards, but give me a simple black bag in the box.

Otherwise, great production (and game) thumbsup

/edit: actually my point about boxes full of air reminded of one of the worst offenders that I have (Deus)...I think I`ll switch the boxes around for the 2 games


Because a retailer needs to devote an entire rack to just LCGs. That's different than a little bit of shelf space for Caverna or Five Tribes. It very much has to do with LCGs monopolizing shelf space. Not just this one game box taking up too much space.

I think it was a fine choice considering most players eventually move to another storage device be it binders, card boxes or whatever. The core set box will always eventually become too small for your collection.
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Drew
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phillosmaster wrote:
Because a retailer needs to devote an entire rack to just LCGs. That's different than a little bit of shelf space for Caverna or Five Tribes. It very much has to do with LCGs monopolizing shelf space. Not just this one game box taking up too much space.


My experience with retailers in my area is that no one really carries LCGs. One carries only the most recent competitive decks but does not stack any of the older catalog. The attitude was they only stock what sells and the PvP LCGs have a following that will always buy the most recent deck. It was worth it to buy each new release but not to restock when they ran out. LOTR LCG players buy things when they feel like it. While many people bought the core and first cycle, most players play at their own pace and sales are really spread out over time.

If you want to start an older LCG around here either you need to special order or hit one of the big OLGS. I even had to special order to get AH LCG to a LGS after my Amazon pre-order was delayed to 2017.

Point is the LCG model probably is sold more via OLGS stores than retail walk ins.

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chemberger wrote:
Size of the box has a huge impact on the costs. Because if you can double the amount of games per pallet, you divide the shipping costs by 2.


Also, unlike at the FLGS, the size of the box doesn't influence your OLGS (including Amazon!) purchase. FFG, who has been selling games through Amazon before the Asmodee purchase, probably knows this. RGG also sold their Dominion upgrade kits and Base Game cards with minimal packaging.

Another possibility is that most buyers of the AHC won't buy expansions, so will not need more storage space. Or the expansion "big boxes" will have enough space to store the "small box" expansions, so you don't need the core box to store all the cards -- no point storing two storylines in the same box unless you enjoy lifting heavy things.
 
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Fred Jandt
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It's not the small size of the box to me that is an issue, it's the useless space inside. The insert is a waste. It is almost as if they chose the box size based on the size of the token sheets.

I would much rather prefer an even smaller box and them selling an alternate storage mechanism separately.

Look at the latest Red Dragon Inn kickstarter. They are offering a "green" version that is essentially boxless since they know folks already have a big storage box they sell.
 
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mathew rynich
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I do believe the minimum box size is dictated by the token sheet, which is a production hang up on the printing side I'm sure. Otherwise they probably would have made the box even smaller. Destiny starter boxes have a smaller box size, but also contain only a few tokens per starter so there is a very small token sheet in there.
 
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Donny Behne
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mihnea_1309 wrote:
I don`t get this about shelf space. A lot of games come in boxes much, much bigger than needed, presumably so they are more visible to the customers.


Those games are usually from companies with two or three titles on shelves at a time. FFG has dozens of titles. They want those titles to stay there AND be rebought by a store when they run out (rather than have that gap replaced by more of a game already out or, even worse, replaced by a game from another publisher).

Size of box, for most, has to do with the cost of the game. A game like Splendor runs $40. The box is sized for a $40 game even though the components take up significantly less space than the box. It's about shelf presence. For a company like FFG that's fighting to keep tons of games on the shelf, it's about preserving that space and making retailer-friendly boxes.
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Mihnea Cateanu
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kelann08 wrote:
mihnea_1309 wrote:
I don`t get this about shelf space. A lot of games come in boxes much, much bigger than needed, presumably so they are more visible to the customers.


Those games are usually from companies with two or three titles on shelves at a time. FFG has dozens of titles. They want those titles to stay there AND be rebought by a store when they run out (rather than have that gap replaced by more of a game already out or, even worse, replaced by a game from another publisher).

Size of box, for most, has to do with the cost of the game. A game like Splendor runs $40. The box is sized for a $40 game even though the components take up significantly less space than the box. It's about shelf presence. For a company like FFG that's fighting to keep tons of games on the shelf, it's about preserving that space and making retailer-friendly boxes.


Now that you put it that way, it does make more sense. Thanks for the info.
 
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Kevin
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The answer to 99 questions out of a hundred is ............ money.

Fact of life.

Why do drug companies research drugs? Why do people train to be lawyers?
Why do FFG sell you an incomplete set of card? Why do they not provide a chaos bag. Why the small useless box? I doubt very much the small box size was chosen by FFG, as an act of benevolence to Retail Shops and their limited shelf space as some have suggested.

I mean if that was the case then they could have put it into an even smaller box.

Nope the answer will be money.

I can imagine that they will have had a meeting at FFG, in which some in company would have suggested putting it in the standard LCG sized box.

I'm sure the boys in shipping and packaging would then have have pointed out the cost to ship various size boxes.

Some may then have suggested just putting it in a smaller box, just big enough to fit the cards in.

I then reckon the boys in the marketing department would have pointed out that the smaller box wouldn't advertise itself on retail shelves and lose product presence.

For example, Neanderthal is a great game but comes in a tiny box so small, you wouldn't notice it on a shop shelf or would think a small box wouldn't hold such a clever heavy game.

I can picture the executives would have taken all these things into account and decided upon what was finally released.

I don't think any of them for a moment even considered the poor customer's dilemma of storing a ever growing product, over time and if they did then it didn't win the argument.

Money did.

I was hoping that perhaps the Dunwich expansion would come in box like the delux expansions for their other LCG's, so at least they could be used to keep the campaign in.

Alas, my Dunwich Horror arrived this week and they may as well have shipped it in a Plaggy bag from Asda, for all the box's storage potential offers.

Nah FFG IMO, seem to be going in a poor direction, when it comes to consideration for their customers.

Fortunately the game is good enough that I'm in for now.

Maybe that's what they figured, when doing their cost considerations but it would have been nice, if they could have gone the extra distance and thought through the whole thing, from their customers prospective.

Anyone seen the storage box for The Gallerist ?

Now that is an awesome bit of game packaging.

It is obvious that Vital Lacerda must have had some influence and said this game is so good, it should be presented well too and not shipped in a box that you couldn't even put in the recycle bin, like Dunwich Horror arrived in.

Now that's an example of how you treat your customers.
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I think most people don't realize that when you place 4 core boxes next to one another in just the right way, they link up Voltron. Not only do you have more storage space, but a secret compartment unlocks, revealing Monterey Jack.

But then you need to buy another core build his deck.

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