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Pax Renaissance» Forums » Rules

Subject: Mismatched agents and one-shots rss

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Stephen Jacobsen
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There are many cards that will deploy one kind of agent, but have a one-shot that employs a different kind of agent (e.g. Deploying a knight, but has a Peasant revolt one-shot).

I assumed during our first game that in these scenarios, you basically have to choose one or the other. You don't get both. Is my assumption correct? If I followed the flow of placing a card precisely, this is the conclusion I came to.

Thanks for clarifying.

Edit with solution:
phileklund wrote:
On the Battle Table (last page), in the first line (Number of Agent icons on card) it says that knights, rooks, or cube agents attack in a peasant revolt. For instance, the "Schwarzer Haufen" black horde card has a knight agent, and thematically this should fight in a peasant revolt (the theme text mentions that this is the only cavalry in European history to so fight in a peasant revolt.

In general, I want the agents to fight, except that pawns only fight in peasant revolts, and bishops never fight. This is also in the "Battle" entry in the glossary. If this isn't clear, make suggestions in the living rules how I can make this clear. Thanks for your help!


Basically, you have a one-shot which adds agents to benefit it's success (exception: peasants only fight in peasant revolts; bishops never fight). If you enact a successful one-shot, and you have agents from the card remaining (involved in fighting or not) then you can place them normally.
 
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Matthew Totonchy
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Hi Stephen,

I read the rules to mean that in your example the knight will participate in the peasant revolt as one of the attackers.


You want to come to the LL and play Pax Ren tonight?
 
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Stephen Jacobsen
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Gazpar wrote:
Hi Stephen,

I read the rules to mean that in your example the knight will participate in the peasant revolt as one of the attackers.


I'm not sure if that's true. The rules say that only certain units participate in certain battles. Is this an exception? I don't remember reading of such exceptions explicitly.


Quote:
You want to come to the LL and play Pax Ren tonight?


I wish. I work into the evening on Thursdays and don't have great transportation. Maybe another time. I've played the game once so far and like it.

 
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Ken Sinn
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A similar situation is mentioned here:
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1672207/crim-horde

The one-shot and the placement of an agent are more-or-less independent activities.
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Stephen Jacobsen
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mooken wrote:
A similar situation is mentioned here:
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1672207/crim-horde

The one-shot and the placement of an agent are more-or-less independent activities.


Perfect. That answers my question exactly.
 
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Steve Carey
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mooken wrote:
A similar situation is mentioned here:
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1672207/crim-horde

The one-shot and the placement of an agent are more-or-less independent activities.


That thread reference is for a concession cube, which is never an agent for any one-shot (even a peasant revolt); an agent only for a one-shot peasant revolt (not a conspiracy, as in the example); if serfs on an empire card, then such cubes are attackers during a peasant revolt.

If Mamluk Slave Soldiers is played, the knight agent participates in the jihad as an attacker; it's not independent.

If The Grim is played, a jihad occurs but the bishop does not participate because it's likewise never an agent (only knights and rooks can be agents).

At least that's my understanding (it is a tad confusing)...
 
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Ken Sinn
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Steve Carey wrote:

That thread reference is for a concession cube, which is never an agent for any one-shot (even a peasant revolt); if serfs on an empire card, then such cubes are attackers during a peasant revolt.

If Mamluk Slave Soldiers is played, the knight agent participates in the jihad as an attacker; it's not independent.

If The Grim is played, a jihad occurs but the bishop does not participate because it's likewise never an agent (only knights and rooks can be agents).

At least that's my understanding (it is a tad confusing)...


Emphases mine below

See example E2 in the rulebook (or in the living rules):

Quote:
Example (peasant revolt one-shot): You play the Flanders Guilds card, a Pawn Card located in France, and triggers its peasant revolt. The card’s Pawn Agent is the only attacker, see J2. There are no Ruling Class to defend, so the revolt is victorious. The French Empire is still in the empire stack, so you claim it into your western tableau. This Regime Change allows you to place an additional Pawn, for a total of two Concessions, placed in two separate borders next to France.


Also in J2:

Quote:
Peasant Revolt Attackers. Agents placed due to the one-shot and any Serfs on the empire card are automatically attackers. Any of your Concessions, or pirates of any color, in the location's Borders also join as attackers.
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Steve Carey
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In other words, cubes (pawns) are only attackers as agents (as listed, upper left on the card) when the one-shot is a peasant revolt, is that correct?
 
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Ken Sinn
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Steve Carey wrote:
In other words, cubes (pawns) are only attackers as agents (as listed, upper left on the card) when the one-shot is a peasant revolt, is that correct?


Correct!
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Steve Carey
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Thanks Ken, I edited my post.
 
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Phil Eklund
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I modified the living rules with a clarifying parenthetical: J2. Peasant Revolt One-Shot.
Peasant Revolts are the same as Conspiracies except:
Peasant Revolt Attackers. Agents placed due to the one-shot (including cubes) and any Serfs on the empire card are automatically attackers. Any of your Concessions, or pirates of any color, in the location's Borders also join as attackers.
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Ken Sinn
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phileklund wrote:
I modified the living rules with a clarifying parenthetical: J2. Peasant Revolt One-Shot.
Peasant Revolts are the same as Conspiracies except:
Peasant Revolt Attackers. Agents placed due to the one-shot (including cubes) and any Serfs on the empire card are automatically attackers. Any of your Concessions, or pirates of any color, in the location's Borders also join as attackers.


Hey Phil,
That somewhat contradicts the quoted situation. The revision would include any card-agents (knights, rooks) as an attacker in a peasant revolt then? I thought we were making the case that Battle Rules are strict, and off-type agents were not part of the battle.
 
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Phil Eklund
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mooken wrote:

That somewhat contradicts the quoted situation. The revision would include any card-agents (knights, rooks) as an attacker in a peasant revolt then? I thought we were making the case that Battle Rules are strict, and off-type agents were not part of the battle.


Hi Ken, On the Battle Table (last page), in the first line (Number of Agent icons on card) it says that knights, rooks, or cube agents attack in a peasant revolt. For instance, the "Schwarzer Haufen" black horde card has a knight agent, and thematically this should fight in a peasant revolt (the theme text mentions that this is the only cavalry in European history to so fight in a peasant revolt.

In general, I want the agents to fight, except that pawns only fight in peasant revolts, and bishops never fight. This is also in the "Battle" entry in the glossary. If this isn't clear, make suggestions in the living rules how I can make this clear. Thanks for your help!

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