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Vast: The Crystal Caverns» Forums » News

Subject: Revision 3 rss

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Patrick Leder
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We are shipping these Monday. Kyle and I have found a few changes to make.

https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/0BxGSe67fZvvNdlJN...

If you have any comments at this point it would be very helpful. Really helpful would be figuring out if you had a question if the current rules would have helped you.

Thanks everyone!

Patrick
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Jon Ritter
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Is the Thief player board supposed to have the same dagger icon for each skill/area?

Preordered the second printing a month or so back, really excited!
 
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Kyle
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ObviouslyJon wrote:
Is the Thief player board supposed to have the same dagger icon for each skill/area?
Yes - Those dagger spaces only show where you can place stashed treasures to mark your upgrades.
 
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Ian Gill
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Hi

I managed to buy a copy of Vast retail and have punched it but barely started learning the rules.

Unfortunately, coming to the threads, I don't find it very easy to see what I would be best to look at to avoid any rules confusions when learning ?

- should I use these Rev 3 rules etc.

- if so, are there changes to the player boards, etc that I need to be aware of when using this version


I would like to use the existing components as far as possible rather than printing new player boards etc.

is there a list of the important changes that a player with the first version needs to be aware of to avoid any issues?

I hope you can advise me

Ian
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Kyle
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High Frontier PBF #17 - Failing spaceward!
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We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!
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If you're just learning the game, using these Rev 3 rules will make that process a little bit easier than before, but you should still be okay learning from the rules that were in the box. Maybe just print out pages 4 and 5 of the Rev3 rules and keep that handy as a reference.


The Vast majority of edits to the rulebook, player boards, etc. were for clarity purposes only, and actual changes to the rules were very minor. You can find those listed in this thread.
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Ian Gill
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Thanks, that is really helpful to know.

I would normally work through all the posts but with talk of revised rules and second editions it just seemed more sensibke to ask
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Peter Rabinowitz
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On the Goblins board, there's got to be a cleaner way to note a] most of the actions can only be done if the tribe is revealed and b] the only thing a hidden tribe an do is reveal. Having (while revealed) repeated on almost every line is visual clutter.

Maybe as headers?

While hidden:
Reveal
While revealed:
Attack
Plunder
etc.
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Peter Rabinowitz
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On the "sliding tile dragon" example, spet #4, I feel like there are two extra red space outlines on the left.
 
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Peter Rabinowitz
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Int the "forced movement" section, step #2, there are no checkmarks. I think you meant "green border".
 
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Peter Rabinowitz
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Loving the new rules clarification sheet.
 
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Brandon Bower
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Hi, I just recently backed the Kickstarter and looked at the Print and Play files posted on there. There were a few things I came across that could possibly change for consistency and I figure this is as good a place as any to post them, though I suppose it may be a bit late now for at least some of the items.

Card - Silver Gauntlet:
Quote:
If you hit the Dragon, it must discard 1 card.

to
Quote:
If you hit the Dragon, he must discard 1 card.

To keep consistent with all pronoun uses for the Dragon elsewhere in the rules.

Rules & Rule Sheet - The Thief - Setup:
Quote:
Before your first turn, place the Thief piece on the Entrance tile.

Place the Vault tokens near your board.

to
Quote:
Place the Vault tokens near your board.

At the start of your first turn, place the Thief piece on the Entrance tile.

The first change (changing the beginning of the sentence) removes any vagueness from an unqualified "before" and makes it consistent with the Dragon's Setup text ("At the start of your first turn, place the Sleeping Dragon piece ...").

The second change (switching the order of paragraphs 3 and 4) makes it flow a bit better logically (Start of Game paragraphs x3 + Start of First Turn x1, instead of Start of Game x2, Start of First Turn x1, Start of Game x1). It also makes the section consistent with the Dragon's Setup (Where the "At the start of your first turn..." paragraph is the final paragraph and the first 4 paragraphs are Start of Game instructions).

Cards - Goblins Difficulty:
I can't think of any way to elegantly write the text, but I feel the cards should have instructions for when there is no Knight player as the Knight cards use "If no Dragon, ...". Maybe something like "If no Knight, use the [Name or Difficulty Level] Knight Difficulty card."

Otherwise the Goblin difficulty cards seem to be the only Difficulty cards that require you to explicitly look up the Difficulty variant when no Knight is in play. Any win condition changes for other players are either explicitly listed on the card (the Knight) or won't need to scale and are listed directly in the Role Variants.

For example, Dragon vs Knight states that if the Knight dies the dragon wins in that variant section and will be easily spotted when setting up for the game (and the dragon's or knight's difficulty card won't be affected by that win condition anyway).

Another example, Dragon vs Goblin states that the Ash Dragon card comes into play and the players will know that the Goblin can attack the Dragon, but a Goblin player wanting to play on a non-Standard difficulty would not know to adjust the Dragon's health unless they look up Goblin Expert, Hard, Easy or Easiest in the Difficulty Variant section (And the same for no Knight and Dragon, where they will need to know to increase of reduce the number of smashed crystals needed to win).

Cards - Cave Difficulty
Two things:

One, the 4 and 8 token addition wordings are a bit vague to me, I'm not sure if I missed anything. Is it saying that I must clear all of the tokens before I can use Hatred to add tiles, or that I must clear all of them before I add any tiles? I assume I can still add tiles to open edges during any turn, but do I still add tiles due to the automatic Shape the Cave phase, even if I still have tokens out? I'm also assuming, since it's not explicitly called out, that I'm still able to remove tiles using Hatred during the collapse even if I have tokens still out?

I feel like it's only talking about using Hatred to add and the instead is referring specifically to "instead of (the Hatred omen) adding tiles", maybe something closer to "Place X tokens near your board. While any tokens remain, the Hatred omen will remove a token instead of adding a tile."

Two, each difficulty card for other players lists the win condition (or the health of the player you must kill), even if it is the same as the default win condition. Standard, Hard and Expert for Cave are the only exceptions. Hard and Expert are already wordy, but at least for Standard I feel the card should not say "Do not remove any tiles or gain tokens." and should instead say "The Cave collapses when 5 crystal tiles have been removed." (similar to the Easy and Easiest cards for the Cave), since the perspective of these cards seems to be from the viewpoint of the Standard difficulty, where no mechanic exists that removes tiles from the game or adds tokens next to the Cave player's board.

For example, the Dragon Standard card does not say "You do not need to use your Shriek power to win" since one of the difficulty cards requires Shriek but says "You must have 11 Wakefulness to awaken." Which is basically just restating the Standard rules. (Same with the Standard Knight "Dragon starts at 5 Health", Goblin "Knight starts at 7 Health", and Thief "You must stash 6 Treasure tokens").

The Hard and Expert cards may be a bit more difficult for that since the text would be a bit crammed, but for the sole purpose of consistency, I feel like those three cards should have that to match the other two (and to match the other 20 difficulty cards).
 
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