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Race! Formula 90» Forums » Rules

Subject: Can a robot unlap themselves as a result of a contest? rss

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Iain Mabbott
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I think the answer to this is "yes" but I wanted to check.

Consider this example...

The leader (red human) moves into a corner section, lapping orange and purple cars.

The order is then red human (leader), orange human (-1 lap), purple robot (-1 lap).

Because this is now the leader section, the orange and purple cars are now activated.

The purple robot will thus initiate a contest to overtake orange. This automatically brings red into the contest even though purple would never initiate a contest against the leader on their own?

If red decides to participate and the result of the contest ends up being: purple robot then orange human then red human, this is legal?

Hope that's clear!

Cheers, Iain
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Srdj
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Popabawa wrote:
I think the answer to this is "yes" but I wanted to check.

Consider this example...

The leader (red human) moves into a corner section, lapping orange and purple cars.

The order is then red human (leader), orange human (-1 lap), purple robot (-1 lap).

Because this is now the leader section, the orange and purple cars are now activated.

The purple robot will thus initiate a contest to overtake orange. This automatically brings red into the contest even though purple would never initiate a contest against the leader on their own?

If red decides to participate and the result of the contest ends up being: purple robot then orange human then red human, this is legal?

Hope that's clear!

Cheers, Iain


I'm fairly new to the game, but I think the answer is 'Yes'.
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Darrell Hanning
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Page 12 of the rulebook (Robots Lapping and Unlapping) is pretty clear on this:

- Robots loose (sic) any movement point when they reach a driver
with more laps. There are only two cases when a robot can
unlap itself a. When the car in front is off-track and they move
before it re-enters the track b. When a robot succeed in a Late
Braking (Advanced Game only).

So, the answer to your question is pretty clearly "No", as a contest in a turn doesn't fall into either of those categories.
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Iain Mabbott
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DarrellKH wrote:
Page 12 of the rulebook (Robots Lapping and Unlapping) is pretty clear on this:

- Robots loose (sic) any movement point when they reach a driver
with more laps. There are only two cases when a robot can
unlap itself a. When the car in front is off-track and they move
before it re-enters the track b. When a robot succeed in a Late
Braking (Advanced Game only).

So, the answer to your question is pretty clearly "No", as a contest in a turn doesn't fall into either of those categories.


That's what I thought but if you look at the 3.0 rules (in the files section) on page 19, the bottom example, it shows the robot (-1 lap) initiating a contest with the car in front (-1 lap and human) and the leader (also human) participates. It just doesn't explain what would happen if the robot wins the contest...
 
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Bård Holst
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Popabawa wrote:
DarrellKH wrote:
Page 12 of the rulebook (Robots Lapping and Unlapping) is pretty clear on this:

- Robots loose (sic) any movement point when they reach a driver
with more laps. There are only two cases when a robot can
unlap itself a. When the car in front is off-track and they move
before it re-enters the track b. When a robot succeed in a Late
Braking (Advanced Game only).

So, the answer to your question is pretty clearly "No", as a contest in a turn doesn't fall into either of those categories.


That's what I thought but if you look at the 3.0 rules (in the files section) on page 19, the bottom example, it shows the robot (-1 lap) initiating a contest with the car in front (-1 lap and human) and the leader (also human) participates. It just doesn't explain what would happen if the robot wins the contest...


The Purple robot would be allowed to initiate a contest in this case, despite the fact that they normally loose all movement points when reaching a player with more laps.

This is from the 3.0 rules p.16
- Robots lose any remaining movement points when they reach a driver with more laps. There are only a few cases when a robot can unlap itself; it then mentions a, b, and c options for when robots can unlap and the d option which I have here:
d. when the robot is involved in a mixed contest situation with cars within the same lap as well as cars with more laps

This would be the case for the purple robot in your example as he is in a section with both a car with the same number of laps (orange) and one with 1 more lap (red).

edit, lol, I just relized that this would effectively mean that robots always would be able to initiate a contest when lapped as they would be in a section with cars with same & unequal number of laps!! Unless the rules mean to say that this rule only matters if the robot is in a section with other robots of equal/unequal laps i.e. not counting itself. If the latter is correct it would be able to initiate a contest only if there are 3 or more cars in the section with different laps. If it's just the robot and the lapping car then it could not unlap itself.

 
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Iain Mabbott
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Cheers Bård, I think that's pretty definitive
 
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Iain Mabbott
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Bonus follow up question....

If, after the contest in my original post, the order ended up; purple robot then orange human then red human leader (purple and orange have unlapped themselves), when the section activates again, is this considered to be a new sub-section as they are now ahead of red rather than behind? If yes, can red participate if a contest is declared? Or is it a big no as it's the same cars contesting, albeit (possibly)in a different sub-section?
 
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Darrell Hanning
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Nusferatu wrote:
Popabawa wrote:
DarrellKH wrote:
Page 12 of the rulebook (Robots Lapping and Unlapping) is pretty clear on this:

- Robots loose (sic) any movement point when they reach a driver
with more laps. There are only two cases when a robot can
unlap itself a. When the car in front is off-track and they move
before it re-enters the track b. When a robot succeed in a Late
Braking (Advanced Game only).

So, the answer to your question is pretty clearly "No", as a contest in a turn doesn't fall into either of those categories.


That's what I thought but if you look at the 3.0 rules (in the files section) on page 19, the bottom example, it shows the robot (-1 lap) initiating a contest with the car in front (-1 lap and human) and the leader (also human) participates. It just doesn't explain what would happen if the robot wins the contest...


The Purple robot would be allowed to initiate a contest in this case, despite the fact that they normally loose all movement points when reaching a player with more laps.

This is from the 3.0 rules p.16
- Robots lose any remaining movement points when they reach a driver with more laps. There are only a few cases when a robot can unlap itself; it then mentions a, b, and c options for when robots can unlap and the d option which I have here:
d. when the robot is involved in a mixed contest situation with cars within the same lap as well as cars with more laps

This would be the case for the purple robot in your example as he is in a section with both a car with the same number of laps (orange) and one with 1 more lap (red).

edit, lol, I just relized that this would effectively mean that robots always would be able to initiate a contest when lapped as they would be in a section with cars with same & unequal number of laps!! Unless the rules mean to say that this rule only matters if the robot is in a section with other robots of equal/unequal laps i.e. not counting itself. If the latter is correct it would be able to initiate a contest only if there are 3 or more cars in the section with different laps. If it's just the robot and the lapping car then it could not unlap itself.



It's true, if you're playing the Advanced game, and using the v3.0 rules.
 
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Darrell Hanning
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Popabawa wrote:
Bonus follow up question....

If, after the contest in my original post, the order ended up; purple robot then orange human then red human leader (purple and orange have unlapped themselves), when the section activates again, is this considered to be a new sub-section as they are now ahead of red rather than behind? If yes, can red participate if a contest is declared? Or is it a big no as it's the same cars contesting, albeit (possibly)in a different sub-section?


The section containing the leader activates first. Purple and orange move, then the leader moves. There is no second contest in that section; a contest has already been resolved.
 
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Iain Mabbott
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Yeah, I think you are right, I was overthinking it somewhat!
 
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Stan Hilinski
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Popabawa wrote:
I think the answer to this is "yes" but I wanted to check.

Consider this example...

The leader (red human) moves into a corner section, lapping orange and purple cars.

The order is then red human (leader), orange human (-1 lap), purple robot (-1 lap).

Because this is now the leader section, the orange and purple cars are now activated.

The purple robot will thus initiate a contest to overtake orange. This automatically brings red into the contest even though purple would never initiate a contest against the leader on their own?

If red decides to participate and the result of the contest ends up being: purple robot then orange human then red human, this is legal?

Hope that's clear!

Cheers, Iain

Whenever a human gets lapped, strange things happen. Fortunately, it should not happen often. This is the one time a lapped robot can start a contest against its "lappers." You are correct; there would be a contest even if Red or Orange declined.

Suppose after the contest it is now orange (-1 lap), purple (-1 lap), and red (leader). What happens next? This is the active section. Red is the leader, so he moves first. Purple and orange -- theortically -- won't get to move until we activate sections around the track and return to this one. There would be another contest in this subsection between orange and purple because it is a different subsection from their first contest, which was behind the leader. Now we are in forward subsection. Red would not participate because he is in the rear subsection.

I say theoretically because this scenario requires that Red does not move this turn and no other car claims the leadership by moving past Red. As I said earlier, the leader Red moves first. He will have to lap both Orange and Purple to advance even one section. If he does not have a blue flag or lapping skill, it will cost him 5 MP to do it! (2 Mp per lapped car and 1 MP to advance one section.)

But it gets worse for Red. If he hasn't lapped Orange or Purple already, then he must pass leader-lap checks on each one. If he doesn't cards in his hand to do them, he must do blind draws. If he is unlucky, he won't move at all! I am hating life if I'm Red.
 
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