$20.00
$5.00
$15.00
Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
14 Posts

Eclipse» Forums » Rules

Subject: Attacking the Population rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Mark B
United States
Connecticut
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
When your ships have to attack the population, the rules state Each point of damage destroys one Population Cube of your choosing. On the Android & iOS version, this was taken a step further. If your lone dreadnaught is left to take out 4 planets with 2 antimatter cannons, instead of rolling 2 red dice, you roll 8 yellow dice increasing your chances of rolling a hit.

Is this correct? Or a house rule?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Doug DeMoss
United States
Stillwater
Minnesota
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
At least in the Mac OS version, I have never seen anything but a complete miss or complete destruction of all targets with heavier cannon, so it may not actually be rolling that many dice; it doesn't display the die rolls.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Peter Bakija
United States
flag msg tools
Q: Are we not men?
mbmbmbmbmb
Maarek Stele wrote:
Is this correct? Or a house rule?


That isn't a rule. It might be something weird in the app. Having never played the app, I dunno. But in the actual rules, you just roll to hit with the guns you have.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark B
United States
Connecticut
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
demoss1 wrote:
At least in the Mac OS version, I have never seen anything but a complete miss or complete destruction of all targets with heavier cannon, so it may not actually be rolling that many dice; it doesn't display the die rolls.

Possibly could be what they threw together for the Android version.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Doug DeMoss
United States
Stillwater
Minnesota
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Can you actually see the dice rolled in the Android version? If not, you'd need to see an odd (non-total-kill) number of hits to be sure there's actually a problem.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark B
United States
Connecticut
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
demoss1 wrote:
Can you actually see the dice rolled

Yes, I see the individual attempts from cannons
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Doug DeMoss
United States
Stillwater
Minnesota
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Maarek Stele wrote:
demoss1 wrote:
Can you actually see the dice rolled

Yes, I see the individual attempts from cannons


Not the same thing. They show as individual shots because 1 damage takes out one population, but do you see the DICE ROLL?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark B
United States
Connecticut
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
demoss1 wrote:
Maarek Stele wrote:
demoss1 wrote:
Can you actually see the dice rolled

Yes, I see the individual attempts from cannons


Not the same thing. They show as individual shots because 1 damage takes out one population, but do you see the DICE ROLL?


Yes, and it looks like they are rolled as one die and not a separate shot.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Peter Bakija
United States
flag msg tools
Q: Are we not men?
mbmbmbmbmb
Ok, so having played the app a bunch over the weekend, here is what is happening:

In the app, when you don't have neutron bombs and have to shoot the population with guns that do more than 1 damage (i.e. plasma cannons), it divides the damage into 1 point shots, but if you look at the dice and hits, they are always hitting or missing in pairs of the same number (for plasma cannons). For example, if you fire 3 plasma cannons at some planets, the results will look like:

-1 damage hits on a 5!
-1 damage hits on a 5!
-1 damage misses on a 2!
-1 damage misses on a 2!
-1 damage misses on a 3!
-1 damage misses on a 3!

So the app breaks it up into single points of damage (I guess to make the killing of population make more sense? I dunno), but they are still hitting as single 2 point guns (or 4 point with anti-matter cannons), and the dice results reflect that.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
rock anonymous
msg tools
I find the rules in regards to attacking planets (without Neutron Bombs) is a bit vague. It basically says to assign shots the same way you would with ships.

so my understanding would be this:

1. I have a Dreadnought that has 2 Plasma Cannons.
2. The opponent's hex has 3 planets (one of which has both a regular resource and advanced resource node on it, so 4 population cubes in total across 3 planets).
3. Assuming both of my orange dice score hits, I must assign each of the dice to a planet.
4. So the two damage applied to the planet with 2 cubes will kill both population (as I'm splitting the damage across population cubes on a single planet, much like hull absorbs hits on ships) however I have one die left to assign, but two different planets to fire at, so I would only be able to assign the second die to one of the planets, leaving 1 population cube behind on the planet I could not assign a die to.

Alternatively is damage just considered a threshold?

1. I roll against "population"
2. I score 4 points of damage against 4 population
3. I assign each of the 4 damage points to each of the 4 population cubes.

We play by the first sequence, btw.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard
United States
San Diego
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Edit: See below
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Art Entre
msg tools
rockanon wrote:
I find the rules in regards to attacking planets (without Neutron Bombs) is a bit vague. It basically says to assign shots the same way you would with ships.

so my understanding would be this:

1. I have a Dreadnought that has 2 Plasma Cannons.
2. The opponent's hex has 3 planets (one of which has both a regular resource and advanced resource node on it, so 4 population cubes in total across 3 planets).
3. Assuming both of my orange dice score hits, I must assign each of the dice to a planet.
4. So the two damage applied to the planet with 2 cubes will kill both population (as I'm splitting the damage across population cubes on a single planet, much like hull absorbs hits on ships) however I have one die left to assign, but two different planets to fire at, so I would only be able to assign the second die to one of the planets, leaving 1 population cube behind on the planet I could not assign a die to.

Alternatively is damage just considered a threshold?

1. I roll against "population"
2. I score 4 points of damage against 4 population
3. I assign each of the 4 damage points to each of the 4 population cubes.

That's not quite true. A hit is determined the same way as attacking ships (with computers, 1 is a miss, etc), but the shots are not assigned the same way. The wording is "Each point of damage destroys one Population Cube of your choosing."

That means you don't assign a hit to a planet or a cube, you just take the sum of all damage from hits and remove that many population cubes; and therefore your first sequence is not correct.

In your example, the two hits from two plasma cannons gives 4 points of damage total, and can therefore remove all four population cubes even though they are split between three planets.

Your second sequence sounds more correct. For clarification though, if you hit below 4 points of damage, say for example a hit 2 points of damage, you will still remove two population cubes.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
rock anonymous
msg tools
Quote:
Damage from one die (eg. Plasma or Antimatter Cannons) may not be split to several targets.


Quote:
Each Ship may attack once with all of its Cannons (Missiles may not be used), using the normal rules to hit. Population is considered not to have any shields.


These two lines in the rules seem to conflict a little bit with regards to attacking population. Yes technically the fist quote is taken from the paragraph below the "hit" section, labeled "damage" so maybe I'm drawing a conclution based off a faulty reading.

However it does seem either: A) planets are not targets, or B) weapon damage CAN be split when attacking population (not ships).

I'm totally cool doing the population roll as a "siege success" check, but it kinda feels all wonky when compared to ship to ship combat.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Art Entre
msg tools
The first quote is from the section on attacking ships (just stating for clarity for anyone else reading), and the key wording that prevent a condradiction from your second quote in the section on attacking population is "to hit", which is specifically excluding the normal (for ships) rules to assign dice when dealing with population. The subsequent "each point of damage destroys one Population Cube" is what sets the rule for 'assigning' dice/damage for population.

I would have said both your A and B are true, planets are not direct targets and damage when attacking is split (the end result is the same either way); though with Shadow of the Rift, individual planets can be destroyed by anomalies.

I'd agree that it's not the most thematic rule that a single hit (die) can be split between multiple planets, but it's not the only rule lacking some thematic backing in the game.

For reference, I looked up a couple of other places this (or something close) has been discussed previously (link 1 and link 2).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.