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Subject: Related to 1.5K , will BG reviewers swallow their pride and cave in to pleadge for KDM? rss

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Panwuan Panwuan
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Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.
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John Middleton
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How many more reviews do you think this game needs?

What more can another 10 video reviews add to the conversation?
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panwuan wrote:

Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.


How is this even a relevant forum question? Do you guys think the pornhub will review the game? Why would I care? Do you think Donald Tump will make a statement about KD impact on US economy? Who cares? A and why would the BGG KD Forum community know anything about what other people would maybe do? Besides do we need more reviews if we already have a game or would have a game by that time?
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- Beasts of war: they just had a play through few days ago.
- Rahdo: he already said that he was very intrigued but: he doesn't want to assemble the miniatures (he would have liked a cardboard version of the game), he was open to buy someone's box for a fair price but was reluctant to pay the shipping fees, things like that if I'm not mistaken (several months ago). Bottom line: he's very intrigued but not enough to take the plunge.
- Dice Tower: they already said that this was not their alley because of the theme and mostly because of the miniatures they would have to assemble which is not their thing. It's clearly not their niche.

I'm just telling what I recall, don't quote me on that, word by word, but that's the spirit.
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Anthony Hanses
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panwuan wrote:

Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.


What we are thinking is that KDM needs more granular and short reviews that overarching reviews. So, in other words, it needs reviews of each campaign, hunt mob, pinup+gear, etc...

But right now, everything is a review of the "game" and often times reviews of just the base game with few if any of the expansions ever taken into account.

With our YouTube channel, we see quite a few people viewing random videos from our campaign and when looking at the analytics, they are getting there with search queries focused on the mobs we fought in those missions.

So we are hoping to put up some individual reviews for specific expansions over the next week or two.
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sam newman

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forgedbygeeks wrote:
panwuan wrote:

Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.


What we are thinking is that KDM needs more granular and short reviews that overarching reviews. So, in other words, it needs reviews of each campaign, hunt mob, pinup+gear, etc...

But right now, everything is a review of the "game" and often times reviews of just the base game with few if any of the expansions ever taken into account.

With our YouTube channel, we see quite a few people viewing random videos from our campaign and when looking at the analytics, they are getting there with search queries focused on the mobs we fought in those missions.

So we are hoping to put up some individual reviews for specific expansions over the next week or two.


Its the fault of the reviewers and not poots that some of the biggest reviewers in board games fail to have a review of 1 of the biggest kickstarter successes in board gaming history. You would think that being a board game reviewer KDM should be right up their alley regardless of its theme or artwork style.
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J B
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lol "the church of the dice tower" is not going to have an unbiased opinion about a game with a Satan level pledge.
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Honestly, screw the pro reviewers. This isn't a board game it's a hobby.

If they want to actually wake up and clue in to the fact that there is a crazy-dedicated fanbase who love to share and explore the game with others then they are more than welcome to do so.

But, they're almost certainly all going to be late to that party. Think of this game more like the early stages of D&D, or Warhammer, or really any big assed game that came from sole creators and grew to stupendous household recognition. A lot of the draw in those early years came by word-of-mouth promotionals from a friend of a friend, then they started self-published magazines, which turned into money whores.

This is not to say KDM will follow this path. For all we know this is a small phase of game development or just a really limited fad.

The same thing could be said about all the complaints people have about this game: "Too expensive" "Doesn't look right for me" "Trying to understand the appeal"

Those are complaints that have popped up around Magic the Gathering, D&D, Warhammer, you name it...

All we can do in the end is get them in front of the game, let them actually try it out, and either welcome the convert or shrug and go on our merry way.
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Charles Fox
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Joel eddie of drive thru review did an excellent review. I'm just happy that in The day and age of 5000 boad games a year, that most reviewers know what kingdom death monster is. Also Rob Owen has mentioned getting a copy to play and paint.
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Matt D
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gorkel wrote:
forgedbygeeks wrote:
panwuan wrote:

Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.


What we are thinking is that KDM needs more granular and short reviews that overarching reviews. So, in other words, it needs reviews of each campaign, hunt mob, pinup+gear, etc...

But right now, everything is a review of the "game" and often times reviews of just the base game with few if any of the expansions ever taken into account.

With our YouTube channel, we see quite a few people viewing random videos from our campaign and when looking at the analytics, they are getting there with search queries focused on the mobs we fought in those missions.

So we are hoping to put up some individual reviews for specific expansions over the next week or two.


Its the fault of the reviewers and not poots that some of the biggest reviewers in board games fail to have a review of 1 of the biggest kickstarter successes in board gaming history. You would think that being a board game reviewer KDM should be right up their alley regardless of its theme or artwork style.


How is this the "fault" of s reviewer? What obligation do they have to review every game? They aren't really journalists. It's not like the NY Times not reviewing the latest Dan Brown novel.

How much money do you think s board game reviewer makes? It would surprise me if most of them made enough in a year (or several) to be able to buy this extremely expensive game. So why should they spend that money to buy something they don't really want and isn't in their interest area just so other people can read their reviews?

If poots wanted reviews, I am sure he could get them. I am sure he could ship a review copy and pay for them to ship it onward etc. he doesn't need to, precisely because he had his loyal and broad fan base. He doesn't need to draw in many more. Frankly, his economies of scale seem to favor less customers, not more.

While some reviewers certainly are "pros" who get paid (a little) to do it, there is no obligation in their part the way you had one with Siskel & Ebert for movies, etc.

So don't blame the reviewers of poots won't provide s review copy and they don't want to spend an obscene amount of money to buy a game that isn't their interest. Poots doesn't care enough to engage the reviewers, probably doesn't need it, so why complain about it?
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Richard Sampson
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Ars Technica did a pretty good written review on it several months back: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/07/kingdom-death-monster-...
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TechRaptor Travis
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forgedbygeeks wrote:
panwuan wrote:

Based on the runaway success of the newest KS, As Adam most probably wont provide reviewers any free copy, would you think the big reviewers will pledge to be able to provide a review circa Summer 2017 (or fall, to fully test)

Im talking about Randho, Dice tower, SH&SD, etc????

Some outlets did review: Tech raptor, Beasts of War current filmed gameplay, Board game brawl.

What you guys think the reviewers will do based on this KS, smashing DS in afew days and in path to dethrone exploding kittens for first place.


What we are thinking is that KDM needs more granular and short reviews that overarching reviews. So, in other words, it needs reviews of each campaign, hunt mob, pinup+gear, etc...

But right now, everything is a review of the "game" and often times reviews of just the base game with few if any of the expansions ever taken into account.

With our YouTube channel, we see quite a few people viewing random videos from our campaign and when looking at the analytics, they are getting there with search queries focused on the mobs we fought in those missions.

So we are hoping to put up some individual reviews for specific expansions over the next week or two.


I wholeheartedly agree with this. I've noticed the same thing, and I've started doing some one-offs that are part review/part narrative.
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Brandon
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Seeing as how Sam Healy refused to play the warlock in Mage Wars because it conflicted with his religious beliefs, I can't see him playing KDM. He would lose his mind having to fight all the dick monsters.
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Kain
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I don't think it has anything to do with pride.
Each of the reviewers have something that will clash with this game's subject matter and theme.

Rhando will say "something something wife"
Tom and Sam will say "something something "religion and beliefs"
Shutupandsitdown will say "something something ethical/moral stances" (though they are most likely to review it)

They're not wrong for having their reasons to avoid this game isn't for everyone, not by a long shot and we shouldn't expect every reviewer to simply cater to what's popular and outside their comfort zone.
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Dark63 wrote:
I don't think it has anything to do with pride.
Each of the reviewers have something that will clash with this game's subject matter and theme.

Rhando will say "something something wife"
Tom and Sam will say "something something "religion and beliefs"
Shutupandsitdown will say "something something ethical/moral stances" (though they are most likely to review it)

They're not wrong for having their reasons to avoid this game isn't for everyone, not by a long shot and we shouldn't expect every reviewer to simply cater to what's popular and outside their comfort zone.


Exactly.
Moreover, one time Rahdo explained himself about his games.
He said that he has tons of games to review and because of that, he doesn't have much time for playing very big games over and over.
He can't afford that kind of dedication.
I can imagine this being applied to many of the reviewers.
It's just that they HAVE to buy the game to review it bit won't have the time to enjoy it. the purchase doesn't make sense to them.
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baylock wrote:
It's just that they HAVE to buy the game to review it bit won't have the time to enjoy it. the purchase doesn't make sense to them.

Right, so, it's a question of goals.

If a reviewer aims to analyze modern board gaming and present to an audience their critical take on it, that KDM-sized hole in their comprehension and coverage looks to be steadily growing.

If a reviewer aims to have some fun playing games they like to play, and share some of that enthusiasm with other like-minded people, then KDM means nothing if they aren't interested in it. (And it doesn't really matter whether that's due to budget, ideology, or genre preference.)

So why do people want to torture Vasel and friends?
 
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hestiansun wrote:
How much money do you think s board game reviewer makes? It would surprise me if most of them made enough in a year (or several) to be able to buy this extremely expensive game.

I don't see budget as much of an excuse (genre preference or ideology make more sense as reasons not to do KDM videos). If a reviewer is genuinely interested in checking out KDM, but doesn't make enough money to be able to make a $300 purchase, and doesn't have enough friends or fans to find someone to borrow it from*... they have work to do.



*Rahdo might get an exception here, for living in the middle of nowhere.
 
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I don't think having to buy a game would stop any reviewer from taking a look, and I think that if it was necessary for them to do so to acquire and review a popular game they would do so.

However, as has been pointed out, this game pretty much goes against directly against the family friendly style of the DT crew. Yes, some viewers might enjoy a review, but I expect MANY more viewers would take issue with such a review. I don't think they care that the pieces have to be assembled (they play 40K), but it is just not appropriate for their audience and the show they are trying to make.

I think for Rahdo, the limitation is time and effort required. Getting the game is a massive pain/expense to import, and I don't think he has the time to commit to putting the game together to playing several sessions. On top of that, he doesn't have the space and reselling it after constructed would just be another giant hassle.

As for SDSU, I think they are most likely of the three to do a review. However, it is still a major time commitment to put it all together and give it a decent playthrough that they probably just don't have time for.

When you are a top tier reviewer, you are expected to be pretty prolific in your content. A game like this takes a huge amount of time to construct and play for a decent review, and those people just don't have the time.
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Jim Jones
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tumorous wrote:
If a reviewer aims to analyze modern board gaming and present to an audience their critical take on it, that KDM-sized hole in their comprehension and coverage looks to be steadily growing.


You are wildly over-stating the importance of KDM to the boardgame hobby at large and its impact on same. Production level is the only thing particularly unique about it and even that isnt *that* unique. It's an excellent game but people need some perspective outside the echo chamber of KS success and the games own forums.

It's also not a reviewers aim to analyse modern board gaming and present their critical take on it, thats the work of editorials or features, video or otherwise. A reviewers aim is to, well, review games.
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beigemore wrote:
Seeing as how Sam Healy refused to play the warlock in Mage Wars because it conflicted with his religious beliefs, I can't see him playing KDM. He would lose his mind having to fight all the dick monsters.


Yeah, if the theme and art in The Others: 7 Sins were too much for him, KD:M would be pretty much an instant "nope".
 
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Board Game Brawl backed KD:M's first KS and reviewed it.



As did Drive Thru Review.

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I asked Shut up and Sit Down if they were going to review it once. They said it was outside of their market demographics.

*shrug*

Loss to their market.
 
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Why does anyone care?
They are just reviewers, not gatekeepers to the hobby. Who gives a shit really.
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Dean L
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tumorous wrote:
baylock wrote:
It's just that they HAVE to buy the game to review it bit won't have the time to enjoy it. the purchase doesn't make sense to them.

Right, so, it's a question of goals.

If a reviewer aims to analyze modern board gaming and present to an audience their critical take on it, that KDM-sized hole in their comprehension and coverage looks to be steadily growing.


Yup, but the trade-off for that is time. If we had a game with these themes and this level of success, but came pre-assembled, and could reasonably be reviewed after 5-6 hours of play, I think people like Dice Tower would bite the bullet and review it anyway. But because of the time investment that would be needed, it's not worth it.

Now of course, some games that need a huge time investment still get reviews (eg. Legacy games) but that's because the reviewers were interested in playing it anyway. For fun. So it's easier for the review to just follow from that.

IASeldon wrote:
I asked Shut up and Sit Down if they were going to review it once. They said it was outside of their market demographics.

*shrug*

Loss to their market.

SUSD have a fairly strong policy of not reviewing and recommending stuff that you can't buy (they sat on their Mice and Mystics review for about six months waiting for it to be reprinted). If KDM ever goes into retail they might cover it, but for them there's zero point in covering a game that's not available to buy 95% of the time.
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Uthred wrote:
It's also not a reviewers aim to analyse modern board gaming and present their critical take on it, thats the work of editorials or features, video or otherwise. A reviewers aim is to, well, review games.

You've just backed out of the question. They could do many different things. Most choose to play and review games that they expect to like, and that fit within certain genre parameters of gaming.

Reviewers can be critics. I'm not saying that they have to be. They could be.
 
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