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Subject: David, any expansions or sequel coming? rss

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Sergei V
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Hello David, anything in the pipeline for retail? I love the game, have it for about 2-3 years and want more! ))

Best regars,
Sergei.
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Canada
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subscribed. I'm curious to see if there is anything coming out as well.
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Stephen G Roy
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Ryan Stripling
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I think the answer is that it is unlikely :-(
-ryanjamal
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Denmark
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Yeah thats kind of unfortunate, the game had alot of good things going for it, but ended up being a little to fiddly for its own good.

A streamlined 2'ed would be great, but it seems unlikely, oh well.
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The Game Steward
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I spoke to a Queen Games rep back at Origins 2016, and the woman visibly soured when I asked about DDD. They don't have any plans to support the game going forward.

Afterwards, I contacted David to ask if/when the rights to the game would revert back to him. He didn't respond directly, but I have encouraged him not to give up on this game.

I am willing to bet that another publisher would be willing to pick this game up. Putting the Kickstarter drama aside, the game is quite well liked by those who own it. I am sure the rules could be tweaked and streamlined, but fundamentally it's a very solid design. It would seem to be the kind of game where a new publisher could re-publish it successfully. After all, a new name on the box would go a long way to shed all the negativity associated with Queen Games and their handling of the game.

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You may call me
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DDD is currently on fire sale over on Amazon.com. You can get it for like $16-$21 right now.

Unfortunately, it's obvious Queen have no interest in promoting this game when they're dumping the game at that price (or maybe it's the retailers trying to get rid of stock?...)

I also don't think the time for this game to come out again is right, the industry has moved on from Zombie games. I don't see this getting picked up again.

A fully developed, streamlined 2nd edition with zombie monsters and more survivors as expansions would be awesome... but, I think, a pipe dream at this point.

The right answer though is: user created content!
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The Game Steward
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Logus Vile wrote:
DDD is currently on fire sale over on Amazon.com. You can get it for like $16-$21 right now.

Unfortunately, it's obvious Queen have no interest in promoting this game when they're dumping the game at that price (or maybe it's the retailers trying to get rid of stock?...)

I also don't think the time for this game to come out again is right, the industry has moved on from Zombie games. I don't see this getting picked up again.

A fully developed, streamlined 2nd edition with zombie monsters and more survivors as expansions would be awesome... but, I think, a pipe dream at this point.

The right answer though is: user created content!


Well, the beauty of a new publisher is that it would be easy enough to re-theme the game if the market has moved on. The mechanics would translate well enough to a fantasy, sci-fi, or post-apocalyptic setting. But I agree with you generally that now is not the right time. But having learned a lot about the publishing industry, I'd say that now is a good time to pick up the rights to the game relatively cheaply, and work on it for a 2018 or 2019 release. At which time the market may be ready for a new version of this game.

I know that sounds like forever from now. But 18 months to 3 years is not actually that long to go from acquiring the rights to a game to releasing it to retail.
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David Ausloos
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Sigh, thanks to the whole nightmare-worthy campaign I fear the game will always be associated with Kickstarters gone awry.
I learned alot from this saddening experience. Queen received it's fair share of hatred, but I can safely say that I also got my portion of ugly emails. Seemingly many gamers think that designers have full control over their design when handed over to a publisher.

The truth is that I can write a book about this whole experience, and the tons of frustrating moments I lived through, not being able to solve the issues caused by others. It definitly didn't help my reputation as a designer. Let's just say that I will be very very careful when choosing publishers in the future.

That said, I moved on from DDD. I still believe in the game.
I had some of my most memorable experiences playing it with some fantastic groups of playtesters. Good times.
Sadly enough only a minority of people will take the time to download the revised rules to experience the game as I intended it.

Currently I moved on to more accessible territory with my new designs.
My current design goals are shorter games with easy-to-grasp rules, but without losing significant choices to be made by players.
And rest assure, I will make sure that each new release will have a solid rules-booklet that doesn't need an immediate revision.

In any case, it feels good to read that still people are dicovering DDD and enjoying it. And yes, maybe one day a revised edition will be possible, with a new theme attached.
I have actually designed a nocturnal gothic-themed dungeonrawler 2 years ago with some unique twists to the genre which I hope to fully develop into final proto form one day. But for now, I want to focus on shorter
games that appeal to a wide range of player.



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Herb Leist

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Sad that there is no future for DDD, but glad you are still designing. I love this game so much I bought an extra from Amazon at the ridiculously low price of $16. Sorry you had to go through so much to have DDD made, but I am also glad you did, if that makes sense.
 
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Sergei V
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Thanks David for replying! It is indeed sad DDD is over, i think it is the best zombie game out there. And by the way new rules were downloaded multiple thousands of time, so the game gets its love!
Good luck with your new designs!
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Paul Kellett
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Preston
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Thanks for taking the time to reply. It is such a shame that Queen Games did so much damage to both the game's and your reputation. It's a hard lesson, but hopefully you will be wiser and better able to avoid similar situations in the future.

Take solace in the fact that those of us who have the game love it and enjoy it. It is the go-to zombie game in my group and one my top solo games. If you were to release more scenarios/characters/expansions, even if they were pnp, I'm sure they would be welcomed by the community.

Happy Christmas and I hope 2017 is a great one for you
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Jolly Roger
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First of all: David, I am so sorry to hear about your challenges with DDD. I just picked up this game around Christmas 2016, read through the instructions and played my first game. This game is absolutely fantastic! One of my favorites! I'm not sure of any chance for a re-print, but I would support it! I truly hope this game can be revived. I really appreciate your thoughtfulness in creating this great game. I wish I had discovered this great game earlier! I would definitely pick up expansions, including more house tiles and more characters, including the characters in the Kickstarter edition. I really hope the game continues to be printed.
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Lex Talionis
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It could have been great to have at least the rules of the miniatures that have not been delivered to backers in order to play them with other miniatures...
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John Grayson
Australia
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I only recently found out about this game (March 2017). It sounded pretty awesome but like all Kickstarter games with game exclusives, I can't figure out if I want to buy it.

This is the problem I personally see with game play elements as kickstarter rewards. I could buy the retail version, but I'd feel I'd be missing out on the premium edition contents.

I'd happily fork over the money for a premium one at KS price (or even a bit higher). But the only premium one on ebay at the moment is ~$800 USD.

So the question I have is, do I buy the retail game sans kickstarter material?

I wish all kickstarter campaigns would stop providing stretch goals as game content. Instead do things like "cheaper than retail" or card sleeves or something. Or at the very least offer the KS material later, not as exclusives.

Just feels like 1/2 a game should I get it now.
 
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Josh
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azshade wrote:
I only recently found out about this game (March 2017). It sounded pretty awesome but like all Kickstarter games with game exclusives, I can't figure out if I want to buy it.

This is the problem I personally see with game play elements as kickstarter rewards. I could buy the retail version, but I'd feel I'd be missing out on the premium edition contents.

I'd happily fork over the money for a premium one at KS price (or even a bit higher). But the only premium one on ebay at the moment is ~$800 USD.

So the question I have is, do I buy the retail game sans kickstarter material?

I wish all kickstarter campaigns would stop providing stretch goals as game content. Instead do things like "cheaper than retail" or card sleeves or something. Or at the very least offer the KS material later, not as exclusives.

Just feels like 1/2 a game should I get it now.

Yes, just get the retail. Retail is a full game .. the extras mainly just add fluff and not really needed. We played this for a long time w/o any of the KS stuff and when we did add some KS stuff it didnt really add much to the experience. Especially at the prices you can find this game at ~50% retail, what you'll pay for the KS stuff is a lot less of a value from a money per game experience perspective.

For a lot of people, I'd say the base game is 100-110% of the experience -- talking about what they want/get out of playing the game before they move on to other games. The 110% means they never get to 10% of the experiences available from the base game before they move on (advanced/alt rules). There are some people where it'd be more like 90-100%. They might like a little more out of it than the base provides, but it comes close. Not worth $50+ to eek that 10% more out, when you're pretty much satisfied with just the base.

Then there are the odd bunch that will play it to death and come back for more yr after yr. These are the only people that the KS might be worth it for. Maybe.

But if you're in this camp than the extra 25-50 for an extra copy of the base would be worth it just for the extra tiles to make a bigger map, etc, more baddies, etc.

So, I'd either not get it at all, or get the base game and play until you're almost bored with it but in the good way that you want more variation and then see how much KS is going for and if you think worth it knowing the game much better having played it to death.
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The Game Steward
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While I respect the completionist tendency to a certain point, I really don't understand this idea that a retail version of a game is only "half a game" when applied to Kickstarter games only. I've never heard anyone claim that Arkham Horror is half a game if you don't own all 8 expansions (much less play with all 8 at once). Or more relevant, Agricola is not claimed to be half a game because all of the promo decks are not generally available at retail.

Publishers use promo items all the time, and they are almost always gameplay related and hard to find after the fact. But of all the people who complain about KS Exclusives, only a tiny fraction complain about promos generally.

If that's your thing, so be it, but there are so many good Kickstarter games that are fully playable and "complete" without any of the KS promos. Blood Rage is a great example. It's a fantastic game all by itself.

Same with Dark Darker Darkest. It's a great game all on its own. The KS stuff is nice enough, but it's very uneven. Some things are just worthless, honestly (e.g. "Light in the Dark" Expansion, which is just glow in the dark minis). Some just make the game brutally hard, and thus are not really worth it (i.e. Radioactive Expansion). And some are quite good - the extra characters and nemeses. But again, nothing that makes the game incomplete to not have them.

I'm unabashedly a fan of DDD. If I could help get it re-published, I would. But mostly I see a lot of gamers who deprive themselves of the fun opportunity to play really good new games. All because of the erroneous belief that because there are KS promos ("Exclusives"), the retail game must somehow be incomplete. That's only true to the same extent that every game ever published is incomplete if you don't own every promo ever produced for every such game, like Sushi Go! or Mice & Mystics or [insert name of almost every popular game ever here].

azshade wrote:
I only recently found out about this game (March 2017). It sounded pretty awesome but like all Kickstarter games with game exclusives, I can't figure out if I want to buy it.

This is the problem I personally see with game play elements as kickstarter rewards. I could buy the retail version, but I'd feel I'd be missing out on the premium edition contents.

I'd happily fork over the money for a premium one at KS price (or even a bit higher). But the only premium one on ebay at the moment is ~$800 USD.

So the question I have is, do I buy the retail game sans kickstarter material?

I wish all kickstarter campaigns would stop providing stretch goals as game content. Instead do things like "cheaper than retail" or card sleeves or something. Or at the very least offer the KS material later, not as exclusives.

Just feels like 1/2 a game should I get it now.
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