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Mythic Battles: Pantheon» Forums » Rules

Subject: Genesis of the Rules Set rss

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Michael Johnson
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Is it just me or does anyone else see the heavy influence of Heroclix and even more so Heroscape in the mechanics of this game? I'm not complaining at all. I love both games. I'm just curious if this observation has already been discussed.
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Emivaldo Sousa
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Skirmish games have been around in a way or another since chess, Heroclix is just famous, but I do not think it is really influential.

Only Benoit can answer that, but I would not be surprised if those games were not an influence at all. They were well presented visually but not particularly innovative in its mechanisms.
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Neomaxim Noefaith
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Other than wounds also revealing new stat-lines, there is functionally no DNA of Heroclix here, and wounds equating depreciating stats is featured in many, many games.

Honestly, within the war-gaming community, Heroclix is a laughing stock. It is an imbalanced, mediocre game, created by a despicable company that builds obsolesence into their competitive community by always making new, and rarer models better than others. Its a cash-grab, and barely a game. :-p

What Benoit has created, and I say this as a designer myself, is a very clever game that both demonstrates a keen dice mechanic, but also a deep understanding of how to keep a game rich in meaningful player choices at every phase of play, while cutting out a lot of the extraneous stuff that can result in 100+ page rule-books with some minis games.
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Daniel Guinoza
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spartan67 wrote:
Is it just me or does anyone else see the heavy influence of Heroclix and even more so Heroscape in the mechanics of this game? I'm not complaining at all. I love both games. I'm just curious if this observation has already been discussed.


Stats reduced by damage: Modern skirmish, comparable games also have knight model's marvel and dc universe games as having stats reduced by damage. The test dials did seem similar (as seen in past videos, before dashboards). That may have been a motivation to change (besides the official 'flips are clumsy').

Variable, overpowered powers: is shared with cosmic encounter. But then, blood rage has battle outcome copied from cosmic encounter, too.

Recruitment cost: Almost all skirmish, if not all have them.

Draft: Some games can be easily drafted.

Activation+Joker: Something similar exists in Malifaux. Not to activate, but to resolve hit/damage.

2 Activations per turn: Mage Knight had it.

RNG control of dice results: Most skirmish games have it.

If you think about it, most games have multiple elements from different games.

Newtruthneomaxim wrote:
Honestly, within the war-gaming community, Heroclix is a laughing stock. It is an imbalanced, mediocre game, created by a despicable company that builds obsolesence into their competitive community by always making new, and rarer models better than others. Its a cash-grab, and barely a game. :-p


Its business model is as despicable as MTG and x-wing, yet they seem to keep business afloat. I think its utility lies as a gateway game that shows people playing with 'small soldiers' is possible, rather than it being good by itself.

Newtruthneomaxim wrote:
What Benoit has created, and I say this as a designer myself, is a very clever game that both demonstrates a keen dice mechanic, but also a deep understanding of how to keep a game rich in meaningful player choices at every phase of play, while cutting out a lot of the extraneous stuff that can result in 100+ page rule-books with some minis games.


I think the rules still need to be more grounded. They need to be at least on the level of a x-wing rulebook, if they aim for competitive play.

I think the cards are extremely bloated, thinking because they have the space they can use it. This is horrible, and I don't know why you don't mention this. As a casual designer, this is unacceptable. They need to take a look at how Hearthstone reduces word count. The wordings are not consistent, either. They need keywords really hard.

Aiming for a simple to understand skirmish game should be the norm, not something to praise about. Even though the rules look simple, when they update the rulebook to a tournament level edition they won't look that simple. Having bloated card text really negates any advantage the game may gain with simple objectives and army preparation. People will be like: Ok that sounds simple... then spend a ton of time reading the texts, not knowing the timings, and referring to a FAQ houndreds of times because the text isn't clear.

For me, the praise lies in having overpowered gods. Games rarely do this, I only remember Cosmic Encounter doing this, and that game is old. Not commonly found in modern games that tend to make everything look dull.
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Benoit VOGT
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spartan67 wrote:
Is it just me or does anyone else see the heavy influence of Heroclix and even more so Heroscape in the mechanics of this game? I'm not complaining at all. I love both games. I'm just curious if this observation has already been discussed.


I can tell you that Heroclix did not influence the mechanisms of the Mythic Battles: Pantheon. I obviously know this Heroclix, but never played it, I did not read the rules or watched a video about it.
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mak logan
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Heroclix is one of the best games out there and it has been for us since 2001...15 years now and ongoing. I was there at zero point. Of course it has it's weakness but is evolving by every set. Don't disgrace a game mechanic just because you don't like it. Mythic battles seems to be a nice game but heroclix was and is an excellent game for comic fans.
There is much love for heroclix and many players around the world still enjoy playing it and noone seems to think that is a joke.
As for synergy or choices by combining different figures and powers (note powers , no stats) Mythic battles is just pale in comparison.
Note: I kickstarted mythic battles pantheon and really like the figures, I have no quarrel with anyone I just felt to express my thoughts on heroclix
 
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