Recommend
2 
 Thumb up
 Hide
13 Posts

BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » General Gaming

Subject: Ideas for a boardgame similar to RTS computer games rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Matt R
United States
Keller
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Moderators, please relocate this post where it should properly go to. I was not sure when I posted this novella.

While waiting for my copy of Tide of Iron I recently purchased a copy of the computer game "Dawn of War" for cheap. Dawn of War is a Warhammer 40,000 themed real time strategy game.

I was kind of struck with an idea for a new type of board game design but was wondering if any such board game currently exists that is similar to what I am thinking of. It would be a board game version of real time strategy (RTS) computer games such as Comand and Conquer (C&C), Starcraft, Warcraft (not World of Warcraft the MMORPG), etc. A recent comparison has been made, for example, between the computer game Company of Heroes and Tide of Iron.

For those who may not understand what a RTS is, basically it is a computer wargame where you start out with a small number of resources and units and you basically build up your forces by acquiring resources. So, in a fantasy themed RTS game (like the Warcraft series) you'd have units that are workers who mine for gold, chop down trees, etc. They help you build up your stockpile of various resources which you spend on purchasing new units, upgrades, and buildings. You keep doing that until you can build up a force big enough to take on the other player (in a multiplayer game) or to defeat the computer (representing one or more opposing sides). Usually there is a story and plot to go along with the single player game and you are given certain objectives to fulfill. A staple in RTS games is to limit you to what units and tech trees you can use in each mission (i.e. "level") and with each new level you gain access to use build options in the next tech tree.

To cut to the chase, I realize there are board games out there where you acquire resources and can build units and even buildings. For example, Axis & Allies lets you build units whereas Eagle Games (R.I.P.) had Age of Mythology where you could get different resources and build both units and buildings.

However, unlike these boardgames what I am looking for is the ability to have a bit more tactics in the actual combat rather than the fights being more abstract.

What I think I'm looking for is combat that is probably no more detailed than Tide of Iron, but gives you the ability to acquire resources to build units, upgrades to units, buildings, new technology, etc.

I'm probably imaging a mega-game but I can't help but think how fun something like that could be.

Anyone know of a game that might fit the bill for what I'm looking for? So far probably the closest thing I've found that I like a lot is Nexus Ops, but each side is identical to the other and there is no real "upgrades" or buildings really. Nexus Ops is a great little game for what it is, but I'm looking for *more*...

In case anyone really reads this far down, here is what I am imaging if I were to design it:
-Big hex board with modular pieces and overlay pieces (think BattleLore or Tide of Iron but even larger if you could believe it, or with smaller hexes so more could fit on the board)
-Plastic units - especially ones that could group together somehow (hmm, brings to mind, um BattleLore and Tide of Iron again). Ok, so I like toys
-More plastic pieces perhaps: Small buildings, perhaps little turrets or guard towers. Some cardboard would have to be used I'm sure. Some way to differentiate when a squad has been "upgraded" with some new weapon or specialist weapon.
-Some method of getting resources: Could be something like tiberium fields (C&C) or perhaps just use a resource hex that you must hold (similar to command points in ToI or resource points in the computer games Dawn of War and Company of Heroes).
-Would definitely have set limits on how many of each unit could be built.
-The actual gameplay should be similar to an actual RTS computer game of course but it wouldn't have to start out with an open field. You could have some scenarios setup where perhaps the player starting out on the defense (i.e. he already has emplaced stuff) has an advantage in that he already has a bunch of stuff laid out on the board when the game starts, but he has disadvantages in that he has to hold more territory or control hexes and he can't build much more (i.e. he already has all of his allocated turrets and buildings already out on the board).
-Perhaps single player (solo play) scenarios could be created such that the player's opposing side has set reinforcements that come in at certain times (just like in a RTS computer game) and the player has to take over certain control points/hexes before getting overwhelmed. Taking away control hexes from the opposite "computer" player reduces the number of enemy reinforcements that appear. I'm thinking of the old "Spacehulk" game here somewhat but with a little more variety in enemy units and tactics.

-The actual combat should be more tactical than games like Axis & Allies and Age of Mythology. I'm thinking something along the lines of where you can actually setup a line of artillery/archers behind a line of infantry or tanks or whatever and anything that comes within the range of your artillery (thinking 3 or so hexes as some kind of scale) then gets blasted and represents the same kind of tactics that can be employed in a RTS computer game. Obviously this wouldn't be anything particularly realistic but you could perhaps have morale effects, etc. The main idea is to have different units have their own strengths and weaknesses to help encourage building a variety of units. But you could still build up an "army" of cheap units to zergling rush an opponent if you wanted to.

-Multiplayer games could be setup so that each player has a different side or works as a team.

-Each different side could perhaps have different strengthes/weaknesses. For example, one side might have a smaller # of units and the units cost more, but are more powerful than a different side which focus more on quantity versus quality and has cheap but less powerful units.

Anyway, that was a book! For anyone who made it all the way through, I am really wondering if such a game already may exist. If not, then I wonder why such a game may not have been created yet? For those who may be interested in such a game I wonder if FFG or Days of Wonder or some other company may be that much closer to creating such a game since we have stuff like BattleLore and Tide of Iron out now?

For any wargamers who read this. Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if there is a chit or counter type game of this sort. I apologize - as much as I *want* to enjoy counter wargames I am just taken in too much by all the plastic of games like Axis & Allies and ToI. I know... I'm sure I'm missing out on some good games but its just me. However, I *do* wonder if there might not be some chit/counter games which could possibly be converted to use plastic, as heretical as that sounds. If there is such a chit or counter game like this, then please suggest it - I have played a few wargames in my lifetime although its been a while and I can't remember their names

Cheers.
 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James Davis
Australia
Canberra
flag msg tools
Avatar
Sorry to be so pedantic, but youve been saying through the whole post that you want something with lots of strategy and tactics like in RTS games. But with the ones youve mentioned there is really little strategy and tactics. I like RTS games but really the ones youved mentioned really dont have much thinking involved.

More to your point of the thread. I havent seen a game thats like an rts. Maybe viktory 2, but I havent played it so I cant really comment.

I am going to get warcraft, viktory 2 and the age of empires bord game soon, so Ill see what they are like. I am also thinking alot about tide of iron, and I really cant wait for starcraft the boardgame to be released, but we will see how money and other factors play out first.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt R
United States
Keller
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks for the response jamesdavis. You are correct, the games I mentioned aren't really all that heavy on "strategy". I think I really like tactics more.

What got me thinking about this idea was playing Dawn of War and using the (somewhat cheesy) tactic of building up a line of tough infantry and tanks and having them protect a few artillery vehicles. And then rolling the whole thing up into a group of opponents and wreaking havoc. Yes, I realize that isn't the most "strategic" thing in the world but it got me wondering if it wouldn't be possible to do such a thing in a boardgame but having control over unit production, without the whole experience being so abstract such as combat in the board games Axis & Allies and Age of Mythology or other games that have unit production.

I was also wondering if perhaps Starcraft the board game might be similar to what I'm looking for, but I guess we'll have to wait until more information comes out on it...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
James Davis
Australia
Canberra
flag msg tools
Avatar
Firstly if you like company of heroes, check out the old close combat series, they are way more indepth and have way more options. I enjoy COH infact Im playing through the campaign at the moment on extreme and after playing close combat, I just found myself asking where are my options. COH is very limited compared to close combat. Also give sudden strike 2 ago, its extremely tactical and is quite realistic, but in a very fun way.

But back to the real discussion. I see what you are after here. And I have been racking my mind trying to work out if there is anything like this, and so far the closest thing I can come up with is Viktory II, as I said I havent played that before so I cant really comment much about it.

Ill get to see what WarCraft: The Board Game is like in regards to if its like the pc game or not.

This game Age of Empires III: The Age of Discovery looks promising but I dont know so much about it.

Maybe you should try to make a game like what you are after. I would happily offer my services in helping you.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Walt
United States
Orange County
California
flag msg tools
Before terraforming Mars, Surviving Mars is required: Paradox Interactive; Steam.
badge
Please contact me about board gaming in Orange County.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Several games come to mind:
Car Wars...Car Wars Compendium
BattleTech
Crimson Skies (but maybe not Crimson Skies 2003?)
Ogre
Ironclads and Ether Flyers

While these don't have modular miniatures (which you seem to imply) they have custom designed units (more like Master of Orion I or II, or Alpha Centauri, than the limited upgrades of Starcraft); they do have extensive unit construction rules. They don't have mining like an RTS, but some (at least) have meta-rules allowing increased resources and progression.

I'm sure this isn't a complete list, as this category fades imperceptably into RPGs, such as Ironclads and Ether Flyers, which is a tactical system for Space 1889. Virtually all RPGs have configurable and upgradable characters, and many have rigid tactical combat systems that could be played competitively, instead of coopertatively against a GM--D&D and Hero/Champions comes to mind.

(Crimson Skies had an excellent flight sim + story line computer game, possibly still available and runable; as did Car Wars [called Autoduel], long, long ago.)

BattleTech seems like it would be a great combination with Heroscape--and maybe Lego so the 'mechs are modular miniatures. BattleTech already has rules for half cover (the 'mech is behind terrain half the height of the 'mech).

The richest ruleset seems to be Car Wars Compendium, but you have to find it, like the Mad Max schtick, and probably create house rules converting prestige to dollars. (This is one I've always wanted to play but never have managed, aside from Autoduel on computer.)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Robben
United States
Spring Hill
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Twilight Imperium?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
This is Kyoshi, our adopted Shiba Inu.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Go take a look at the rest of the Eagle Games line.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
marc lecours
Canada
ottawa
ontario
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
twilight imperium 3 fits a bit into what your looking for.

You are looking for a civ game with combat.

The grand daddy of them all is Civilization (the original board game from AH in the early 80s. It probably influenced all those computer rts games. But it had a really simple abstract combat system.

Good luck !
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Carl Gibbons
United States
Littleton
Colorado
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I haven't played it, but the only board game I've seen so far that I would classify as an RTS game is Space Dealer: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/23451. The simultaneous play mechanic using hourglass timers makes it real-time. It has research options, which reminds me of the tech trees of RTS computer games. However, at it's heart it looks like a resource trading game, not a combat game.

Perhaps a combat game using hourglass timers for resource generation and unit production/movement/attacks would provide the tactical experience you seek?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Hutnik
United States
Albany
New York
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nexus Ops definitely reminds me of an RTS.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt R
United States
Keller
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks for the responses everyone. I am familiar with Ogre and I did play Battletech and Car Wars when I was in high school in the '80s but I don't think they are quite what I was looking for.

After thinking on it some more I really believe that Nexus Ops comes the closest to the kind of game I'm thinking of, but I'd like more tactical combat options than what is available in Nexus Ops. I like the resource gathering in that game - I think that's about as detailed as I'd like it. I also like the hex board with different terrain but I'd like a much bigger board. For the most part I do enjoy the combat in Nexus Ops but I'm looking for something slightly deeper, but not nearly as deep as Battletech or Car Wars (nothing requiring pencils and paper to track stats).

In any case I'll look around some more. Even though I've never designed a board game before, I've added house rules enough times to make certain games more playable and I have several games to borrow parts from so I may just give it a shot.

[EDIT: A couple more responses came in while I was typing up my response, so looks like I'm not the only one who thinks that maybe Nexus Ops comes closest. Thanks again everyone.]

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Karl
Austria
Salzburg
Salzburg
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
For a smaller scale I'd say the Warcraft boardgame fits your description quite well. It lacks any nifty plastic pieces however.

For a larger scale I'd probably recommend Twilight Imperium.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonathan Ferro
United States
San Francisco
California
flag msg tools
mb
What you actually want is a good set of miniatures rules. There's no other way a tabletop game is going to have both cool plastic bits *and* the variety of units and strategies that you want.

I think the boardgame that comes closest to what you are looking for is Throneworld, but it's all cardboard, just as you suspected.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.