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Subject: Playing with a Frame rss

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Lee Valentine
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Have any of you used a chipboard or laser-cut frame to keep the pieces from sliding out of place so much? My young daughter is almost six, and we had fun with this on the iPad. My wife and I gave my daughter a copy of the physical game for Christmas, and it was so hard for her to play because the tiles kept moving around. It bothered me too, because some of the game parts were not well cut, and don't fit together well. I am thinking of sanding some of the tiles a bit, which would help one problem, but I am not sure whether a frame would help keep the tiles from sliding off the board.

A frame would have to be two layers: one to surround the board, and a second layer to overlap the edge of the player board.

Thoughts?


Lee
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Greg Darcy
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The frame doesn't need to be two layers. From memory the tiles are around 2mm or 3mm (1/8") thick. As is the board. A standard sheet of thin MDF is 6mm (1/4") so just the one sheet would be needed.
 
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Lee Valentine
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Greg, the reason that I said that there needs to be two layers is that I think the boards already have an edge around them. So a frame that was just around the physical perimeter of the board would be a bit short of actually framing the pieces. You'd need a frame around the physical board and then a layer on top of that to frame the physical pieces sitting on the board. You'd then connect the top frame to the lower frame, so that it would all travel wherever the player board slid to.

Of course, you could make a frame out of one piece of material if you hollowed out a space the thickness of the underlying player board.

If you are creating a frame out of chipboard (which seems to be a cheap, obvious potential choice), then it's likely that you'd have to use a two-layer frame as I've described since I do not know an easy way of routing away part of a layer of chipboard absent resort to a laser cutter.

Lee
 
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Jonas Henriksson
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You could use a single layer if you glued it directly on the board. I know plenty of people who would cringe at that thought though

It would be a really cool hobby projects to make your own copy of the game. I´m thinking magnetic pieces with actual cloth on. To bad the pieces are two sided, otherwise you could actually add actual buttons the them also.
 
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Greg Darcy
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I checked my copy. You are right. There is a 5mm boundary around the whole board. I am not convinced it would invalidate my approach though. In fact it may make it easier to place the pieces. And 10mm would not be enough of a gap for the pieces to lose their place completely.

You could always add some stringing (Narrow pieces of wood) to fill the gap later if it did prove to be a problem.

As for routing chip board, a very sharp HSS router bit will do the trick. It is one case where I prefer HSS over Tungsten for router bits. I would NEVER rout MDF. The dust is carcinogenic.

I would not recommend a jigsaw to cut the board. Board that thin is quite fragile and it will probably snap. If you don't have a scroll saw, a fret saw or piercing saw would be the best bet. Or course, if you have a FEIN multi tool you are laughing!

 
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Rich Charters
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Sounds like a lot of work!

I would recommend you play the game as it. It'll be good for your daughter's development of concentration and hand-eye coordination.

Have fun.
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Lee Valentine
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richcharters wrote:
Sounds like a lot of work!

I would recommend you play the game as it. It'll be good for your daughter's development of concentration and hand-eye coordination.

Have fun.


I expect it's about 30 minutes of work with some chipboard and a utility knife. To make a frame, you just need to cut out two squares, cut a smaller square out of each, and glue them together.

I would prefer playing with one too. I have traded games away after one play because of constantly shifting tiles.

Lee
 
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Greg Darcy
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I had a thought overnight.

Mat board is very easily cut with a knife. It is strong and about 2mm thick. For two layers, just glue two pieces together with double sided tape. Probably about 10 minutes work
 
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Lee Valentine
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GregDarcy wrote:
I had a thought overnight.

Mat board is very easily cut with a knife. It is strong and about 2mm thick. For two layers, just glue two pieces together with double sided tape. Probably about 10 minutes work


I have chipboard, which is much the same idea. I am surprised that nobody else has complained. I'm 44, and I found the sliding tiles to be a nuisance. I suspect that small children like my daughter would find this highly frustrating.

Lee
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James
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I made a set of felt "boards" with the grid stitched onto them. That cuts down considerably on pieces slipping around, and works well with the theme As well.
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Russ Williams
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hudarklord wrote:
I have chipboard, which is much the same idea. I am surprised that nobody else has complained. I'm 44, and I found the sliding tiles to be a nuisance. I suspect that small children like my daughter would find this highly frustrating.

FWIW I've played a couple dozen times with several different sets (a friend's, a store's, a con library's) and never thought it was a problem or even thought it as a hypothetical problem. I don't recall ever hearing or seeing it even mentioned before this thread.
 
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Lee Valentine
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Random Order wrote:
I made a set of felt "boards" with the grid stitched onto them. That cuts down considerably on pieces slipping around, and works well with the theme As well.


That sounds great.

Lee
 
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Lee Valentine
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russ wrote:
I don't recall ever hearing or seeing it even mentioned before this thread.


Well, do your pieces fit loosely? I have seen at least one or two other posts here where the pieces are not well tooled, so if you try to actually push them together, they cause the other pieces to scatter and then require you to apply a lot of force to pull the two pieces apart that you just fit together. We have a number of pieces like that, and it makes me upset with the manufacturer. I thought I was going to destroy two pieces that one of us had fit together; they just don't snap and unsnap like jigsaw pieces, but instead cling together tightly once you interlock them.

My grid was not moving as much as my daughter's because I was just letting the poor-fitting pieces sit on top of each other. My daughter was trying to fit the pieces together jig-saw style and they were flying all over the place because they were poorly tooled.

The fact that she is only about six magnified the problem. If you can accurately determine how big a piece is before you purchase it, then you'll just drop it in place. My daughter was "testing" the pieces in various places, and it was sending other pieces sliding every which way. With a frame, there would have been MUCH less of a problem.

The two problems together made a mess out of her board and would have made my mess out of the board if I had tried to lay the pieces down "jigsaw"-style instead of just letting pieces get propped up by other ill-fitting pieces.

Lee
 
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Russ Williams
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hudarklord wrote:
russ wrote:
I don't recall ever hearing or seeing it even mentioned before this thread.


Well, do your pieces fit loosely? I have seen at least one or two other posts here where the pieces are not well tooled, so if you try to actually push them together, they cause the other pieces to scatter and then require you to apply a lot of force to pull the two pieces apart that you just fit together.


I've occasionally had some pieces not fit, but we never applied so much force that pieces went sliding or flying. Like you said, you can just let one sit slightly above the other.

Quote:
The fact that she is only about six magnified the problem. If you can accurately determine how big a piece is before you purchase it, then you'll just drop it in place. My daughter was "testing" the pieces in various places, and it was sending other pieces sliding every which way.

We visualize our fits with no problem, so we don't generally move pieces around "testing" them in various places. We just choose the piece we want and put it down on our board where we want it to go.

I can certainly imagine it being more of a problem with a young child testing pieces in various places, indeed.

(That seems to also risk forgetting where in the circle the currently tested piece came from, in case the player wants to put it back and start testing a different piece.)
 
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M. C. DeMarco
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hudarklord wrote:
russ wrote:
I don't recall ever hearing or seeing it even mentioned before this thread.


Well, do your pieces fit loosely? I have seen at least one or two other posts here where the pieces are not well tooled, so if you try to actually push them together, they cause the other pieces to scatter and then require you to apply a lot of force to pull the two pieces apart that you just fit together. We have a number of pieces like that, and it makes me upset with the manufacturer. I thought I was going to destroy two pieces that one of us had fit together; they just don't snap and unsnap like jigsaw pieces, but instead cling together tightly once you interlock them.

My grid was not moving as much as my daughter's because I was just letting the poor-fitting pieces sit on top of each other. My daughter was trying to fit the pieces together jig-saw style and they were flying all over the place because they were poorly tooled.

The fact that she is only about six magnified the problem. If you can accurately determine how big a piece is before you purchase it, then you'll just drop it in place. My daughter was "testing" the pieces in various places, and it was sending other pieces sliding every which way. With a frame, there would have been MUCH less of a problem.

The two problems together made a mess out of her board and would have made my mess out of the board if I had tried to lay the pieces down "jigsaw"-style instead of just letting pieces get propped up by other ill-fitting pieces.

Lee


If you can't fix the tooling issues by filing down a few pieces, I'd request replacements. I was also thinking that a square of sheer (but not slippery) fabric over the board might be more useful than a frame--a frame could get in the way once the board is nearly full and make it too hard to move pieces.
 
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Laura "lelo" D. Arrowsmith Deddens Gerard
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russ wrote:
(That seems to also risk forgetting where in the circle the currently tested piece came from, in case the player wants to put it back and start testing a different piece.)


We have a house rule? procedure? that when you are testing a piece the other player puts his finger in the spot where you got the piece from so that when you put it back in the circle you know right where it goes.


Anyways, with our copy, the pieces fit together perfectly. We never have to force anything. If your copy has a problem with some pieces not fitting with other pieces I'd ask for replacements before modifying.

When testing, we don't actually place the piece on the board, just hover it over the top. Once we place it then testing is over and that is the piece you buy. Not sure if that works for a 6 y.o.

I do like the ideas of custom felt pieces and magnetic ones.
 
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