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Subject: Reducing Game Length rss

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mark coomey
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I 've recently bought this game, and although production quality is fantastic, it is a bit of a luckfest. And to play this type of game for 90 mins seems a tad long for what it is.

I thought this may be a good option by making this game slightly quicker to play, say instead of 12 turns it is reduced to 9 or maybe a bit too drastic, 6. And possibly reducing the number of tavern cards in a game. This might be quite cool as not all the cards will be used and so you're not entirely sure what's left in the deck.

has anyone tried this at all?
 
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Peter Loop
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Re:Reducing Game Length
wizardless (#25587),
Make sure the pirate ends at tresure island on the last turn, how ever you shorten the game - it is a very important part of the game.

Our games take about about 1 hour, which isn't too long.
There is honor in runniing away. Easy to learn and teach - I good intro game. High marks in my book.
Make sure you have your bottle of Rum handy!!

Peter (The Pirate)
 
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Brad Miller
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Re:Reducing Game Length
Peter Loop wrote:
wizardless (#25587),
Make sure the pirate ends at tresure island on the last turn, how ever you shorten the game - it is a very important part of the game.


I beg to differ. While I can see how having blackbeard there on the last turn has value, I don't think it is very important. I've played using the "semi-random blackbeard" variant in pretty much all but my first couple of games. While sometimes he may end up there on the last turn, at other times he may not. And what about the "random roll" rule variant, (or was that the original rule, I can't recall). Did that have as a proviso that on the last turn he always moves to treasure island? I think the "semi-random" variant makes the game sooo much better than either of the two published rules, whether or not he ends up on Treasure Island is moot.
 
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Peter Loop
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Re:Reducing Game Length
Windopaene (#25603),
I beg to differ. While I can see how having blackbeard there on the last turn has value, I don't think it is very important.


So here is my case hy it is important to have the legendary pirate end on treasure island:
The impact is how you play treasures in the endgame.

From the rule book.
"Treasure Island (# 6) Bury treasures from the ship’s hold for 1 point of fame each."
" Any treasure or gold coins that were not buried on Treasure Island is lost and worth no fame."

So you must go to treasure island and bury treasures to get any Fame points (and with Captain Flint’s parrot – You may carry an unlimited number of treasures so that could be alot)

"3. Combat – Beginning with ships moored off Tavern Island and proceeding in westward direction, resolve any combat. Combat occurs on any outer island (islands 1 – 5) where 2 or more ships are present, and on Treasure Island when running into a Legendary Pirate anchored there."

So players don't fight on Treasure island, but must fight the Legendary Pirate if he is there. So unless you know you can beat the Pirate or think enough other players with go to help fight, you will not go to treasure island on the last turn, or if you do so it is at great risk.

Not having the Legendary Prirate end on Treasure island makes cashing in treasures a slamdunk, having him there makes it an issue, and if you beat the legendary pirate there is the fame attached with that too.

In close games (often) this is the difference between 1st and 2nd place.

 
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Brad Miller
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Re:Reducing Game Length
Peter Loop (#25611),

No I understand what you are saying, and why it's a good thing to have him end up there on the last turn. However, I'm saying that using the "semi-random" blackbeard variant is far better than any other "regular" blackbeard rule, so much better that I can live with the times when there's no chance he'll end up there on the last turn.

Which rule did Pirate's Cove choose, (LPs move one Island every turn, or the random roll thing)? I think the former, but I've only played that version once, and we used "semi-random" there as well. I do prefer Piratenbucht over PC though, so what do I know
 
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mark coomey
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Re:Reducing Game Length
anyhow...back to the topic in hand...will the game work by simply reducing the number of turns in the game?
 
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Eric Hautemont
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Re:Reducing Game Length
wizardless (#25621),yes the game will work. However, a simpler way to reduce the time it takes to play is to play with 3-4 players. Our 3-4 player games typically take 45-10 min. max.
If you reduce the game to say 9 turns, remove the corresponding # of treasure cards (ie 3 from each stack) , and start the Legendary Pirates where they would be on turn 4 (ie the first one on Island #4 the other one on Island # 2 if you play with 3 players and 2 LPs).
I would not remove any cards from the Tavern deck.
enjoy!
eric @ DoW
 
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Alan Kaiser
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Re:Reducing Game Length
wizardless (#25587),

As far as reducing the number of turns to make the game shorter, I doubt the game would be as good. 6 turns is definitely too short. The game is all about earning fame and having multiple ways to earn fame is an important part of the game. By limiting the game to 6 turns you effectivily eliminate gaining fame by taking on the legendary pirates because you don't have enough time to build up the necessary strength to take them on. While fame is what wins the game for you, combat is at the heart of the game, specifically combat between the players. With only 6 turns, it's pretty hard to take on anyone who manages to draw a mastercraft or parrot card. In my experience, (4 games) players spend the first couple turns trying to avoid conflict. Add in the fact that several times in a game (maybe 2-4 depending on the players) there is no conflict on a turn and you could have a very unsatisfying short game.

With 9 turns you have a reasonable amount of time to do what you want to in the game but I would question the time savings here. Just by playing a couple times you can probably speed up the game enough to accomidate for the extra 3 turns. After 4 games, the first couple went a little long but the last 2 were finished in about an hour.

As far as the Tavern cards, I just don't see the need to cut down on their number at all. You are never sure what is left in the deck even if you play with all the cards because each player probably has at least several unplayed Tavern cards in front of them. Sure these might just be fame cards but they could also be Battle, Volley, Mastercraft or anything else just as easily.
 
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Sean Sicher
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Re:Reducing Game Length
The best suggestion I have for speeding the game up is to allow players not involved in combat starting plundering their island and doing their upgrades. You need to be careful if there is a gold or treasure shortage, but for the most part this works very well. Even with new players (therefore needing to go through the rules) we can play through a game in about 45 minutes to an hour.
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Sinister
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Re:Reducing Game Length
Our games usually last less than an hour. I don't even think the demo lasted 90 minutes. We never wait for combat, those not involved plunder and upgrade. We keep moving right along...
 
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