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The World of SMOG: Rise of Moloch» Forums » General

Subject: CMON Burnout? rss

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Evan Chauvette
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This is the first project in a long time that I have seen from CMON games that has not drawn me in at all.

I went overboard on mini games last year: Sword and Sorcery, Massive Darkness, Mythic Battles: Pantheon, Arcadia Quest: Inferno, Myth: journeyman, Evil Dead 2, Dark Souls...

I took one look at this and basically said it's just more of the same. There might be another mechanic or two that sets it apart, but I just don't need another game with pretty miniatures.

Anyone else in the same boat?
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Chris Meeusen

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I think you could say that about the majority of the games like the ones you mentioned. But that can also be said of any genre/category like Euro, card trick based, dice rolling that its just "another mechanic or two that sets it apart". Just depends on how different it needs to be for you to enjoy it.
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Chris Schafer
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JusticeProctor wrote:
This is the first project in a long time that I have seen from CMON games that has not drawn me in at all.

I went overboard on mini games last year: Sword and Sorcery, Massive Darkness, Mythic Battles: Pantheon, Arcadia Quest: Inferno, Myth: journeyman, Evil Dead 2, Dark Souls...

I took one look at this and basically said it's just more of the same. There might be another mechanic or two that sets it apart, but I just don't need another game with pretty miniatures.

Anyone else in the same boat?


I'm with you. Love the figs and I'm really trying to rationalize why I need this one but I already have so many games like it that I don't have the time to play this one as a campaign and that seems to be the big draw here.
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James Orr
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That sounds like it makes sense for you having backed all those, but possibly for some who maybe don't like some of those other genres and are big steampunk fans this could be right up their alley. Or some who missed out backing the others.

It's a different genre at least than say another fantasy with only a small twist.
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Greg
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The style and game mechanics do look unique with this game, but yes, I definitely went overboard with miniatures games in 2016 and really wondering how many more I could possibly want.
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Ubergeek
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I backed it on impulse but after reading the rules and watching a play-through I'm ready to back out of it. Here's my considerations:

Pro's
- Cool minis
- Steampunk theme
- Ether transfer mechanic

Con's
- One vs. many I can live with but you always need to play four gentlemen. Given I'd likely play this mostly with 2 players that becomes annoying to have four character boards out and follow all the special abilities of each.
- Scenario based and one-off based play. That's great but if I want to play an advanced chapter as a one-off, I need to modify everything to deal with the power creep requirements of that scenario such as adding certain cards for certain characters, etc. Again, annoying. And as for scenario play, I didn't see anything to assist as a save mode between play unless you're playing all the scenarios in one shot. It might be there but I've missed it for now if it is.
- Play seemed repetitious. Move your guy, roll dice to attack, use an ability to reroll, roll for blocking, resolve results. Seemingly over and over with the occasional move to open a door or take an item. This is true of many adventure games but it's enough of a reason for me to not add another one with similar mechanics.
- I'm in the same boat in having lots of games that do everything in this one either already, or better, just sans steampunk theme. There's just nothing revolutionary or evolutionary about this game I can see.
- No co-op mode. If Mansions of Madness: Second Edition and Mechs vs. Minions can pull it off, so could this. After reading the rules, I don't think it would be hard to add a system where players play against the game. It looks to be very suitable to an App driven opponent as with Mansions of Madness: Second Edition.
- Additional expansions that up the price to over $150 if you opt for them.

That's JMHO.
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Jason
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JusticeProctor wrote:
This is the first project in a long time that I have seen from CMON games that has not drawn me in at all.

I went overboard on mini games last year: Sword and Sorcery, Massive Darkness, Mythic Battles: Pantheon, Arcadia Quest: Inferno, Myth: journeyman, Evil Dead 2, Dark Souls...

I took one look at this and basically said it's just more of the same. There might be another mechanic or two that sets it apart, but I just don't need another game with pretty miniatures.

Anyone else in the same boat?

I only backed 3 of those games, and I'm still looking at this as more of the same. The theme and minis are cool, but the gameplay looks very cookie-cutter. I wish there was some sort of interesting hook to the gameplay, but as is this looks fairly bland.

I skipped on Massive Darkness for similar reasons. There wasn't anything gameplay wise that really stood out as amazing.
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ian short
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I'm currently backing both this and "day night Z", although I'll probably drop both pledges.

But I have a stack of mini games already, with the others and the latest imperial assault expansions being the latest in a long line of purchases, and both massive darkness and folklore awaiting fulfilment. I'm also planning on backing rising Sun when it is on KS.

While both SMOG and DNZ look great, and I would have backed them without hesitation last year, I'm now struggling to see what hole in my collection they would fill. They would probably just look pretty and take up some quickly decreasing shelf space.

By Xmas I'll have used up all the space I have available for board games and future purchases will be on a one in one out basis. It's time to start buying smart, and for that reason I'm having to evaluate all my CMON games against those I've already purchased because soon I'll have to start thinking about which ones to let go
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Oscar Iglesias
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Interesting enough that I dont backed a lot of previous projects because of... "they are more of the same".
And about this one... yeah, im on the Edge.
Seems the Nth 1 vs Many Dungeon Crawler style, with tons of wondeful minis, aye.
Recently I backed The Others and fear this one overlaps with it.
Still waiting to keep in or move out...
 
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Rich Moore
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The selling point here is absolutely the theme. I haven't seen this genre represented in a miniatures game of this type before. Plus, the art and production looks excellent. I could see myself enjoying this as an alternative to the numerous fantasy options.

Game play has a few unique tweeks (ether management in particular....but this is reminiscent of other mechanisms like descent doom and mansions of madness 1st edition). I also like the option for one-off adventures. They've already noted that each scenario will provide instructions on how to upgrade characters for balance if doing a standalone scenario. Personally, I have yet to finish a campaign in any of these types of games.

I could see, though, if you bought half a dozen of these miniature heavy, coop or 1 vs many games in the last couple of years how the prospect of buying another one, only to not have time to play, would steer you away. That's a good reason to stop buying and enjoy the games you own!
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John E
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Same for me although it's not CMON burnout specifically. It's more the mini-heavy or crawlerish genre as a whole. It's the same on the euro side -- if a lavish, dense product like Scythe hit kickstarter every other month eventually people would start saying 'yeah, looks amazing but I have so many to play already'.

It didn't help that I recently got BattleLore v2 and Zombicide Black Plague, plus Arcadia Quest Inferno supposedly shipping in the next month or so. Don't even want to think about more painting projects right now, although the game itself is still a year away.
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Keith Jones
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jamesorr wrote:
That sounds like it makes sense for you having backed all those, but possibly for some who maybe don't like some of those other genres and are big steampunk fans this could be right up their alley. Or some who missed out backing the others.

It's a different genre at least than say another fantasy with only a small twist.


This is me. I didn't back any CMON Kickstarters last year. Some looked okay, but none called to me. CMON is a great company, but a lot of their games are just not for me. I love the World of SMOG theme, and these minis are cooler than a lot of other ones (to me); the game looks solid, fun, and interesting. And while a lot of folks feel overwhelmed by the number of "one vs. many" (which I hereby denote OvsM) games, I actually do not own any at all. So while some people might ask "how can we need another OvsM?" my answer is: because this is the first one that I want. So I'm glad they're doing it. Most of the other OvsM games have a number of compelling qualities, but they also have downsides that make me not want them.

I actually find the whole "This game has mechanism X, but those dozen other games already have mechanism X; why on earth are they making another one?!" argument annoying. Nobody would ever say "there are so many fully competitive games, how come we need another one?" or "do we really need another cooperative game?" If a new game has its own design otherwise, has some new and fresh ideas, or combines mechanisms in new and interesting ways, has distinct theme and feel, and if the gameplay is solid, then it is a worthy addition to the market. And the market will decide.
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Silver Bowen
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I love the art direction and mini design. History has taught me that no coop = no playtime, however (The Others, Conan). So I've got a close eye on the campaign and $1 pledge, but that's it.
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Jason Rupp
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I dunno... I think this looks better than Massive Darkness. It has a few things I think are new enough to give it a shot.

* The ether mechanic where the more you use it the stronger the enemy gets
* The selection of player order is pretty cool too
* I like the campaign aspect of it.

Massive darkness didn't really have anything fresh (although I did back it still).
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Jack Francisco
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For me, I don't mind playing multiple characters as long as it isn't cumbersome...a la Zombicide Black Plague. I remember how agonizing it was to play 4 characters solo in Arkham Horror and it left me scarred.
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Mr Suitcase
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senorcoo wrote:
For me, I don't mind playing multiple characters as long as it is cumbersome...a la Zombicide Black Plague. I remember how agonizing it was to play 4 characters solo in Arkham Horror and it left me scarred.


I think you mean ISN'T, Jack.
 
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Kevin Hann
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If you enjoy 1 vs many dungeon crawl games, seeing that this is coming from CMON and from what I've scene so far, it will probably be on if the best when it comes out. It's definitely taking the best mechanics from all the other dungeon crawls out there so far (Level 7 Omega Protocol, Descent, Imerial Assault, etc). Also you really have no idea if many of the other undelivered Kickstarters from other companies are going to be any good where chances are with a CMON Kickstarter project, you'll get a solid game. Yes I'm a CMON fanboy as well. Also from what I see, the campaign play in this is simpler (in a good way) than many other types of these games. For example, Star Wars Imperial Assault just has too much going on to deal with between missions. Also it doesn't appear to heavily reward one side vs another based on who wins each mission. Both sides will equally gear up between scenarios. In Imperial Assault and Descent there is a definite problem with the rich getting richer.
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Jack Francisco
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Haha! Correct. Brain-cramp.
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Jack Swan
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One vs group style will probably not hit our table so often, so I really shouldn't back this. Therefore I need more excuses than simply telling myself these miniatures look SO great for roleplaying purposes.

Any help with more and better excuses is very much appreciated
 
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Evan Chauvette
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I'll say this to the request for excuses to not back something:

I've never, ever regretted not backing a game. I've cancelles 5 or 6 pledges, and i've never regretted those either.

Don't let Kickstarter suck you into making pledges but you don't really want to or can't afford to make. There are a thousand games out there that are already available, well-reviewed, and are definitely worth the money.

Kickstarter has a way of creating artificial value, of making you feel like you are missing out if you don't get this pledge right now. It's never true.
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Jason Rupp
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JusticeProctor wrote:
I'll say this to the request for excuses to not back something:

I've never, ever regretted not backing a game. I've cancelles 5 or 6 pledges, and i've never regretted those either.

Don't let Kickstarter suck you into making pledges but you don't really want to or can't afford to make. There are a thousand games out there that are already available, well-reviewed, and are definitely worth the money.

Kickstarter has a way of creating artificial value, of making you feel like you are missing out if you don't get this pledge right now. It's never true.


On the flipside, i've never regreted backing a cmon game i didn't like rum and bones at all but i still made all my money back (and then some) by selling it on ebay.
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Richard Keene
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rrrrupp wrote:
JusticeProctor wrote:
I'll say this to the request for excuses to not back something:

I've never, ever regretted not backing a game. I've cancelles 5 or 6 pledges, and i've never regretted those either.

Don't let Kickstarter suck you into making pledges but you don't really want to or can't afford to make. There are a thousand games out there that are already available, well-reviewed, and are definitely worth the money.

Kickstarter has a way of creating artificial value, of making you feel like you are missing out if you don't get this pledge right now. It's never true.


On the flipside, i've never regreted backing a cmon game i didn't like rum and bones at all but i still made all my money back (and then some) by selling it on ebay.

This is my stance if I have any interest in the game at all. I also recently sold the basic pledge expansions and exclusive heroes of Rum and Bones for $90. I still have the base game if I ever choose to play it, so basically, free game.
 
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Oscar Iglesias
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Playing multiple characters feels "counter-inmersive" to me.
Hope they find a way to play with fewer characters instead of forcing some players to use multiple characters at once.
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Juha M
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I don't think there is a CMON burnout. There is a board game burnout.

Lets face it, the minis are getting better all the time. It's not only CMON that creates great minis for their games. There are so many other games with minis that have been released past fall, that people are not jumping on a 1 vs All game with a previous enthusiasm. The game has great theme, looks solid, but with so many other similar games it doesn't have the same punch anymore.

People don't have infinite wallets, and I think as the time goes by the money will be shared by many more games, with each one making less money.
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Jon Darlington
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2015 and 2016 were my introduction to Kickstarter, and I went a bit nuts. Most were CMON games (but also Conan, Scythe, and a few others).

I don't regret backing anything, but some of the novelty has worn off and so I'm being more selective from now on.

Rise of Moloch has a big strike against it because it has fundamental similarities to The Others (some different mechanics, but a similar game experience). Despite that I'm backing this project, because the theme is so engaging and the miniatures look amazing. I don't have any other miniatures like this anywhere in my extensive collection, so I'm happy to back this game just for the components.

That said, it's always possible that this might supplant The Others in our game roster. We'll see.
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