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Subject: Charybdis rss

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Francis Rivest
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
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If you move whitout moving up on a lower level whirlpool to a third level whirlpool, is it considered moving up? (since its kinda like teleporting)...or do you have to move up into a whirlpool (example ; a level 1 whirlpool from ground) and the other whirlpool is on level 3, then i suppose that's a win..right?

In the same line, can you go down in a whirlpool vs Hades?
 
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Niko
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Calgary
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Gazevil wrote:
If you move whitout moving up on a lower level whirlpool to a third level whirlpool, is it considered moving up? (since its kinda like teleporting)...or do you have to move up into a whirlpool (example ; a level 1 whirlpool from ground) and the other whirlpool is on level 3, then i suppose that's a win..right?

In the same line, can you go down in a whirlpool vs Hades?
I don't have the rules in front of me, but I bet it comes down to the distinction between "move" and "force".
Check the exact wording on the whirlpools and that will tell you if it is considered a movement. If it is forced then you don't win, even if you moved up into the first whirlpool.
 
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Michael Van Biesbrouck
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Charybdis in the printed rulebook gives you an extra move that must be taken immediately. Move restrictions happen both when you get on the whirlpool and when it moves you. If you aren't allowed to take the second move (because of move restrictions or because the first move would win), you aren't allowed to move onto the whirlpool to begin with.

This isn't particularly obvious and there has been some effort to revise obscure issues with things that end your turn early (such as winning) and Charybdis in general.
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Dapperghast Meowregard
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Eagan
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I think the question was if there are portals on level 1 and level 3, if you move from a level 1 or level 2 space onto the level 1 portal, do you win?
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Paul Saxberg
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As Michael said, the wording on this god is still being adjusted. There may be a contradiction to this posted later.

For now, you will be playing it closest to Gord's original vision if you treat the destination spot (e.g. after going through the whirlpool) as the final spot the piece moves to... thus, for now:

Whirlpooling up to a L3 counts as a win.
Pan whirlpooling down from L2 to L0 counts as a win.
Eros whirlpooling to his lover is a win.

Walking up to an L3 that has a whirlpool on it that leads down is not a win.
Pan jumping down 2 onto a whirlpool that leads up to a higher level is not a win.

Etc.
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Entrecruzado
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I don't get this... Any player´s worker can use Charybdis whirpools?

I need a video yo understand its movement.

robot
 
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Francis Rivest
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Alright thanks! This seems fair enough
 
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TPoG
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ISBN: 1-85723-146-5
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Hmm...
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Entrecruzado wrote:
I don't get this... Any player´s worker can use Charybdis whirpools?

I need a video yo understand its movement.

robot

Yep. However only Charybdis place the whirlpools.
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Paul Saxberg
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Video's coming.

For now - if both whirlpools are in play, any worker (from any player) that Moves onto one Moves automatically to the other. This *is* considered a Move, not a Force, and is considered to be in the same direction(s) as the Move you did to get there, for powers like Bia, Aeolus, Athena, etc.).

If a worker is already on the other, you will not be able to move through the whirlpool.
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Paolo Russo
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Last sentence: when one whirlpool token is built on or removed from the board, goes to your card.

Built on means "if someone build on the space with the whirlpool"?

Removed: who and when removes the whirlpool?
 
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Paul Saxberg
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Yes, that's what "built on" means.

Removed: some current/potential future powers have the ability to remove tokens. Example: Medea. In a case like this, put it back as if it were built on.
 
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Lee Mitchell
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From the 2016-08-14 rulebook ... "This move is considered to be in the same direction as the previous move."

I move my worker, on my turn, "east and up" onto a level 1 Whirlpool and it is moved to a level 3 Whirlpool. Since the move is in the direction of the previous move, the worker has "moved up" on to level 3, so I win.

I move my worker "east' on to level 1 Whirlpool, and it is moved to a level 3 Whirlpool. Since the move is in the direction of the previous move, the worker has not "moved up" on to level 3, so I don't win.

Now, I'm Pan and I move my worker up (or on the same level) to a level 2 Whirlpool, and it is moved to a ground floor Whirlpool. Since the move is in the same direction of the previous move, the worker has not "moved down", so I don't win. Only in the case of "moving down" from level 3 to a level 2 Whirlpool and then being moved to a ground-floor Whirlpool does the worker satisfy the alternate Win Condition allowing me to win the game.

As the rule is currently written it also means that up/down restricted gods (e.g. Hermes, Prometheus), or other gods in a match against Athena, Hades, Persephone, etc. could use Whirlpools to circumvent the restrictions - as long as their move on to the Whirlpool token is valid. I.e. Prometheus doesn't "move up" onto the Whirlpool token, or against Persephone your move is a "move up" onto Whirlpool token.

(And before I get hit with moves end when you step onto a Whirlpool so Hermes/Atalanta can't keep running afterwards. They can. Both say they can move any number of times. Not any number of spaces. So moving onto a Whirlpool, and being moved, doesn't mean I can't then move that worker again.)
 
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Michael Van Biesbrouck
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The direction is just a compass direction, not a change in elevation. With the version of the power in that rulebook there are two moves, both in the same direction but with independent elevation changes. You win on the second move based on the actual elevation change.
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Simon R
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Truthfully, the wording for Charybdis is lacking somewhat in intuitiveness.

Paul's post (further up) broke down how it is intended to work in various situations; but in trying to condense all of those rulings into a nice neat wording it lost something in the process.

There are ongoing attempts to nail down a definitive wording which works clearly for all of those situations, but it is not quite there yet.
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Lee Mitchell
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'Up' isn't a direction - are you serious?

Nowhere in the rules are 'directions' defined as compass directions as Michael has stated, so I have assumed that the common usage for 'directions' would apply. Forward, back, left, right, north, south, up, down, etc.

Anywho, to each their own. Until the rules are officially updated you can interpret your way and I'll interpret mine. (House rules ftw!)
 
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Russ Williams
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strongbow25 wrote:
'Up' isn't a direction - are you serious?

Nowhere in the rules are 'directions' defined as compass directions as Michael has stated, so I have assumed that the common usage for 'directions' would apply. Forward, back, left, right, north, south, up, down, etc.

Interesting.

FWIW, this use of "direction" (in the horizontal sense) and similar such terminology seems very common to me in abstract strategy games which include a stacking element (in which the vertical dimension necessarily always works differently from north/south and east/west dimensions - the game design itself is constrained and influenced by gravity, after all. E.g. it's impossible for a pawn to move directly up or directly down.)

But I can see why it might be confusing to anyone not used to that convention.
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JV Villacorta
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I just needed to clarify if we are playing it correctly.
When playing Charybdis, I can purposely removed my whirlpool token by building on it so I can place it on another unoccupied space (or on same space it was built on) at the end of the same turn, correct?
 
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Michael Van Biesbrouck
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Yes, that's correct.
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JV Villacorta
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Thanks!

1d8 = (6) = 6
 
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  • 1162835. jvbata
  • 1d8 =
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  • Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:07 am
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