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Subject: Expansions announced rss

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Matt Price
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First four expansions announced:

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/1/30/command...
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Michael Wheal
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$30 / box

4-8 minis, most have just 4. Yes, I know they have cards too..

Ouch.

Let the GW praise begin !

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Matt Price
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I know right? A bit pricey... Especially if you really need to get all of them for the cards and such, or even duplicates if you want to field a large unit.

Edit: Oh cool, they've dropped the price to $25. I wonder if they were planning that all along, or what?
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D Clevenger
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Are these painted or not? I couldn't retell from a quick read. Did I miss it?
 
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Michael Wheal
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un-painted
 
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Chris Montgomery
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Not painted. Way too expensive. Under the old FOLGS rules, I'd be able to get these for $15-18 / box, which is an acceptable price. At these prices, they aren't going to win over gamers and they aren't going to gain cross-over gamers.

This makes me doubt the survivability of this game for the first time. I had just assumed that prices would be lower. For $30, I sort of expected even the Waiqar infantry to be 12 figs, not 8. A price of $3-4 per fig seems fair, but $7+ per fig is nearly downright outrageous - right up there with Games Workshop:

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Empire-Archers-Huntsmen

Only you get more for a cheaper price . . . just not what I was expecting.

Hope the figs measure up! I haven't decided to bail on this game, but I am now doubting its prospects.
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Derry Salewski
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Yeah I don't see this successfully muscling in on anyone's turf at these price points.
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Paul DeStefano
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MWAlbion wrote:
$30 / box


Is that MSRP? Where did you find the price?
 
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Michael Wheal
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Yes, msrp, It's on each boxes FFG product page.
 
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Paul DeStefano
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cmontgo2 wrote:
A price of $3-4 per fig seems fair, but $7+ per fig is nearly downright outrageous


A single painted X-Wing with cardboard is $15 MSRP.

This is right in line.
 
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Chris Montgomery
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Geosphere wrote:
cmontgo2 wrote:
A price of $3-4 per fig seems fair, but $7+ per fig is nearly downright outrageous


A single painted X-Wing with cardboard is $15 MSRP.

This is right in line.


Not when GW is selling a higher quantity (and most likely higher quality) of models at a lower price. Sorry. Just disagree with you.

The allure (and acceptability) of higher prices for X-Wing is the high-quality prepainted nature of them.

It doesn't mean I won't try out this game and see where it goes, but I think most prospective players of this game will pause at the point-of-entry price.
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Santi Velasco
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This is way more expensive than I expected. I don't intend to follow this game because I am favoring lighter and more freeform systems like SBaH, but so far I like the minis a lot and I hoped I could get a few packs for my skirmishes. I understand they also come with cards, dials and other stuff, but that is of no use to me.

Well I suppose the minis will eventually appear on eBay.
 
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George Tinkham
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To be fair you linked some of the ugliest gw minis still for sale. You are also not considering how many units of them you need to fill out an army.
Try and compare it to GW's more modern releases.
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Tzaangor-Coven
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Tzaangor-Enlightened

I get it, people got shocked to see the game isn't free to play.
It's however a hell of cheaper to play than something like GW or Privateer Press games. If you buy two core sets and one of each expansion, your running at 200 point armies for both factions at 360 dollars. If you just want to play one faction, trade with another core set player and buy both expansions putting you at a 160 dollar buy in to be able to play the game at a competitive level.

The command squads are kind of expensive, but consider the quality of the sculpts, the cost of 4 unique sculpts, molds, and the fact that you will probably only ever buy 1 or 2 puts them at an appropriate cost. Shit, it's pretty easy to pay 13-25 for characters or unique weapons/command attachments for squads.


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Bum Kim
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Wow, that is more expensive than I was hoping, even with the discount through online vendors. I have pre-ordered two base sets which is a lot cheaper than buying the cavalry and reanimate archers separately--I'm hoping that their upgrade cards will be made available online (like X-Wing) and I can just print them out.

I don't mind paying $50 (with discount) for both commander upgrade boxes as they are four units each. I thought they would be sold as single units so I like the fact they are sold together. GW commanders are about $15 each so I feel like I'm still ahead.

But even if Runewars ends up being as expensive as GW, I would still pick Runewars because everything I have read says Age of Sigmar rules are mediocre. (I don't personally know as I've never played.) I do really like X-Wing so enjoyed the demo I played at Gencon. Also, this game can easily be played 2 vs. 2 which is a requirement for me. To each their own, I guess.
 
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Chris Montgomery
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Well, for the sake of the game I hope more people agree with you than me. I just think they made a huge pricing error (like I wd know, right) - new minis game, little to no universe support, and price points like this. Not a good mixture. FFG is seeking two types of gamers - long-time minis gamers looking to replace their WFB equivalent with something else, and cross-over boardgamers (their real core audience) who like FFG's other minis games.

I hope you're right.

I don't find the argument that GW's newer stuff has more expensive minis to be persuasive. GW has set the set standard for quality of minis and they have been around for over 30 years. I thought the minis I picked were comparable to the detail (even more detailed) than the Waiqar archers. FFG is trying to break into this market and charging these prices is not, IMHO, going to help them do that.

I'm not trolling, I'm just not persuaded. I have expendable income and prices for games aren't generally something that bothers me. I had already preordered 2 core sets, but these prices have me rethinking the purchase.

I suppose I'm wondering what's there to justify the price?

Edits: Effing iPhone.
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Tea Hagen
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cmontgo2 wrote:
I thought the minis I picked were comparable to the detail (even more detailed) than the Waiqar archers.


I somewhat agree. In fact I think you were too nice. Those archers come with options, the Runewars ones do not. Another comparison are basic gw skeletons without options. The archers are $2,5 per mini, the skeletons $2.

A comparable to the commanders is this at $4 per mini
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vampire-Counts-Grave-Gu...

Quick math shows the minis coming down to $16, meaning FFG is charging $14 for some cards and 1-2 trays.
 
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Justin N
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I've been following this game with some high hopes, but I think I'm out now. these prices are just too much. I was expecting the unit packs in the $20 range, and $30 is just way too much (50% more than I was expecting!). I guess I'd hoped they were saving money by not painting them. Nope.
 
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George Tinkham
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What the hell are you talking about.
Compare that to the unit of reanimate archers.
That comes out to $4.125 per a model.
The reanimate archer pack is $3.75 per a model.
If you selectively choose things to prove your argument you will win every time.
You would need to compare characters to characters that you would buy limited amounts of to get the proper comparison. Considering most list will more than likely only require 1-2 of the command squads considering you can only start to run the full thing at large squad levels and they cost extra points pushing the inclusion of them to around the quarter of your army.(A full tournament level game is 200 points.)
Meanwhile one box of grave guard is nothing in your 8th edition vampire count army.
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Heinrich-Kemmler
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/The-Deathmages-Necroman...
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vampire-Counts-Wight-Ki...
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vlad-Von-Carstein

Are more equivalent game play wise. Quality wise Vlad and the Wight King are way higher, but price per model is also vastly more different. Which in the box set comes out to $7.50.
Not sure who taught you guys how to present an argument, but try to keep it apples to apples instead of oranges to suit your own narrative.
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Jonny Y
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I think a better comparison would be some of the newer gw kits

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/pink-horrors-2016

This is $35 for 10 guys, I haven't seen the rune wars minis up close, but its probably a good bet that the GW ones are better. Although apparently the doom minis were made in house and are pretty impressive so maybe they are better than we think.

Either way, I don't think $30 for 8 guys and bases and cards aren't a bad price, its just xwing mini prices, but I think its not out of the question when compared to other table top mini games. The bigger question is what is the typical points cost for a game, that will be the big determination on how much this game will cost.

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George Tinkham
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Organized Play runs at 200 points.
You can only use the full contents of the command attachment at a reanimate formation of a 9 by 9 which is 50 points. The squad upgrades can be as cheap 1-2 points up to as expensive as 7 points per a model.
The Reanimate archers for two trays is 18 points, how ever a unit of 6 trays is 45 points.(with out upgrades)
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Despite what the cheerleaders want you to believe, FFG doesn't do GW-quality minis. A better comparison is Mantic's Kings Of War, in which case FFG is still more expensive:

FFG 4-horse cavalry unit = $30
Mantic 10-horse cavalry unit = $40


FFG 8-person undead archers unit = $30
Mantic 10-person undead archers unit = $30

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George Tinkham
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I wouldn't call myself a cheer leader. I do agree that GW's does quality way and above, they are the market leader with some other places being good in some scenarios. Red Republic, Wyrd, and Corvus, IMO.
I am just making the argument that the game isn't more expensive than the two primary market leaders GW and Privateer Press.

I also believe the models look way better than mantics, but I can't really make an argument for aesthetics, so I'll concede that.
https://images-cdn.fantasyflightgames.com/filer_public/73/c1...
Is the best close up of the skeletons that I can find.
 
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Jonny Y
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Thanks for that. So roughly $300 for an army, assuming you don't need to buy extra units to get specific upgrade cards and stuff. That is a little pricier than I hoped.

So if you are going up against GW and other mini games, I guess you compete on

miniatures
price
rules

Besides, rules I don't see this game beating GW in the other two categories
 
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Tea Hagen
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obscenename wrote:
What the hell are you talking about.
Compare that to the unit of reanimate archers.
That comes out to $4.125 per a model.
The reanimate archer pack is $3.75 per a model.
If you selectively choose things to prove your argument you will win every time.
You would need to compare characters to characters that you would buy limited amounts of to get the proper comparison. Considering most list will more than likely only require 1-2 of the command squads considering you can only start to run the full thing at large squad levels and they cost extra points pushing the inclusion of them to around the quarter of your army.(A full tournament level game is 200 points.)
Meanwhile one box of grave guard is nothing in your 8th edition vampire count army.
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Heinrich-Kemmler
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/The-Deathmages-Necroman...
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vampire-Counts-Wight-Ki...
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vlad-Von-Carstein

Are more equivalent game play wise. Quality wise Vlad and the Wight King are way higher, but price per model is also vastly more different. Which in the box set comes out to $7.50.
Not sure who taught you guys how to present an argument, but try to keep it apples to apples instead of oranges to suit your own narrative.


I'm talking plastic and price per mini vs price on comparable minis, not how much you have to spend on a full army (wich will always be up to the producers setting points and what you choose to field).
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Chris Montgomery
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obscenename wrote:
Organized Play runs at 200 points.
You can only use the full contents of the command attachment at a reanimate formation of a 9 by 9 which is 50 points. The squad upgrades can be as cheap 1-2 points up to as expensive as 7 points per a model.
The Reanimate archers for two trays is 18 points, how ever a unit of 6 trays is 45 points.(with out upgrades)


You make a good point about the *number* of models needed. This game is really more a "warband-sized" miniature game with 100 or less models on the table per side.

I'm just not seeing the price point. I mean, if the RuneX universe had been fleshed out and we were buying into an already rich and deep franchise, if I expected the models to be GW quality, or if the models came pre-painted/assembled, or if they came with kitting options (like all of GW's stuff), or if you received more models per box, or something like that, okay.

I'm still in -- I've decided to get my two copies of the base game and see how I like it. But I'm not gonna be chomping at the bit to pick up every expansion like I do with Armada, and unless the online-store price is significantly lower (not likely with Asmodee's new policy), then I'll probably not progress beyond the base game unless/until the game becomes established and it looks like it's going to be around longer than FFG's normal game life-span of 2 years.
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