Recommend
2 
 Thumb up
 Hide
9 Posts

Dixit» Forums » General

Subject: Dixit Question - Using Smart Phones rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Duo Maxwell
United States
flag msg tools
mbmb
My question to the community is this: Do you think it is fair to play Dixit and for clues that the story teller gives, and someone looks it up?
Especially, if the person looking it up didn't share the information with the whole table such as a definition. I should note, that everyone is using the same language so it's not that 2 people are speaking Mandarin and shutting someone out.

I think that this should not be allowed for the following reasons.

1. It's not a game of who has the best cell phone coverage. People with bad reception would be at a disadvantage.

2. and all the people at the table may not have a cell phone which would put others at a distinct advantage.

3. It slows down the game as people look up things.

4. It ruins the spirit of the game (imo) because if people are looking up things on the cell phone and yelling out answers it seems to go against the very nature of the game.


However, most esteemed colleagues of BGG, I also want to talk about a specific example.

The clue by the storyteller was "Letters from Whitechapel" and the card was a guy cloaked in a cape with is face covered. Someone said that was "not acceptable as a valid clue" because they did not know what that was. This prompted them to look it up on their smart phone. lol. The person said that they would essentially quit the game if not allowed to use the smart phone for these vague "stupid" clues.


I know, it's really quite idiotic how if a person doesn't understand/know a clue....the clue is inherently bad.

Your thoughts? Thanks in advance everyone in the community for taking time to answer my questions....which seems like a obvious case of poor sportsmanship.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
I agree with you that doing internet research during a game of Dixit seems ridiculous.

cbrook29 wrote:
The clue by the storyteller was "Letters from Whitechapel" and the card was a guy cloaked in a cape with is face covered. Someone said that was "not acceptable as a valid clue" because they did not know what that was. This prompted them to look it up on their smart phone. lol. The person said that they would essentially quit the game if not allowed to use the smart phone for these vague "stupid" clues.


"Not acceptable as a valid clue?" "Stupid" clues? Threatening to quit the game? Seriously? Was this said by a supposedly mature adult?

I'd have been tempted to tell that player "Great, please quit the game, thank you very much, so that the rest of us can play our game of Dixit enjoyably"...
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Liam
Scotland
flag msg tools
admin
badge
I am BGG's official honey trap
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Moved from General Gaming to Dixit: General.

Yeah, I think that clue's fine, if it's a one off and not designed to pick on a particular player, using a phone is not.

1. Phones shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the gaming table.

2. I never understand players who care about the score in Dixit.

3. Like most games, I'd recommend players agree to the house rules before play.

One of our house rules is you can't use personal information that not all players are privy too. EG: 'Where we went for my Birthday'. I've played with groups who rule that all clues have to related to music. Conversely, I've played with groups who don't allow specialist knowledge (where a few of the group worked in medicine).

4. Players who treated to quit, are unlikely to be invited back.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Hall
United States
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
No, phones shouldn't be allowed, unless you house rule ahead of time that everyone can use them and everyone agrees. But I think it goes against the spirit of the game.

As far as being an "invalid clue," the whole point of the game is to have some guess correctly and others guess incorrectly. So based on what the player who said that was getting at, any clue that not everyone gets would have to be an "invalid clue," which is obviously not even in the ballpark of how the game works.

I'd have told that player, "thanks for playing with us up to this point, please let us know if you'd like to re-join without your phone later."
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Duo Maxwell
United States
flag msg tools
mbmb
oneiric wrote:
First, I feel that Dixit is a game where people should play for fun and to learn something about each other instead of desperately trying to "win". This is worth mentioning because it colors my later comments.

Looking up clues/answers on a cell phone while gaming is lame. As a general rule, I dislike having people tethered to their phone while we are supposed to be hanging out - and the described scenario is no different even if her phone use was instigated.

That said, while "Letters of Whitechapel" is perfectly valid as a clue it's also a lousy one. I've never understood why people would use clues that are intentionally designed to block people out in a game that (I feel) should be about creativity and imagination. This is a story-telling game, not a clique building/reinforcing game. There is incredibly little creativity or imagination in the example clue. It's a direct reference that appears to have been chosen because that clue-giver knew it would exclude at least one person.

So do two wrongs make a right? Frankly, the whole thing makes it sound like I'd prefer not to play Dixit at your table in the future...


Yikes..I am a little surprised by your response but I respect your opinion on it being a "lousy" clue. I was actually the clue giver, I must admit. I do not mind the criticism. The problem is if I give a clue too specific it everyone gets it...and if too broad it excludes everyone. I am trying to find that sweet spot. I *do* try to give clues, hoping to exclude some people because that is a path to victory but I never single anyone out but maybe you are right a purist way to play might be to give a clue that everyone has a chance to interpret or misinterpret. I see your point.

I should mention that I didn't give the clue knowing that I had the inside track (short cut) with a specific individual(s). I have only known them for approx 2 weeks or so. I really did not know whether or not anyone would even know the clue. In fact, no one even had played the game (whitechapel before). They got the clue because they knew it related to jack the ripper. Well, everyone knew the meaning except for the guy who looked it up on the cell phone and another guy who just did not know it.

Making a rule such as..........the clue must be such that everyone has a fair chance to interpret or misinterpret it....does get into quite a conundrum because we are not aware of everyone's experiences, reading habits, music, or TV watching. A lot of the time we have to appeal to the common denominator of pop culture but even this is a guess because people's exposure to things various greatly from individual to individual.

I should also mention that, whether a clue or not is lousy is highly subjective. One man's great clue is another man's lousy clue.

Again, your reply has merit, I am not discounting that. Thanks.

Two wrongs do not make a right. I agree. However, the clues were not designed to ice any particular person out or with malicious intent. Not sure "wrong" and "right" as being ascribed here. If the whole table agrees to use tablets/smartphones then that is just people's preference.
I personally frown on using them during games specifically Dixit.

It's also too bad, if our paths ever happen to cross, I would invite you to a game of Dixit.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
oneiric wrote:
cbrook29 wrote:

I should also mention that, whether a clue or not is lousy is highly subjective. One man's great clue is another man's lousy clue.


Totally true. And I've played with more than one group that really enjoy the game for different reasons than I do. Some love looking for common ground in the cards and giving clues exactly like yours; it's just not my preferred way to play because I hate it when people feel left out.

This leaves me rather baffled: it sounds like you therefore try to give clues which everyone will successfully guess, but surely you're not really saying that, are you? The whole point of the game is to give clues which are not too obvious/easy!

I honestly don't understand your objection to the "Whitechapel" clue. That's not some secret personal knowledge analogous to "What I ate for dinner at Ken's house last Tuesday when only Ken and I were there" or something... Jack the Ripper and related lore is publicly documented and pretty well-known historical information!
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Duo Maxwell
United States
flag msg tools
mbmb
russ wrote:
oneiric wrote:
cbrook29 wrote:

I should also mention that, whether a clue or not is lousy is highly subjective. One man's great clue is another man's lousy clue.


Totally true. And I've played with more than one group that really enjoy the game for different reasons than I do. Some love looking for common ground in the cards and giving clues exactly like yours; it's just not my preferred way to play because I hate it when people feel left out.

This leaves me rather baffled: it sounds like you therefore try to give clues which everyone will successfully guess, but surely you're not really saying that, are you? The whole point of the game is to give clues which are not too obvious/easy!

I honestly don't understand your objection to the "Whitechapel" clue. That's not some secret personal knowledge analogous to "What I ate for dinner at Ken's house last Tuesday when only Ken and I were there" or something... Jack the Ripper and related lore is publicly documented and pretty well-known historical information!


I think what he is trying to say, he strives to give clues that are inclusive so that everyone has a fair chance at guessing them and having fun. He is trying to optimize fun, not win the game.

The only issue with that is no matter what the clue he gives he might be unintentionally alienating someone who doesn't know it.

Even giving the clue "Big Bird" can be cryptic which I would assume most people know. It just depends on people's life experiences which we really have no way of truly knowing.

when my sisters and I play we are familiar with each others habits, likes, dislikes so yes we have an advantage because I know they watch Sci-fi or horror movies.

Getting back to my situation for the game night. I was just playing the game to win but not by singling specific people out nor was I saying like what Russ Williams said giving a clue like "What me and player x talked about in the bathroom"

I could have also said Baker Street, which is the street that Sherlock Holmes lives and I can assure you that would also be met by criticism from the people that were playing. It wasn't about the clues, the person was upset because they personally didn't know the clue. I do not know particle physics or macro economics well, but I don't vilify it either.

I applaud Oneiric's desire to be inclusive and maximize fun but that in some ways, is in conflict with the very nature of the game.

I think that Whitechapel is in the realm of common knowledge same as if I said "Hounds of the Baskerville"

or even more obscure Reichenbach Falls where Moriarty and Holmes both fell...to their demise??? It is simply too hard to decipher or suss out people's life experiences.

However, with all that being said, I wonder if we could implement a rule where you get more point if all but one person get it, to incentivize giving clues that most people would get and minimizes the number of people excluded. Lol - this is getting weird.

I know someone is going to read this and just say....

"JUST SHUT the hell up AND PLAY THE DAng GAME!!" smh.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Hall
United States
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
For every person who doesn't know a specific reference given in a clue, those people are just as likely to (unintentionally) also give a clue that someone else doesn't get. Unless people are doing this intentionally to single people out all the time (which is kind of silly in a game like Dixit), it's likely going to balance out throughout the game.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Russ Williams
Poland
Wrocław
Dolny Śląsk
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmb
oneiric wrote:
But I find it unfortunate when one person from a group feels specifically and intentionally excluded (even if that person overreacts instead of taking the game in stride). That seemed to be what happened here.

Hmmm? But the cluegiver already said that he did NOT intentionally exclude the person who got angry!

Quote:
My experience is that you can create ambiguous clues without requiring very specific reference points. I also feel like trying to specifically target people (individuals or groups) based on their lack of knowledge about a subject is a less friendly way to play the game - which works for some groups, not for others.

OK, but that was not what happened here...

Someone decided that a clue was somehow invalid or "stupid" simply because they happened to not know that Whitechapel relates to Jack the Ripper. They were not intentionally targeted.

Indeed, based on the OP, the person apparently wasn't even accusing the cluegiver of intentionally targeting them. They just said it was a "stupid" clue because they didn't understand it.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.