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Battles of Westeros» Forums » Rules

Subject: Can a command card be played for just its Tactic? rss

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Porus Reign
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Played this game for the first time last night and had good times. But, at one stage my side wanted to play a Command card but we did not have any more units we could activate. However, we wanted to play it for the TACTIC that allowed us to score 1 HIT to each opponent engaged with a friendly unit. We could not find anywhere in the rules or forums that could confirm or deny this move. Anyone?

Can a command card (cost paid but no qualifying units to use (eg cavalry already activated)) be played solely for the Tactic on the second half of the card?

Thanks.
 
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Giulio
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Porus Reign wrote:

Can a command card (cost paid but no qualifying units to use (eg cavalry already activated)) be played solely for the Tactic on the second half of the card?
Thanks.


In other words, can you play a leadership card that allows you to order units and order no units? As long as you can pay for the leadership card in terms of command tokens, the answer is yes. Ordering units is clearly NOT mandatory and the amount of orders expressed in the card is clearly just the maximum. I'm not sure this is explicitly stated in the rules, but I'm pretty sure, based on other games by the same designer, that this is what is intended.

Edit: The wording of the example with the "order all" card at p.13 of the rulebook suggests this interpretation.

Edit 2: As Mark pointed out below, the "designer" is in fact the inspirator of the designer.
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Mark McG
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g1ul10 wrote:
based on other games by the same designer,


Robert A. Kouba?

 
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Giulio
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Mark, don't be pedantic. laugh I know you perfectly understood I was referring to Richard Borg, mentioned on the box of the game, btw.
 
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Mark McG
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g1ul10 wrote:
Mark, don't be pedantic. laugh I know you perfectly understood I was referring to Richard Borg, mentioned on the box of the game, btw.


I'd be surprised if Richard Borg had much involvement with Battles of Westeros. BoW is really a significant redesign of BattleLore, and aside from using the name, and being "Inspired by the Classic Game created by Richard Borg", it seems to have a very tenuous connection.
 
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Marc Hanna
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Minedog3 wrote:
g1ul10 wrote:
Mark, don't be pedantic. laugh I know you perfectly understood I was referring to Richard Borg, mentioned on the box of the game, btw.


I'd be surprised if Richard Borg had much involvement with Battles of Westeros. BoW is really a significant redesign of BattleLore, and aside from using the name, and being "Inspired by the Classic Game created by Richard Borg", it seems to have a very tenuous connection.


Yes it does sound like a marketing ploy to gather interest from the crowd well familiar with his name. The Borg games of this series tend to rely on command in sectors, whereas the BoW command innovation removes that artificial mechanic.

Since the BoW series is being discontinued, this is pretty much a moot point, making the matter even more pedantic, if that's relevant whistle
 
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Mark McG
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Honosbinda wrote:

Since the BoW series is being discontinued, this is pretty much a moot point, making the matter even more pedantic, if that's relevant whistle


you mean if a game producer stops making a game, nobody can play it again!!
wowwowwow

Once FFG discard yet another title, really the only way to get rules questions answered are from other players, and with the C&C series, sometimes precedent from other games. So my point here is that I don't actually think that reference to BattleLore is a reliable guide for the rules of Battles of Westeros, because of the different designers.

So I think Guilio is correct, but I think relying on precedent from BattleLore is misleading. Whereas I would (and have) relied upon C&C Ancients rules answers for C&C Napoleonics.
 
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Marc Hanna
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Minedog3 wrote:


you mean if a game producer stops making a game, nobody can play it again!!
wowwowwow



Heh, I meant the marketing ploy was kinda moot from now on. Certainly the game is playable. You're right about how these questions need to be answered by the community from now on, too...
 
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Carl
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Honosbinda wrote:
You're right about how these questions need to be answered by the community from now on, too...


Not exclusively. Robert Kouba, who is the actual designer of BoW, has shown a great willingness to answer questions about the rules and communicate with the BoW community. He contributed a lot of interpretation and clarification to the Complete Corrected Rules document in the files section.

I highly recommend that rules document as a first point of reference in any rules question. While not an official replacement for the rules in the boxes, it is an exhaustive compilation of those rules, with incredibly helpful analysis, interpretation and clarification included, as well as a variety of optional variant rules.
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Marc Hanna
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CarlZog wrote:
Honosbinda wrote:
You're right about how these questions need to be answered by the community from now on, too...


Not exclusively. Robert Kouba, who is the actual designer of BoW, has shown a great willingness to answer questions about the rules and communicate with the BoW community. He contributed a lot of interpretation and clarification to the Complete Corrected Rules document in the files section.

I highly recommend that rules document as a first point of reference in any rules question. While not an official replacement for the rules in the boxes, it is an exhaustive compilation of those rules, with incredibly helpful analysis, interpretation and clarification included, as well as a variety of optional variant rules.


Yes but as a private citizen on his own dime/time. Glad to have it, and the documents, but the support is not from FFG.
 
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The answer to the question is no.

Quote:
no

the timing of the tactic on the card, before or after the command, is meant to reinforce this.

thanks!

rob


https://boardgamegeek.com/article/5490034#5490034

From back in 2010 when Rob Kouba was still on the payroll

Quote:

Substitute Commands: When playing a Leadership card,
the player of that card may always choose to consider it to
have the printed text “Order 1 unit.” in place of all other
printed text. When utilizing this substitution, all other
commands and tactics are ignored.


This rule from page 13 of the Baratheon expansion also supports the idea that tactics can't be played on their own but only as part of a "resolved" order. The minimum order is of one unit not zero. You don't have to order a unit to do nothing and if you can't order a unit to do something then the order doesn't "resolve" and hence can't be used for a tactic.

Quote:
Some tactics also allow the player to choose to resolve the tactic either before or after resolving the command section of the card.


Page 17 BOW rule book

The key thing is, whether before or after, the command section must "resolve"




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Porus Reign
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Thank you.
 
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