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Masmorra: Dungeons of Arcadia» Forums » Variants

Subject: Interest in an expanded coop version? rss

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Tobias Loeffler
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I enjoy Masmorra much more than I've anticipated and I'm thinking about expanding the alliance game with a few dungeon crawler tropes, like:

- disarming trapped chests.
- barriers that require the cooperation of the heroes (like levers, that must be pulled to gain access to the lower levels).
- quest cards.

Just trying to gain an idea how much love there is for the alliance mode and if it is worth designing cards etc. for or just write everything on a piece of paper...
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Aleksandra Kuhl
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I want it.
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dungeon exploration will be the same? totally random and in some spots there will be specific tiles like the 11th for the 2nd floor stairs or totally diferent like let's say Descent, there is a map defined and you place tiles once you explore?

i'm also thinking on doing some kind of adventure for my friends, something involving 4 stages

-1st : you can only have one hero ability but only minor monsters will spawn and they are a little bit nerfed (maybe 1hp less or something similar)

-2nd : you can get one ability more and only minor monsters will appear (no nerf here) major monsters as bosses

-3rd: 3rd ability unlocked , minor and major monsters appear "easy" bosses appear

-4th: 4th ability unlocked , only major monsters and bosses appear

with the not used XP something like 1 gold per X XP obtained so they can buy "something in town" between sessions
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WD Yoga
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I am interested in your idea on this!
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Tobias Loeffler
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I'll give an example how I imagine this (in fact I hope to playtest this version today)

At the start of the Alliance game, draw a quest card. This quest card will present the heroes with an additional challenge.

Example of a Quest card: "The Pressure is on!"

A massive door blocks your path to the lower level. You must find the mechanism to open it.

When you draw a rune room, place the medium dungeon tile as normal and populate it. Then place the small rune room so it connects to the medium dungeon tile. These rune rooms are now called "Pressure Rooms" (they have a pressure plate in them).
If at any time during a player's turn there are either heroes and / or monsters in all pressure rooms, the access to the next level opens until the end of that player's turn.

Disarming Chests

When you want to open a chest, select the required die to open the chest, but instead of "locking it in", roll it. You can now spent "foot" symbols to turn the die to the required face.
If you don't manage to turn all dice to the required face, the chest opens but you failed to disarm the trap inside the chest. Roll an additional die to find out what happens:

SWORD: Mimic - Place a random minor monster in the room with the chest.

FEET: Teleport - Hero and all monsters are teleported to the current level entrance tile. Turn ends

MAGIC: Haunted - Draw 1 additional evil card at the start of your next turn.

SHIELD: Alarm - Advance the round tracker 2 steps.

ELIXIR: Amnesia - Lose 3 XP and 1 random treasure card

BOW: Zap: Gain 1 wound. The chest is empty. Don’t gain gold, treasure card or experience!

What do you think?
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Ryan Valdez
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I'm really intrigued by the idea, actually. My group of friends love co-op, and while it has the potential to be a good co-op game, there's not as strong of a "co-op" sense as there could be. Granted, it is definitely a PVP game, so that's understandable.

I think your ideas are great though, if you can make sure it's all balanced! I don't know if you've ever thought about it, but for me, I'd look into rulings that reduce player downtime between turns ORRR a ruling that allows all players to take a "hero turn" where everyone rolls and plays at the same time. Random thoughts.
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Tobias Loeffler
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Nayr090 wrote:
I'm really intrigued by the idea, actually. My group of friends love co-op, and while it has the potential to be a good co-op game, there's not as strong of a "co-op" sense as there could be. Granted, it is definitely a PVP game, so that's understandable.

I think your ideas are great though, if you can make sure it's all balanced! I don't know if you've ever thought about it, but for me, I'd look into rulings that reduce player downtime between turns ORRR a ruling that allows all players to take a "hero turn" where everyone rolls and plays at the same time. Random thoughts.


I don't want to change the basic flow of the game (it must remain Masmorra and the focus must remain on what makes it fun), but I've quite a few ideas for quest cards. As you can see from the example above, they could really change how each game plays.

If you want it really, really challenging, you could even draw a second quest card when you enter level 2... :
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Kevin Clark
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nimmzwei wrote:
What do you think?


Let me start by saying, YES! This is a great idea! I am willing to contribute ideas to this version. I am interested in adding mechanics for cooperating with other players. I have a Variant rule set for an Alliance/Standard hybrid that was intended for 6 or 8 players here:
https://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/142542/team-variant-rules...

I very much like your idea of pressure plates, but I think this may be too elaborate for a quest card. That could simply be an optional expanded mechanic of Alliance mode. We could have several of these.

My suggestion for Quest cards, is that there be many of them and that to start you draw 2 cards and select 1 for the game (Gloomhaven style). These would be varied and more simple, but provide a few extra coins or a treasure card if completed, and add a little flavor to each session.

Quest Card Examples:
"CHAMPION - Draw a major monster die and roll, If you defeat one of these draw an extra treasure card"
"SLAYER - Draw a minor monster die and roll, if you defeat 2 of these, you get 4 coins."
"AVENGER - Beloved pet was devoured by spiders. Every spider killed generates a [Shiled].

The Chest Traps sound too difficult to open without setting off trap as described, but I like the idea as a new mechanic. Remember, Alliance mode is over if anyone dies, so people might not want to open chests. Also, how would this affect Mika's ability for locking dice, would she avoid the roll?

Keep the Ideas flowing! I think you are on to something here.

EDIT: Actually, I was thinking quest cards would be for each player, but I see that you would only have one for the team! I like it as is. Maybe add what I mention above as a player battle agenda, or something like that.
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Tobias Loeffler
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That's great news - somebody willling to help! Thanks!

Quest cards: I think we have kind of a different approach here. While I also want quite a lot of those I want them to change the way you approach each game.

Chest traps: I don't think it is too difficult. Many chests need a single icon, so the only thing you need to open them without risk, is a maximum of 2 foot symbols - and that's the worst and also most unlikely case. Most of the time it will cost you 1 foot symbol to turn a die to the desired face.
It also gives you something to do with your foot symbols (which I find quite under-used in the game atm).

I agree, that there could be a 1 or 2 more "permanent" changes to the game, like doors and such things, but I'm not yet sure how to implement this without making it too complicated and losing focus of the actual game.

Anyway. Let's just keep rolling. I'll play with the alterations above this evening and I'll let you know how it went!

Thanks again for your feedback!



 
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Alliance mode is great but the only thing I think it lacks is a good sense of cooperation. At the moment, it feels like each player just fights his own battles throughout the dungeon. If you guys can figure out a way to force players to coordinate more, that would improve the game, drastically.

Edit - I just noticed others have stated my same suggestions about cooperation.

Also want to add that I like the Pressure room idea. The simpler you keep things, the better it'll be. I noticed that in nearly every gameplay video released so far, there has always been mistakes. The rules are fairly simple but the little intricacies make it a little challenging to make things go flawlessly. Adding in adjustments will only add to that so just keep that in mind.
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Ryan Valdez
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CharlieX3 wrote:
Alliance mode is great but the only thing I think it lacks is a good sense of cooperation. At the moment, it feels like each player just fights his own battles throughout the dungeon. If you guys can figure out a way to force players to coordinate more, that would improve the game, drastically.

^ This, haha. This is why the pressure room idea is interesting, since it actually makes people have to work together. Or perhaps, have "Big chests" that require 2 or more heroes in a room to open it but give more rewards?

Two quest ideas:
One that comes to mind is one that says something along the lines of "Spawn a major monster on all (insert room name here) tiles. These monsters cannot leave the room they spawned in. When monsters spawned this way are killed, all heroes gain a treasure/coins/XP/something something". Depending on the layout, it could have the team readjust their plan of just random exploring for some extra rewards.

Another one is "When the stairs are revealed, spawn 2 major monsters (or 1 major and 2/3 minor) on the stairs. Ignore room limits. If the active hero enters combat here and is with another hero, the other hero may roll their dice to help in combat. Both heroes are subject to payback and monster abilities."

AGAIN, random ideas, no experience behind it. But maybe some things to add to the pool.
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i may try something similar for chest but instead of what you suggested i'll make them roll a die and if X side pops then shit happens devil

and maybe once they reach turn 15 or so, dungeon will fall apart (removing from the game the farthest tile from the start) and they have to go back to the starting tile

i'm still brainstorming and game will start in few hours surprise
 
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Tobias Loeffler
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Just finished a 2p-game with the rules above:

- We changed the treasure plate mechanic a bit. As all medium rooms have the rune symbol, we decided to use the medium rooms as pressure rooms and skipped the placement of the extra pressure room. This way, there are even less additional rules which is a plus.

- We both really liked the pressure room thing. It makes it much more interesting and strategic, where to place a new room, as you want the monsters to move through the pressure rooms. Also the treasure cards to freeze or control monster movement become even more useful.

- The additional rules for disarming chests worked quite well, too. It gives more use to the move symbols, and we had only one chest trap going off during the entire game. It teleported my buddy to the dungeon entrance.

We fought in the sewers and lost by a single turn.

I'll continue to work on this. I think the quest cards will bring me back to alliance mode again and again.

I assume, there are no PSD templates for cards or icons used in the game?

Thank you @all for giving your opinion. If you have any ideas for quest cards, please post them here!
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Tobias Loeffler
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CharlieX3 wrote:

Also want to add that I like the Pressure room idea. The simpler you keep things, the better it'll be. I noticed that in nearly every gameplay video released so far, there has always been mistakes. The rules are fairly simple but the little intricacies make it a little challenging to make things go flawlessly. Adding in adjustments will only add to that so just keep that in mind.


Yeap! You are SO right!
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"Save Makumba!"

Makumba has been kidnapped by the evil Malaphyas and is being drained of her life force! You must make haste. Defeat Malaphyas and rush Makuba back to safety!

Upon defeating Malaphyas, Makumba's miniature model appears in the tile where Malaphyas was defeated. You must escort Makumba back to the starting tile. Makumba can only move with one of the characters in play on his/her turn as if Makumba is being carried (normal movement rules apply). If you encounter a monster with Makumba in your tile, you only have access to 4 action dice. During the DM phase, all monsters move in Makumba's direction.
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made 2 of my games last night
experience points reduced to 1 (disarming traps, chest, killing monsters) medium exploration tiles 0 xp. All experience over the 'checkpoint' converted as gold. I let them keep 1 treasure card if they finished with any and the gold gained from excess XP.

-1st game- only 1 ability enabled, medium tile with the summoning circle (the one with 3 cultist and the "eye" monster) as final room, only tiles with minor monsters, traps and curses, no 2nd lvl dungeon.
Game was fine, maybe too easy cause lots of traps poped up so was like 'free exploration tiles' and they reached the last room too soon.

-2nd game- one more ability enabled, one of the bosses as final room, a mix of tiles from lvl 1 and lvl 2 dungeon but all in the same level (I decided not to use stairs and used all tiles for the same floor i only used the lvl 2 stairs for the boss room), once boss appears all get TP to there and when is killed monster respawn stops.
Dungeon started to fall apart at the start of turn 16 , removing the farthest tile from the start and everything inside even monsters!
players now have to go back to the exit , starting tile, to save them.
Game was ok, players survive in the very last turn, the way back was a bit hard cause there were some monster roaming the floor and now a lot of respawn tiles showed up and almost no traps / curses.

first game was kind of introduction for the adventure , what i'm trying to do now is make games with 2 options, boss in the second game was the goal but not a must, if they manage to kill it and exit the dungeon before the time runs out the next game will be a bit easier, if they couldnt do it then the next game a bit harder.

no clue if we are going to continue cause one of them was QQ (complaining) at the end of game 2 cause it was hard -.-
if we continue i will post it here so you can take ideas or give some to me
 
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Anders Pedersen
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- find and disarm all traps on level 1 to proceed to level 2.

- activate the Healing Fountain to take a sample. Teleport the sample out of the dungeon through the Portal.

- all players must sacrifice a treasure card to the Pit Room to be able to access the final level.
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Tobias Loeffler
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dbc- wrote:
- find and disarm all traps on level 1 to proceed to level 2.

- activate the Healing Fountain to take a sample. Teleport the sample out of the dungeon through the Portal.

- all players must sacrifice a treasure card to the Pit Room to be able to access the final level.


Cool ideas! I'll try to come up with a PS template. I want these as cards. We really had fun with our last game, but I can't see us playing coop much more often, without some additional challenges, modifiers.
 
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Libs Ly
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Keys hidden in chest to get into rooms or further levels, Zelda like

Basically a sticker on the tail of it may do the job for randomisation
You mix the key chest in the last few of them
Combined with your trapped chest, it may be a good incentive
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Tobias Loeffler
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Libs wrote:
Keys hidden in chest to get into rooms or further levels, Zelda like

Basically a sticker on the tail of it may do the job for randomisation
You mix the key chest in the last few of them
Combined with your trapped chest, it may be a good incentive


Yeah, I also want to introduce doors (and keys) as a constant modifier. But not sure how to do it without disrupting the game flow.

Thanks for your suggestion!
 
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lyono thundercat
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Just realised that you posted this. I did a post on similar lines - gradual character growth, unlocking more dungeon each game.
 
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Tobias Loeffler
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lyono wrote:
Just realised that you posted this. I did a post on similar lines - gradual character growth, unlocking more dungeon each game.


It's on ice atm, because I'm busy with another boardgame project. But I hope I find some time to make cards and a pretty rule sheet.
 
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Damien Stanley
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Any chance of throwing this together into a doc for the file section?
 
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I'm personally planning on creating Masmorra "Quest" cards. I'll probably scan and photoshop something together. Something like this but with a little more flair and matches the scheme of the other cards in the game.
 
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