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Android: Netrunner» Forums » Rules

Subject: Femme Fatale and Blue Sun (or other trash-and-replay actions) rss

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The Inspector
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I've seen people mention using Blue Sun's ability to remove and replay ice as a counter to Femme Fatale's bypass ability. However, does this actually work?

I know it's common practice to use a token to represent which ice is the target of Femme's bypass ability. And a token would fall off the ice if it was removed from the board and then reinstalled. However, there is no actual token involved. Femme's ability only says to "Choose an installed piece of ice" and "When you encounter that ice..."

So it looks to me that, even if the chosen ice were recycled by Blue Sun (or trashed and replayed using, say, Archived Memories), it would still be the chosen ice ("that ice"). Therefore, Femme's ability could still bypass it.

So, has there been a ruling on this?
 
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Aaron E.
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All from the FAQ:

Uninstalled
Anytime an installed card enters HQ, R&D, Archives, or the
Runner’s grip, stack, or heap, or is removed from the game, the
card has been “uninstalled.”


Card Memory
Whenever a card is uninstalled, there is no memory of its
previous state and it is considered to be a new copy of the card.


And the reverse of your question is also explicitly stated:

Femme Fatale


If Femme Fatale is uninstalled, the Runner cannot bypass the
ice chosen by the Femme Fatale when it was installed; the
ability is no longer active since the card is no longer active.
Even if that copy of Femme Fatale is re-installed, it is treated
as a ‘new’ copy and cannot bypass anything other than the ice
chosen when it was just installed.
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Andrew Brown
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yes. a ruling from the core rules explains what happens here.

once a card changes to another zone, it ceases to be 'that' card for all intents and purposes for references to/from other cards. if it's in the Stack/R&D, Heap/Archives, Grip, HQ, in play/installed, hosted (but not in play), score area, or completely out of play


it's why Test Run works to find a program, install it, and re-install it cleanly with Scavenge while also not returning to your stack



this ruling has a lot of other implications, but most importantly, you can't ever really verify a particular card in this way. for example, say you Femme and Ice Wall, and Blue Sun returns it to their hand, then installs a different copy of Ice Wall somewhere else, or installs that Ice Wall in the same position. how would the runner know it's that card? when the corp rezzes it? what if they don't rezz it?


EDIT: ninja
 
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Aaron E.
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Also, welcome to BoardGameGeek, get yourself an avatar!
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The Inspector
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Thank you. I had seen the reverse answer in the FAQ, but hadn't seen the "Card Memory" section. That answers my question quite completely.
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