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Subject: Crappy FFG Grey Standard Sleeves? rss

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Justin Rizzo
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*** Update. I actually had FF Grey sleeves, not FF Green. I have fixed the title of this post, but have left the body as it was. ***

I recently started sleeving my games. I'm looking to sleeve about 10 different SmallBoxGames (they use standard cards sleeves). I'll be making a mass purchase of 1,000+ sleeves. I want quality sleeves that are durable and fit snug without excess baggage.

I've been buying FFG Green based on reviews. I hate the crap out of them. They are way too tall and far too wide. Shuffling is a nightmare. But the cardinal sin is that after 15 games of Biblios I have already had (3) fail out of (87) cards. I expect more from a non-penny that that.

I want to try the Ultra Pro Matte, but I have read the logo might graft onto the card over time. I would cry if my copy of Omen had a permanent UP logo on it.

I recently traded for a few games and they came to me sleeved. I was amazed at how nicely the cards fit in the sleeves. The gentlemen that traded me said they were Mayday Green Premiums. I just sit at my table and stare at how nice the cards look in them. So nice.

Log into BGG. Read about Mayday. People say they suck and have quality issues.

What gives. I hate FFG. BGG hates Mayday. Who is right? And more importantly, where do I get GOOD fitting sleeves without dropping $10 on dragons?
 
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
I am not a heavy sleever, but when I sleeve, I use Mayday (premium for my valuable games, standard otherwise) and I have been happy with them. The only problem I ever encountered with them is that in a standard pack I had two sleeves that were stuck together. I've seen people complaining about Mayday sleeves before, but I wonder if maybe some of these issues have been fixed in recent times?
 
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Justin Rizzo
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
I too wonder if that is the case. I mean , the difference between Mayday and FFG is huge. I'll never buy another FF sleeve if this is their "premium". They fit like a one size fits all hat : loose. The card is floating around in there.
 
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Matt L.
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
Getting the right sized sleeve is something you need to do, it's not the fault of the manufacturer unless the sleeves aren't the size as stated (that does happen), if the FFG Greens are too big, you need to see if another size is more appropriate. Anyway my decision pattern goes like this.

Can I get an appropriate sized sleeve from FFG?
Can I get one that's too tall from FFG and trim it down?
Can I get an appropriate sized sleeve from Mayday?

I've been sleeving cards for a long time and every company has bad runs, but FFG is the only one where I've sleeved an expansion and had them seamlessly blend in with the original game sleeved some length of time before, same material thickness, perfectly cut, exactly what you want to have happen. I can't recall having a FFG sleeve split but it does happen, it might be more prone to happening if you're buying sleeves of an inappropriate size.

Mayday premium sleeves are fine unless you get a bad batch (I've had some that are not squarely cut), or if you need to sleeve more than 50 cards at a time and are unlucky enough to get sleeves from different batches that have slight variations in height or width.

I've got plenty of sleeves from Mayday because they're the only ones selling some sizes. Mayday does a good job to offer replacements but FFG has consistency really figured out from my experience and they'll get my business first. I still appreciate the premium Mayday stuff for when I need it though.

Edit : Here's a geeklist that tracks sleeve sizes for specific games, if you hadn't seen that it might help you get the right sized sleeve
https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/164572/card-sleeve-sizes-...
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Des Lee
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
Curious. My sleeves of choice are FFG. i sleeve pretty much all my games and would have probably 10,000 FFG sleeves, if not more. In all that time I've had less than 3 fail completely (ie: split or torn). They do run a little tall, but nothing I can't deal with.

Biblios doesn't actually use the FFG Greens (Std Am), they use Greys (standard card game). Are you using the wrong sizes? I use a bunch of different FFG sizes, mostly grey, green and purple, with the odd red (mini euro)

I don't mind the Mayday Premiums, but I don't like the size consistency and edge roughness issues that they have. In my opinion, the FFG sleeves are a much better option. Ultra Pros are good, but they too have size consistency issues, and there's the annoying silver dot.
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Sicaria Occaeco
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
JustinRRizzo wrote:
I'm looking to sleeve about 10 different SmallBoxGames (they use standard cards sleeves).


FF Green are not standard size. You're buying the wrong size cards. Sleeves are personal opinion and Mayday's sucks.

Try this https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/164572/card-sleeve-sizes-...
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Jerbear
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
I don't typically sleeve boardgames, but I play and sleeve Magic. I have used numerous brands of sleeves. I personally like Ultra Pro Matte the best. (Ok actually KMC perfect fit, but those are expensive and not "easy" to get.)

I am not sure why you are worried about the dot. It is on the outside of the sleeve. The only complaint I have heard is that they can rest over the part of something you need to see on the card. I have never heard of grafting cards before.

And for the record I don't like Dragon Shields. They are tough, but in my experience show wear almost immediately.

OH, And I do have some of FFG sleeves with the Star Wars prints. I have never had any break and they fit Magic cards correctly. They may be a bit long, but when you are protecting expensive cards that is a plus, not a minus. I shuffle side to side anyway.
 
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Jacob Casper
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
I use mayday for non standard sized cards and I buy Dragon shields (matte) by the thousand so I always have some on hand.
 
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Justin Rizzo
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Re: Crappy FFG Green Sleeves?
Well I'm a moron. Lesson learned, don't be typing up a rant after a 12 hour work day as a houseparent with 9 elementary kids! I can read Red Fish Blue Fish, but I can't seem to differentiate between my own sleeve colors...haha. I fixed the title, but left the OP body the same.

I definitely have FF Greys for my standard card size sleeves. The new cards I received are Mayday Prem Greens.

FF and Mayday both quote their sleeves at 63.5 x 88mm.

Here are photos for comparison. The FF are far too tall and the card is, in my OCD opinion, floating in there. While the FF sleeves only appear to be 1mm wider, it does make a big difference in shuffle feel and card fit. All those quibbles aside, I have had 3 break in just 15ish games.







You can especially see in the last picture what I mean by the card floating in there. The card is centered. All that free space. So let me fire off a few quick questions.

1) Are the Ultra Pro's oversized like the FF, or are they are tighter fit like the Mayday.
2) Is Mayday continuing to have manufacturing inconsistencies?
3) Is there another sleeve someone can recommend that is in between the cost of Mayday/FF/UP and Dragon Shields, that offers a tight fit and good quality?
 
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Steve C
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Any reason why you changed the thread title to Grey sleeves and not green sleeves? I believe they are different sizes...
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Christian Gienger
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Yes, Mayday does have inconsistencies, but I think every manufacturer does. With Mayday I always got replacements quickly if there was a problem.
 
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Des Lee
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Ok, that size looks about right to me for the greys. Yes, the FFG sleeves do run a little tall, but I'm willing to deal with it. That amount of extra space would be unacceptable in a penny sleeve, but I find it just fine in a thicker sleeve like the FFGs. I don't find it has a problem with floating around - again due to the thickness of the sleeve, it just naturally ends up being centred and I never feel like the card is slipping out.

What's more worrying is the sleeves failing. Unless you got a bad batch, I'm just not seeing that occurring in the standard sleeves that I have got. I have literally got thousands of them, and I desleeve and resleeve many of them if I trade away a game for example, and I've never had 3 FFG sleeves break in TOTAL. Let alone in a single game!

Swan Panasia standards have a snugger fit, but can be tricky to find, and I think feel a little thinner than FFG (but not anywhere as thin as a penny sleeve). Ultra Pro and Mayday premium also have a snugger fit, but I much prefer Ultra Pro over the Maydays.

Personally, Ultra Pro are my go-to if I NEED a slightly smaller sleeve (to fit in an insert, for example) that FFG can't accommodate.
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Justin Rizzo
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Akado wrote:
Any reason why you changed the thread title to Grey sleeves and not green sleeves? I believe they are different sizes...


Yup. I mentioned it in the mast previous post. I realized my error (I had Grey Sleeves from FF, not Green) and fixed the heading, but left the title alone.

losfp wrote:
What's more worrying is the sleeves failing. Unless you got a bad batch, I'm just not seeing that occurring in the standard sleeves that I have got. I have literally got thousands of them, and I desleeve and resleeve many of them if I trade away a game for example, and I've never had 3 FFG sleeves break in TOTAL. Let alone in a single game!


Interesting. Maybe I just got a really bad batch? They are all breaking int he same way : the seam comes apart. I typically shuffle in one of 3 ways : mush, deal to 6 piles, and finally side rifle shuffle. I'm very easy and careful when I side shuffle. I put very little pressure on the cards.
 
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Thanee
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JustinRRizzo wrote:
1) Are the Ultra Pro's oversized like the FF, or are they are tighter fit like the Mayday.


Tight fit. I like them a lot. I use UltraPro Deck Protectors.

They changed the logo imprint recently, it is now less shiny and more subtle. I never had it mark off on a card, and I am using them for several years now.

Quote:
3) Is there another sleeve someone can recommend that is in between the cost of Mayday/FF/UP and Dragon Shields, that offers a tight fit and good quality?


KMC makes good sleeves, but I havn't tried them myself.
Ultimate Guard's Supreme could be worth a look as well.

Bye
Thanee
 
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Justin Rizzo
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Thanee wrote:
JustinRRizzo wrote:
1) Are the Ultra Pro's oversized like the FF, or are they are tighter fit like the Mayday.


Tight fit. I like them a lot. I use UltraPro Deck Protectors.

They changed the logo imprint recently, it is now less shiny and more subtle. I never had it mark off on a card, and I am using them for several years now.

Quote:
3) Is there another sleeve someone can recommend that is in between the cost of Mayday/FF/UP and Dragon Shields, that offers a tight fit and good quality?


KMC makes good sleeves, but I havn't tried them myself.
Ultimate Guard's Supreme could be worth a look as well.

Bye
Thanee


I have been avoiding UP because they are quoted at 66 x 91mm, which would theoretically make them taller than the FF sleeves. But each company appears to have different measurement standards.

Any comment on UP Deck Protector vs Matte?
 
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Ryan Morency
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I have never had an FFG sleeve break. Are you rifle-shuffling them? I really like the extra height of FFG sleeves, but to each their own as they say. I have never experienced cards falling out of FFG sleeves while shuffling.
 
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Justin Rizzo
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Odinsfury wrote:
I have never had an FFG sleeve break. Are you rifle-shuffling them? I really like the extra height of FFG sleeves, but to each their own as they say. I have never experienced cards falling out of FFG sleeves while shuffling.


I am gently "side" rifle shuffling, and only the first step of that style of shuffle. In one game I caught my friend regular rifle shuffling, and stopped him, so that may have damaged my last sleeve, but I already had 2 fall apart before that.

Even if they weren't breaking, I just do not care for them. They are too tall and too wide and too fat I'm going to order a pack of UP and Mayday Prem Green and compare.
 
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Matt Brown
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LunaWolvesMan wrote:
Edit : Here's a geeklist that tracks sleeve sizes for specific games, if you hadn't seen that it might help you get the right sized sleeve
https://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/164572/card-sleeve-sizes-...


And there is an entry covering how FFG's grey sleeves feel too loose.

Item for Geeklist "Card Sleeve Sizes for Games"
 
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