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The Dresden Files Cooperative Card Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: "Claw, claw, bite" card rss

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Julius Besser
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Mouse has some cards that say "You may switch the rows of any 2 cards at the same range", such as the "Claw, claw, bite" card. Can you use this card to switch a card with an empty space in the same row at the same range, or must you switch two cards?
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Eric Vogel
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No, the affect cannot be used to swap a card with a blank space in the other row. There must be another card at that range for the switch to occur.
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Fred Hicks
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Yeah, that's part of the restriction on the applicability of that card effect. "Any two" can't be reduced to "any one" because that would change the range positioning of cards further back in the "lopsided" row, which would be more powerful than intended for the effect.
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Scott Daniel
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erichv wrote:
No, the affect cannot be used to swap a card with a blank space in the other row. There must be another card at that range for the switch to occur.


Oops, played this wrong the other day. I don't think it impacted the outcome.
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Eric Vogel
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Formersd wrote:
erichv wrote:
No, the affect cannot be used to swap a card with a blank space in the other row. There must be another card at that range for the switch to occur.


Oops, played this wrong the other day. I don't think it impacted the outcome.


Play it again Sam, I mean Scott. :-)
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Chris Merritt
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Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.
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Bobby Warren
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COMaestro wrote:
Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.

I second this question.
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Eric Vogel
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COMaestro wrote:
Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.


In this case, I rule that it is the player's choice. However that is a one case ruling that applies just to this card, not a general principle that players should try to apply across the game.
 
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Fred Hicks
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erichv wrote:
COMaestro wrote:
Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.


In this case, I rule that it is the player's choice. However that is a one case ruling that applies just to this card, not a general principle that players should try to apply across the game.


That's uncommonly kind of you, Eric.

I would've expected the answer to be more along the lines of "execute the card effects in order". Land the hits, swap the position, then remove the foe at the conclusion of the action (which would trigger any 'when defeated' text on the foe at that point).
 
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Julius Besser
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fredhicks wrote:
erichv wrote:
COMaestro wrote:
Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.


In this case, I rule that it is the player's choice. However that is a one case ruling that applies just to this card, not a general principle that players should try to apply across the game.


That's uncommonly kind of you, Eric.

I would've expected the answer to be more along the lines of "execute the card effects in order". Land the hits, swap the position, then remove the foe at the conclusion of the action (which would trigger any 'when defeated' text on the foe at that point).

It's interesting to see a discussion about what the rules are between the designer and publisher being transacted in a BGG forum.
 
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Bobby Warren
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fredhicks wrote:
I would've expected the answer to be more along the lines of "execute the card effects in order". Land the hits, swap the position, then remove the foe at the conclusion of the action (which would trigger any 'when defeated' text on the foe at that point).

This is how we played it, and the reasoning I used. Of course, this is what we wanted to happen because I set up Harry to hit all the foes in one row.
 
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Fred Hicks
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jayelbird wrote:
It's interesting to see a discussion about what the rules are between the designer and publisher being transacted in a BGG forum.


That's just how I roll. (Or as Jeff Tidball said of me, I'm "pathologically transparent".)
 
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Eric Vogel
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jayelbird wrote:
fredhicks wrote:
erichv wrote:
COMaestro wrote:
Follow up to this question: If this card would eliminate a foe, when can the card switch occur? Before the hits are dealt, after the hits are dealt and the foe is removed, or player's choice? We had this come up on Saturday.


In this case, I rule that it is the player's choice. However that is a one case ruling that applies just to this card, not a general principle that players should try to apply across the game.


That's uncommonly kind of you, Eric.

I would've expected the answer to be more along the lines of "execute the card effects in order". Land the hits, swap the position, then remove the foe at the conclusion of the action (which would trigger any 'when defeated' text on the foe at that point).

It's interesting to see a discussion about what the rules are between the designer and publisher being transacted in a BGG forum.


Mouse is kind of a special case, because he was designed and tested while the Kickstarter was running. While I certainly playtested him quite a bit, but I couldn't playtest him within an inch of his life like I did all the other decks. So I will admit, that problem hadn't occurred to me until now. Mostly I tried to avoid creating powers that would raise this sort of timing issue. Probably the most consistent thing would be to say that you have to make the swap before the Foe is removed, but I don't think that Claw Claw Bite taking out a Foe is such a common occurrence that it makes a big deal to gameplay either way. I think the player preference ruling is more intuitive in this case.
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Chris Merritt
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Thanks for the response! I think we actually removed the defeated foe first and then did the swap in our game, though it would have been better for us to have swapped cards first. Good to have clarification.
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