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Subject: The hype, the mini's, and blood rage's past success will set us up for a huge let down. rss

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nick hansel
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Take a minute and forget who Erik Lang is. Forget Blood Rage. Stop thinking how you're going to paint the mini's. Hit reset.

Rising Sun is propped up for all of us to adore and gush over (for good reason). But look at the gameplay- it's slow- it's too much follow the leader. I could make the argument that it's a bit on rails. The play through video is tough to watch.

At the end of a year, Blood Rage will be head and shoulders above Rising Sun and all of you will be $100 lighter in the pocket book.

Very rarely do game designers hit back to back grand slams.. Uwe has stumbled (many times) Feast of Odin is too big. Stefan is up and down.

Erik would have been better off developing an expansion(s) or opening the Blood Rage universe for further exploration.

Best of luck

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David
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Budget won't allow $100 for the end of the month?
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J P
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Gotocard11 wrote:


Very rarely do game designers hit back to back grand slams.. Uwe has stumbled (many times) Feast of Odin is too big. Stefan is up and down.




How is this "back-to-back?" Hasn't Eric Lang worked on, like, 10 games (give or take) in between Blood Rage and Rising Sun?
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Dundy O
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I'm going to forget your post. That seems more reasonable.

You're telling us to forget one of the great board game/card game designers of all time and one of the most successful publishers of the last 10 years. You then give us your definitive take on a game from a single video.

Come on....????

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David
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Gotocard11 wrote:
Rising Sun is propped up for all of us to adore and gush over (for good reason). But look at the gameplay- it's slow- it's too much follow the leader. I could make the argument that it's a bit on rails. The play through video is tough to watch.

At the end of a year, Blood Rage will be head and shoulders above Rising Sun and all of you will be $100 lighter in the pocket book.

Very rarely do game designers hit back to back grand slams.. Uwe has stumbled (many times) Feast of Odin is too big. Stefan is up and down.

Erik would have been better off developing an expansion(s) or opening the Blood Rage universe for further exploration.

Best of luck



Have you actually played the game?

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm curious to know how you can be so certain of this based only on watching the video.
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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The only thing that's REALLY a let down is 5 male vs 1 female clans ..

This way the girls in my group aten't going to favour Rising Sun ... cry
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Craig B
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Teowulff wrote:
The only thing that's REALLY a let down is 5 male vs 1 female clans ..

This way the girls in my group aten't going to favour Rising Sun ... cry


Correction: 4 male clans (assuming Fox Shinto is male), 1 female clan (koi), 1 mixed clan (Lotus)
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BG.EXE
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By your logic I should own exactly 1 game, my favorite one, because no other games will live up to it.

First off, I think you're wrong, I think this game is going to be fantastic, and it's INTENTIONALLY a different game from Blood Rage. But your argument is bad no matter how you slice it.
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Craig B
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Gotocard11 wrote:
At the end of a year, Blood Rage will be head and shoulders above Rising Sun and all of you will be $100 lighter in the pocket book.


This statement is true regardless of the quality of Rising Sun because it won't be out till April 2018 at the earliest.... so....... um...... whistle
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mike williams
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People are so defensive of this game. Don't also offend the fanatics by saying you don't like Scythe.

I love Blood Rage and am a big fan of The Others, and therefore have high hopes for Rising Sun. I have to agree though that the game play, that I have gleaned from the video and the rest of the kickstarter page, has not convinced me to back this game. Hopefully they publish the rules, or make a video that I can watch, so I can make a better judgement on this game.
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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yogibbear wrote:
Teowulff wrote:
The only thing that's REALLY a let down is 5 male vs 1 female clans ..
This way the girls in my group aten't going to favour Rising Sun ... cry

Correction: 4 male clans (assuming Fox Shinto is male), 1 female clan (koi), 1 mixed clan (Lotus)

Even more precise: 4.75 male vs 1.25 female clans!
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Roger Reisinger
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Everyone has different tastes and you can be sure that the spectrum will be reached with Rising Sun because of the popularity of Eric Lang and CMON. There will be people who think it is the best game ever, some will think it is good, or great, or maybe just ok. Then there will be other people who think it is below average, over-priced, over-hyped, or just plain bad.

I think we know where the OP stands. I, like many others, are hoping for the best, and think so far it looks pretty good.
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Jakob Stansfield
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Gotocard11 wrote:
Take a minute and forget who Erik Lang is. Forget Blood Rage. Stop thinking how you're going to paint the mini's. Hit reset.

Rising Sun is propped up for all of us to adore and gush over (for good reason). But look at the gameplay- it's slow- it's too much follow the leader. I could make the argument that it's a bit on rails. The play through video is tough to watch.

At the end of a year, Blood Rage will be head and shoulders above Rising Sun and all of you will be $100 lighter in the pocket book.

Very rarely do game designers hit back to back grand slams.. Uwe has stumbled (many times) Feast of Odin is too big. Stefan is up and down.

Erik would have been better off developing an expansion(s) or opening the Blood Rage universe for further exploration.

Best of luck



Most of your argument is based on speculation and personal opinion. I will agree that usually games with this much hype tend to let down a decent number of people. I for one tend to enjoy movies I've heard little to nothing about due to not having much in the way of expectations.

As far as whether it feels like it's too slow of a game, that is completely your opinion and won't necessarily deter others from this game. For example, look at the top 5 games on BGG. Pandemic Legacy is the only game that can truly be played in under an hour, but even then it's a legacy game that will take a minimum of 12 play throughs to complete. A lot of people enjoy some of the slower, longer games.

Sure, it is difficult for designers to knock out back to back successes, but saying Feast of Odin wasn't a Grand Slam is not an accurate statement. Numerous reviewers listed it as their GOTY and it's sitting at #52 on BGG right now, which no slouch of a game is going to do. But you shouldn't also forget that Rising Sun is not going to be Eric Lang's follow up to Blood Rage, instead that will be The Godfather: Corleone's Empire. That games feels like it will be more of the fast paced "Dudes on a map" game that you're looking for, just not in the BR universe.
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Jeff M
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Amazing the emotions this game is bringing out. shake

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Roger Reisinger
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Mikewill wrote:
People are so defensive of this game. Don't also offend the fanatics by saying you don't like Scythe.

I love Blood Rage and am a big fan of The Others, and therefore have high hopes for Rising Sun. I have to agree though that the game play, that I have gleaned from the video and the rest of the kickstarter page, has not convinced me to back this game. Hopefully they publish the rules, or make a video that I can watch, so I can make a better judgement on this game.


I didn't really like Blood Rgae, I thought it was ok. I feel the same way as you on Rising Sun, is that ok? Can we not agree on one thing and agree on another? Sometimes I think on the Inet that is immpossible
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Sami Viherranta
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The gameplay video is bad. Dont point your feelings about the game from that. Just take a cup of tee and think: What kinda game you feel that Rising Sun is? just looking the components and the feeling that the game gives you posibly when it sets down to your table. I would say even if the game sucks, the components look amazing and are well worth of 100$. If the minis are as good as Blood Rage, its well worth of 200$, even without the game.
 
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mike williams
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Granmoe wrote:
The gameplay video is bad. Dont point your feelings about the game from that. Just take a cup of tee and think: What kinda game you feel that Rising Sun is? just looking the components and the feeling that the game gives you posibly when it sets down to your table. I would say even if the game sucks, the components look amazing and are well worth of 100$. If the minis are as good as Blood Rage, its well worth of 200$, even without the game.


I wouldn't use the minis for anything else, and it would be very difficult to find the time to paint them. Would you seriously buy just the minis without the game as you think they are worth so much? Honestly curious.
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Nickel Eye
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I agree to point that his game may be seen as a "let-down", but I don't think it is for the reasons the OP says. I certainly don't think it will be because of Lang's inconsistency.

I do think sometimes hype can reach critical mass until people who maybe aren't predisposed to like a style of game get sucked into the hype, then are disappointed when the game ends up being what was intended by the designer not what they hoped it would be. People who want "Blood Rage 2" may be bummed when they play Rising Sun. But, that doesn't mean Rising Sun is a poor game, it means they had false expectations.

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Patrick Reynolds
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Seems a little bit premature, considering we haven't even seen the rulebook yet.

Also, Eric Lang has had his name on several games since Blood Rage (The Others, Bloodborne, The Godfather to name a few).
 
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Phil Schmidt
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Okay, assuming I could do that. What have I seen?

Minis and components are good; art is nice.

A turn consists of picking an action, and everyone doing the action. The person picking the action gets a bonus. This mechanic is used in Puerto Rico, and I think it works pretty well. You can call it follow the leader, but it works. This game expands on that by allowing you to ally with someone to share the bonus. This is neat because you want an extra bonus, but you want to give as little to the other person as possible because the game does not have shared victory. As I'm one of the better players of my group, I expect I will have the hardest time getting allies. While I don't have all the information, to me it looks like it's not that big of a disadvantage to be alone. Even then, as you do not share victory, you are still competing with your ally at all times, and the game mechanics allow you to exploit an ally. I must admit I'm excited to try this game, but I can't say how fun it will be.

Combat is done just as much with hidden use of resources as it is with unit strength. Since I have to forget blood rage, the only other game I can think of that has does this is Scythe, and it works pretty well there. It might work here too.

With the Kami, upgrading, etc. there seems to be a lot of things going on, each of the things being pretty simple. Lots of individually simple things is another thing I like a lot because is easy to teach, and potentially adds a lot of depth. The potential is there.

Now I'm going to remember who the designer is and note that he has a history of hitting a lot of that potential.
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Jesse Marzel
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Gotocard11 wrote:
Take a minute and forget who Erik Lang is. Forget Blood Rage. Stop thinking how you're going to paint the mini's. Hit reset.

Rising Sun is propped up for all of us to adore and gush over (for good reason). But look at the gameplay- it's slow- it's too much follow the leader. I could make the argument that it's a bit on rails. The play through video is tough to watch.

At the end of a year, Blood Rage will be head and shoulders above Rising Sun and all of you will be $100 lighter in the pocket book.

Very rarely do game designers hit back to back grand slams.. Uwe has stumbled (many times) Feast of Odin is too big. Stefan is up and down.

Erik would have been better off developing an expansion(s) or opening the Blood Rage universe for further exploration.

Best of luck



The video is indeed terrible, but the game looks great.
Thing is, this is a negotiation game, and there was no negotiation in the video. Going over the details of the gameplay itself, seems more in the vain of New-Angeles than Blood Rage; the game seems more about reading other players, figuring out what they want to do and using that to set yourself up for victory. It looks great, and different enough from Blood Rage that you could own both.

I think if you enjoyed games like Nothing Personal and New-Angeles, this would be perfect. If you are expecting something else, you might indeed be disappointed.
 
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Who Am I?
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Lowecore wrote:
Everyone has different tastes ...


Very true.

Not a fan of Blood Rage at all, or of CMON releases in general. Also not a fan of most games that Eric Lang has designed - they just aren't my preferred style.

Yet gameplay from Rising Sun looks quite appealing to me, even with just a somewhat stilted video to show off how a game turn might go. Not sure it's $100 appealing... but there's lots of time left to figure that out.

It's ok the OP feels differently and isn't sold on the game. He never sits at my table anyway. That first post does sound an awful lot like sour grapes though.
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Jason Daniels
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You know what I do? I thoroughly research every game I buy. Avoids those pesky feelings of remorse.

I'd like to assume, unlike the OP, that others do the same. However, I do see alot of people putting stock in BGG ratings, so...
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W M
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I do not disagree with what you say. I am a backer but would like to see more of the game play and mechanics. I was on the fence a little, but the I like the theme and am taking a chance. I has a little bit of Shogun to it.
 
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StevenE Smooth Sailing...
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I am being honest with myself... Rising Sun for me is about the minis. I have many unplayed games or multiplayer games that I play solo. I don't need another one... Unless someone comes up with a solo or 3rd player AI this work of art will likely not be enjoyed as intended for some time.

I'll likely end up playing someone else's copy at a local con... unfortunate to be surrounded by non-board gamers at home. yuk
 
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