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Subject: Ok just go rhough going through all my boxes and components (long post) rss

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Duo Maxwell
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I think Im missing a few things. Hoping to see if anyone here can confirm or deny my inquiries

Ok Ive found inconsistencies with whats in my box as opposed to what the manual says should be in it (first off does the manuals components show stretch goals and additions too? If so I take it the retail manual will be different as some of those stretch goals and exclusives wont be there)?

Scenarios: There is 22 listed in the manual. I have 22 scenario cars across core game an expansion. But shouldnt there be 23 scenarios? That is what about the new scenario that was supposed to come with the Dragon in From the Deep expansion? I see no card for his scenario nor no listing for his scenario in the book.

Character Bases. The manual says there should be 8 for colors? Is that a typo? Should the actual number be 6? In my base game box I have 7 (2 of which are blue). Also in the From the Deep box there was 3 green ones (should there have even been colored bases in the From the deep box?). If you add those up thats a total of 10

Is the "Chief Hospital Administrator" listed on the campaign just a different name for what is now the Warden?

Is the "Construct" listed on the campaign just a different name for what is now Frankenstein's Monster?

Manual says theirs 11 quarter board pieces I only see 10 in the box. Is that a typo in the manual or am I missing a board piece?

Manual says "central board piece" (which seems to suggest theres only 1) I have 2 in the box. Is that a typo in the manual or do I have more central board pieces than I should?

Is Baba Yaga mentioned in the KS campaign anywhere because I dont see her on the campaign yet she is in my game (along with a card and mini)?

KS campaign says 70 tokens. Yet I had 74 on one punch out board (the one with the lockers and bodies) Plus another 81 tokens on the all circular tokens punch out board. Theres also the 3rd punch out board with the 3D doors but I know that isnt part of the token count, So whats the deal withe the token count on KS campaign yet I have more than double that amount?

Also according to the campaign there should be 8 nurses (which I have) plus 2 additional nurses unlocked through stretch goals. For a total of 10 nurses. Well I only have 8 (still in the plastic insert/casing). I dont see the other 2

Lastly one of the unlocks on the campaign mentions "Additional Hospital Wing" boards + k6 dice. I dont have an extra k6 dice (i only have the original 10 six sided dice that are listed in the game manual). Also I dont see any additional hospital wing boards or no board pieces that have shapes that would allow you to connect additional wings to the hospital like shown on the "Additional Hospital Wing" boards unlock picture on the campaign. Im I missing something there?
 
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Lex Talionis
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-"Chief Administrator" is now named "Warden"

-"construct" is now named "frankenstein monster".

-There are 10 double-sidded quarter boards (you can see 20 pictures at the end of the book)

-The second "central tile" is named "corridor", it's a stretchgoal for the "hospital wing" variant that raises the board up to 6 quarter tiles ! (look at the FAQ on BGG )

-"Baba Yaga" was an alternative bonus sculpt for a 3rd witch (developped after the kickstarter), finally they turned her as a new monster.
 
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Lex Talionis
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-they told us in an update that they "sacrificed" the 2 bonus "nurses" in order to add the "Baba Yaga" model during production.

-The 6 sided dice for the "hospital wing" variant isn't there (but it's useless as you just need a normal D6 and a D12 for localisation purpose as you now have 6 quarter tiles)
 
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Lex Talionis
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duomaxwell007 wrote:
Scenarios: There is 22 listed in the manual. I have 22 scenario cards across core game an expansion. But shouldnt there be 23 scenarios? That is what about the new scenario that was supposed to come with the Dragon in From the Deep expansion? I see no card for his scenario nor no listing for his scenario in the book.


-I think that the "Dagon scenario" is now the "Summoning of Dagon Module" included in "From the Deep" Expansion.

duomaxwell007 wrote:
Character Bases. The manual says there should be 8 for colors? Is that a typo? Should the actual number be 6? In my base game box I have 7 (2 of which are blue). Also in the From the Deep box there was 3 green ones (should there have even been colored bases in the From the deep box?). If you add those up thats a total of 10


-I also have 7 coloured-bases, I think they add a second blue base for players who have bought Allison and her Cat (=2 miniatures)
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Lex Talionis
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You didn't ask but there is finally 1 "pom-pom girl vampire" and 2 "vampires with snake" (it should have been the opposite), they told us in an update that it was a mistake from the manufacturer but they accepted it in order to not delay the production again, and because it doesn't change the game.
 
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Judgement Dave
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As you may have gathered from Lex's replies, it sounds like your core box has everything it should have.

The new scenarios (available soon... TFG planned this weekend iirc) address monster names (where they have changed, like the Construct) and contain more of the scenario-specific rules/clarifications.
 
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Duo Maxwell
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SO then that would explain why theres 7 colored based in the cor box. Thus the "6" listed in the manual IS a typo correct? Also what about the 3 green bases in From the Deep? Theres no mention of those and FTD only comes with one character so what would the other 2 green bases be for?

Also 11 quarter board pieces listed in the manual is ALSO a typo then right?

As for the second "central board piece" really being the add on for the additional hospital wing. How does it "fit" into the side of the board then? Theres no "opening" on any of the board tile on the side to "connect" that part to, nor are their any pictures on the side of any of the board tiles near the sides that would suggest "this piece goes here" thus it would just randomly be placed on the side of the board. Looking like an incorrectly done puzzle (as nothing would match or suggest it goes there) then you add more hospital on to it?

Also the book says 64 monster miniatures. I count 63. Now it WOULD have been 64 if you took out Baga Yaga an added the two additional nurses. So is that number in the manual just not updated to reflect the change or am I missing something?

No one addressed my Token question.

"-The 6 sided dice for the "hospital wing" variant isn't there (but it's useless as you just need a normal D6 and a D12 for localisation purpose as you now have 6 quarter tiles) "

Huh? Thats confusing "now have 6 quarter tiles? But umm dont we have 10 double sided quarter tiles?

"-I think that the "Dragon scenario" is now the "Summoning of Dragon Module" included in "From the Deep" Expansion."

Can you or anyone confirm that? Perhaps its listed in an update or something?

"You didn't ask but there is finally 1 "pom-pom girl vampire" and 2 "vampires with snake" (it should have been the opposite), they told us in an update that it was a mistake from the manufacturer but they accepted it in order to not delay the production again, and because it doesn't change the game. "

Yeah I noticed the vampires but I just figured "meh the models aren't the same as the pic is switched but they serve the same purpose so I wont worry about that"


Also where is the FAQ at on BGG?
 
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Judgement Dave
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duomaxwell007 wrote:
SO then that would explain why theres 7 colored based in the cor box. Thus the "6" listed in the manual IS a typo correct? Also what about the 3 green bases in From the Deep? Theres no mention of those and FTD only comes with one character so what would the other 2 green bases be for?

Also 11 quarter board pieces listed in the manual is ALSO a typo then right?

So is that number in the manual just not updated to reflect the change or am I missing something?

Huh? Thats confusing "now have 6 quarter tiles? But umm dont we have 10

Can you or anyone confirm that? Perhaps its listed in an update or something?

Just picked some highlights and cut the rest...

I get the impression that the contents page was written months before the contents were finalised. This causes lots of issues with people thinking they haven't got what they should have.

The revised rulebook may still be wrong. I know that I didn't change any quantities on the contents page as I hadn't seen a physical box and so had no reason to disbelieve the numbers that were in the original document were incorrect!

From what you've written, I still see no reason to believe that you are missing anything. Just accept that the list of contents is some sort of delusion/hallucination worthy of the game...
Quote:

"You didn't ask but there is finally 1 "pom-pom girl vampire" and 2 "vampires with snake" (it should have been the opposite), they told us in an update that it was a mistake from the manufacturer but they accepted it in order to not delay the production again, and because it doesn't change the game. "

Yeah I noticed the vampires but I just figured "meh the models aren't the same as the pic is switched but they serve the same purpose so I wont worry about that"

They mentioned it in an update. Functionally the same but it irritates me - snake handlers don't usually come in pairs and cheerleaders normally don't come alone.

Quote:
Also where is the FAQ at on BGG?

Lobotomy FAQS (rules and scenarios) v 2.0
 
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Duo Maxwell
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"I get the impression that the contents page was written months before the contents were finalised. This causes lots of issues with people thinking they haven't got what they should have."

So what youre saying is. The content numbers listed in the book are wrong and whats in the box is right? If so I wish there was a way to verify that then because by that logic if you bring up to a dev that things are missing from a box based on what your count is and what the manual states. They could always say "Nah nothings missing, youre fine. The book is just wrong" Whether that statement is accurate or not just to get you to stop asking or not have to worry about sending out replacements lol.
 
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Duo Maxwell
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Well as far as miniature quantities go (which I noticed printed on the box is sure wrong as it states over 70 lol). Maybe someone can compare their contents with mine (if you have your copy) and let me know if they match up:

the manual says (even the revised pdf one) components say 64 monster miniatures and 1 warden. Which to me means 65 total monster miniatures. Yet my count shows 63 including the warden:

Baba Yaga
Nurse x8
Warden
Frankensteins Monster
Scavengers x12
Patient x16
Vampire x3
Witches x2
Twins x3
Antichrist
Nemesis
Body Snatcher x4
Slasher x3
Clown
Orderly
Big Mama
Little Girl x4

Thats a total of 63

Also the manual says (even the revised pdf one) 8 character bases for each character. But there was 7 in my box and two were the same color. Looking at the pictures on the campaign it only shows 6 colors, and looking at those color bases I noticed I have an orange one (which isnt shown on the the campaign page) and I dont have a brown one (which IS shown on the campaign page). Soooo which is correct?
 
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Judgement Dave
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duomaxwell007 wrote:
Well as far as miniature quantities go (which I noticed printed on the box is sure wrong as it states over 70 lol). Maybe someone can compare their contents with mine (if you have your copy) and let me know if they match up:

the manual says (even the revised pdf one) components say 64 monster miniatures and 1 warden. Which to me means 65 total monster miniatures. Yet my count shows 63 including the warden:

Baba Yaga
Nurse x8
Warden
Frankensteins Monster
Scavengers x12
Patient x16
Vampire x3
Witches x2
Twins x3
Antichrist
Nemesis
Body Snatcher x4
Slasher x3
Clown
Orderly
Big Mama
Little Girl x4

Thats a total of 63

Also the manual says (even the revised pdf one) 8 character bases for each character. But there was 7 in my box and two were the same color. Looking at the pictures on the campaign it only shows 6 colors, and looking at those color bases I noticed I have an orange one (which isnt shown on the the campaign page) and I dont have a brown one (which IS shown on the campaign page). Soooo which is correct?

I hate quoting myself, but I did the rulebook revisions (though they furthered altered what I sent them) and as I said:
JudgementDave wrote:
The revised rulebook may still be wrong. I know that I didn't change any quantities on the contents page as I hadn't seen a physical box and so had no reason to disbelieve the numbers that were in the original document were incorrect!

It just happens that the quantities were incorrect, and so still are (as I don't think they've been revised).

Your bases appear correct - or at least the same as everyone else who has received the core seems to have.

I have now received my game, and your mini count looks correct (other than mixing up the 4 Orderlies and 1 Body Snatcher minis).

An easy way to tell is that the moulded plastic insert should have no spaces in it and that leaves the following in bags in the card insert:
Warden
Frankensteins Monster
Scavengers x12
Patient x16

Also the box is probably as out of date as the manual, but it states 73 plastic minis. Strictly speaking there are actually 74:
63 Monsters
8 Characters
3 altars

Now admittedly, the altars is pushing it and without them it's 71 - 2 short of the 73. The same 2 out that the 63 monsters is from the earlier count of 65.
So what happened to make that difference of 2?

There were original 3 witches, 10 Nurses and no Baba Yaga.
IIRC they added Baba Yaga (who is an uber-Witch in Russian folklore) replacing one of the standard witch models, but at around the same time they heard that the factory had made a balls up and couldn't fit all 10 nurses in the insert.
To avoid a further delay to the project, they accepted dropping to 10 Nurses. This wasn't too bad as we'd gained 2 nurses through an SG - there was originally only meant to be 8, so losing the extra 2 wasn't a great deal. Most backer comments were supportive of the change as opposed to more delay.

So we had:
3 Witches -> 2 Witches
10 Nurses -> 8 Nurses
0 Baba Yaga -> 1 Baba Yaga (along with a new Monster Card and the Baba Yaga scenario, probably)
So we lost 2 models, but got a new unique model with more gameplay.

Hope that explains what happened.
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Duo Maxwell
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I see what I did wrong with the orderlies and body snatcher. according to the campaign there are "body snatcherS" (plural) and only one orderly is mentioned and both the body snatchers and orderly are shows under "Body Snatchers" in the campaign. Thus I assumed the minis that have 4 copies where the body snatcherS whereas the one by itself was the Orderly. Though now that I think about it the Body Snatchers in the movie look more like that singular body snatcher and less like the 4 orderlies lol. So yet another of this campaign many typos/misprints (gawd couldnt get the campaign OR rulebook right -_-. Im afraid of my what Dark souls and Massive Darkness backings will look like when I get them is this is a normal KS occurrence.).

Only thing left now is the clear up the colored bases stuff (i have 7 two are blue and the manual says 8) ppl claim that two blue ones are for Allison and Cameron.. which makes no sense because those bases come in the base game. Why would they add 2 colored piece for Allison an Cameron when there was no guarantee anyone ppl who received it would have purchased her? Also theres supposed to be a colored base for EACH character according to the box. Well there are 8 characters thus shouldnt there be 8 bases? Though logically you dont NEED 8 bases because you cant play with more than 6 ppl at a time anyway buuttt if thats what the manual (or campaign) says Until someone tells me thats wrong then thats what I expect to see. If the point of the bases is to help you differentiate between each character easier then why would they give two of the same color? That would only make it harder IF two ppl decided to use blue.

Why does From the Deep even HAVE colored character bases? Even if its for the one character that expansion adds. Ok thats ONE character thus why THREE bases that are the SAME color (green)?

Lastly can anyone confirm that the Dragon Scenario that was supposed to come with the From the Deep expansion was indeed/officially replaced by the Dragon Module that is in the Expansion? (I mean were that true Id think they woulda made an update about it as they did with all the other changes)
 
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Judgement Dave
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duomaxwell007 wrote:
I see what I did wrong with the orderlies and body snatcher. according to the campaign there are "body snatcherS" (plural) and only one orderly is mentioned and both the body snatchers and orderly are shows under "Body Snatchers" in the campaign. Thus I assumed the minis that have 4 copies where the body snatcherS whereas the one by itself was the Orderly. Though now that I think about it the Body Snatchers in the movie look more like that singular body snatcher and less like the 4 orderlies lol. So yet another of this campaign many typos/misprints (gawd couldnt get the campaign OR rulebook right -_-. Im afraid of my what Dark souls and Massive Darkness backings will look like when I get them is this is a normal KS occurrence.).

Only thing left now is the clear up the colored bases stuff (i have 7 two are blue and the manual says 8) ppl claim that two blue ones are for Allison and Cameron.. which makes no sense because those bases come in the base game. Why would they add 2 colored piece for Allison an Cameron when there was no guarantee anyone ppl who received it would have purchased her? Also theres supposed to be a colored base for EACH character according to the box. Well there are 8 characters thus shouldnt there be 8 bases? Though logically you dont NEED 8 bases because you cant play with more than 6 ppl at a time anyway buuttt if thats what the manual (or campaign) says Until someone tells me thats wrong then thats what I expect to see. If the point of the bases is to help you differentiate between each character easier then why would they give two of the same color? That would only make it harder IF two ppl decided to use blue.

Why does From the Deep even HAVE colored character bases? Even if its for the one character that expansion adds. Ok thats ONE character thus why THREE bases that are the SAME color (green)?

Lastly can anyone confirm that the Dragon Scenario that was supposed to come with the From the Deep expansion was indeed/officially replaced by the Dragon Module that is in the Expansion? (I mean were that true Id think they woulda made an update about it as they did with all the other changes)

Come on, please play along. I'm pretty sure I told you that everything you've mentioned is correct when responding to a post mentioning the bases.

There are only supposed to be 7 coloured bases in the core. And everyone has 2 blue. It's a guess by people that it's for Cameron, and (like you) I don't see that as the reason why since Allison & Cameron aren't in the core.

I think it's 7 just because it's 7 and we got 2 blues just because we did.

Forget about the coloured bases in the expansion. I've no idea why there are any in that box. AFAIK It doesn't need them and all it's done is make people ask why they are there.

BTW, while I'm on bases, forget about the coloured bases altogether. The game doesn't need them - they aren't functional in game terms. All they are for is to help players spot their own character mini - but that's what eyes are for and shape/figure recognition is for.
Besides can you really not remember where your character is from turn to turn?

I think that between some changes in development not being reflected in the rulebook/back of box and the odd issue with the factory/production we all got what we got.

Now I'm not saying that there won't be some boxes with errors - of course there will. But people getting 8 nurses is standard. Getting 7 coloured bases (of which 2 are the same colour) is standard. Getting 10 Quarter Boards is standard. Getting 2 cheerleader vampires and 1 snake vampire is standard.

You should be getting the drift of this by now. Nothing, and I mean nothing, that you have written so far has seemed to indicate that you have anything other than the core box as finally delivered. Yes - there are changes to what was initially stated would be in the box and yes the contents as stated in the rulebook are fiction better than Dan Brown could ever write.

I'm even pretty certain that you have what everyone has in the From the Deep box, even though you've not stated everything you have. Just because you've queried the odd minor bit that is 'as delivered'...

I actually think that the scenario that was going to be in the From the Deep box ended up being the Siren's Call scenario that's in the core box. If you look at that scenario it needs the From the Deep expansion, yet the From the Deep expansion itself contains no scenarios, just rituals.
Also, I saw 2 WIP rulebooks - 1 with the Siren's Call scenario and 1 without - making me think that at some point the scenario was intended to be in From the Deep and not in the core set.

BTW it's 'Dagon' not 'Dragon' - Dagon is a creation of H P Lovecraft, as are the Deep Ones. And the character in From the Deep is based on Lovecraft himself.

Finally - it's not necessarily a common KS occurrence. I think that the rulebook may have not been updated when component counts changed partly because of translation issues. Most KSs are run by people who have English as their 1st language - this one wasn't. I dread to think how bad my KS would be if I had to run it in Polish...
Also, this was TFGs 1st KS. There are often production/scheduling issues with people's 1st few KSs. You shouldn't see this sort of thing with CMON for Massive Darkness (although they still have some scheduling/production issues).
One of the great things about KS is that it lets people branch out and do something they never thought they would. The downside is that many people do do things that they've never done before and so hit problems that they've never encountered or considered.
Even if TFG have sculpted models for other game companies before, they hadn't done a whole game end-to-end. TBH I think they've done alright - sure there have been problems, but nothing really terrible.
 
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Duo Maxwell
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"I actually think that the scenario that was going to be in the From the Deep box ended up being the Siren's Call scenario that's in the core box. If you look at that scenario it needs the From the Deep expansion, yet the From the Deep expansion itself contains no scenarios, just rituals.
Also, I saw 2 WIP rulebooks - 1 with the Siren's Call scenario and 1 without - making me think that at some point the scenario was intended to be in From the Deep and not in the core set.

BTW it's 'Dagon' not 'Dragon' - Dagon is a creation of H P Lovecraft, as are the Deep Ones. And the character in From the Deep is based on Lovecraft himself.
"

Well that covers everything EXCEPT the Dagon Scenario

If you look at the Campaign for unlocked "It says 4 Siren Miniatures Monster Card and New Scenario" In from the Deep expansion. Sure the scenario card is in the From the Deep expansion while the Sirens Song scenario itself is inside the Core Game manual (which would obviously confuse ppl who didnt get the expansion). Whereas the campaign also shows "Dagon Miniature, Monster Card and New Scenario. In From the Deep expansion" Which would suggest that the Dagon and Sirens should have their OWN scenarios each and not that the Dagon scenario was supposed to be or is part of Siren's Song
 
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Judgement Dave
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duomaxwell007 wrote:
Well that covers everything EXCEPT the Dagon Scenario

I don't know what happened. But at least you're in the same position as the rest of us - i.e. you're not missing something that others are enjoying!


Off the top of my head, I guess that the Dagon possibilities include:
A - It was never actually planned.
B - It was dropped.
C - It was never really a scenario, but just the Summoning of Dagon module
D - It was never really a scenario, but the Ritual Dream or Reality?
E - It's been accidentally forgotten and will be dropped
F - Its been accidentally forgotten and will still arrive

A - Possible. I've just checked and the update when Dagon was unlocked (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1084608523/lobotomy-boa...) shows a graphic that mentions the mini and monster card, but has no mention of the scenario. There were times during the campaign that incorrect/inconsistent graphics/info appeared, so it is possible that the graphic stating a new scenario was incorrect.
TBH you get that happening on many KSs as often a new SG/unlock graphic is an edited version of a different one, and sometimes they don't update everything correctly. I've seen it on KSs from quite experienced companies (like CMON).

B - bad, but possible. I think this is unlikely. The communication is patchy, and certainly not regular, but when things have had to be dropped they've generally told us.

C, D or a combination of C/D - very, very possible. Especially as, in other places, a 'new' system hasn't always been what it seems. E.g. Cthulhu was supposed to bring in a whole new Final Clash - all it actually brings in is a different set of attacks/stats to the Warden. There's no really different way that the Final Clash occurs.

E/F - I'm guessing we'll find out in time.

It's worth noting that the (still to come) app is supposed to have scenarios - now that may just be the info from the scenarios we have or it could include new scenarios. If so, it's possible we'll see a Dagon scenario arriving sometime.

BTW - Don't forget that some versions of the rulebook that I saw had the Siren's Call scenario and some didn't - effectively there were two different versions of the last page of the scenario guide section of the manual/rulebook.

I actually thought that Siren's Call wasn't in the rulebook but was in the From the Deep expansion (since it requires that to play). It's possible that a Dagon scenario was planned but somehow got lost in the mix when deciding where scenarios 'live'.
 
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Duo Maxwell
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Meh oh well. Any other halfway decent company informs you of changes or additions from the original plan so you dont have to ask questions like this. Like they did with baba yaga the nurses, vampires and everything else. But oh well at least I know now. Thanks.

Speaking of app lers hope its very much like mansions of madness second edition app lol
 
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