Piotr Konieczny
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Let me start that I consider the official rules describing Prestige in the BoW book to be the most confusing and badly written part of the RotG rulebooks ever. I've played with many people who told me they could never figure Prestige out, and those who did sometimes played it quite differently. I have been trying to figure out how it works, sadly while we have some threads discussing it, nobody yet made any friendly play aid I am aware of that would explain it. Anyway, here is my understanding of the prestige rules. Let me know what I got wrong or missed.

Basics - what is prestige?

At the end of the game each prestige token is worth 1 VP. It does not count as VP for any purpose, including game end.

Gaining prestige

A. Some cards have a small prestige symbol in their top left part, similar to the "Rebel moon" symbol. Playing a card like this onto your tableau gives you a single prestige point.

B. Some cards can generate prestige due to various actions (ex. discard a card from your hand to gain prestige, gain a prestige as an extra bonus for playing a planet, etc.). This is usually explained in detail on each card that does so, in the card rule box in the bottom right.

Prestige leader

Prestige leader mechanic means that as soon as someone gains prestige, some people will be occasionally generating extra VP and drawing extra cards.

VP generation for prestige leader(s):

At the beginning of each turn, before actions are selected, if there is a single player with most prestige, they gain 1 VP. If there is a tie, each tied player gains a VP. Prestige Leader tile should be flipped either to the "single leader" or "tied leaders" side as a reminder of whether there is a single leader or not. The tile has no effect until at least one player earns prestige (in other words, there is no prestige leader or tied leaders at the start of the game).

Card generation for prestige leader:

If there is only one player who is gaining VP (which should be indicated by moving Prestige Leader tile to oneself, flipping it to the single leader side, and putting any gained prestige on top of it), and they have gained at least 1 prestige point in the last turn they can draw one card at the same time they gain their VP point. Then they move all prestige points from the prestige leader tile to their prestige pool (an area were you can keep your prestige points).

If a player became a prestige leader due to the previous leader(s) expenditure of prestige (for example for the Prestige-boosted action), the will receive the prestige tile without prestige point on it, and as such will not draw a card, unless they managed to gain the prestige later on turn.

Prestige/Search card:

This card can be used once per game. It can be used either for:
* Search action, which replaces the usual action. It happens before Exploration phase. A player who took the Search action does not get to play another action card (and thus cannot trigger a new action phase, but can still participate in action phases triggered by other players). Searching players chooses one of several search categories and looks for a card meeting that category. If they dislike the found card, they can search again for a card meeting said category, but have to keep the second card.
* Prestige-enhanced action. A player can use the the Prestige action card to boost the regular action as per symbols indicated on the card. This requires spending one prestige as soon as the action cards are reveled (discarding one prestige token)

I hope the above is a clear explanation of the prestige rules - well, assuming I didn't make any mistakes If I did, I will try to edit this post to make it more helpful as a guide for others.
 
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mar hawkman
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It's easier if you don't have to remember to do the prestige leader thing constantly.
 
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Suzan
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We play exactly like this, with one addition to the very last point: if you use prestige enhanced action, you also pay one prestige.
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PL = Prestige Leader = the tile
PP = Prestige Point = the token itself
TO = takeover

Prokonsul Piotrus wrote:
Card generation for prestige leader:

If there is only one player who is gaining VP, and they have gained at least 1 prestige point in the last turn (which should be indicated by moving Prestige Leader tile to oneself, flipping it to the single leader side, and putting any gained prestige on top of it) they can draw one card at the same time they gain their VP point. Then they move all prestige points from the prestige leader tile to their prestige pool (an area were you can keep your prestige points).


Well, the PL tile isn't that big, so I would use just one PP to place on there. Not every single PP you got that turn needs to be on there.


Prokonsul Piotrus wrote:


Prestige/Search card:

This card can be used once per game. It can be used either for:
* Search action, which replaces the usual action. It happens before Exploration phase. A player who took the Search action does not get to play another action card (and thus cannot trigger a new action phase, but can still participate in action phases triggered by other players). Searching players chooses one of several search categories and looks for a card meeting that category. If they dislike the found card, they can search again for a card meeting said category, but have to keep the second card.

Minor thing is if you're playing without takeovers, then you can't search for a card with a TO power. Those get ignored, like



Prokonsul Piotrus wrote:
* Prestige-enhanced action. A player can use the the Prestige action card to boost the regular action as per symbols indicated on the card.

You need to pay a PP for this (at the time you use it)

2 ways to go about this IIRC...
play this card with the appropriate action card (but you'd need to put them one on top the other to not give away you're doing a Prestige-action.
Or announce what phase you're doing with the single Prestige card, or that you want to do a Prestige action with a single action card, and hope that no1 tries to exploit looking at what others picked in that brief moment that's not entirely simultaneous.


Prokonsul Piotrus wrote:
I hope the above is a clear explanation of the prestige rules - well, assuming I didn't make any mistakes If I did, I will try to edit this post to make it more helpful as a guide for others.

Yeah, it's quite spot on!
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Tom Lehmann
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You've gotten the basic rules of Prestige correct by ignoring the messy corner cases where the PL *spends* prestige during the round, leading to changes in the PL. When this happens the following statement may not hold:

Prokonsul Piotrus wrote:
If there is only one player who is gaining VP, and they have gained at least 1 prestige point in the last turn[...]

If someone gained prestige *before* the PL changed in a round due to an expenditure, then they may not have any prestige on the PL tile at the start of the next round and would not draw a card despite being the sole PL (at that point) and having gained a prestige in the previous round.

The rules are designed to not involve having to remember details of the previous round by managing the prestige on the PL tile.
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Tom Lehmann
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ackmondual wrote:

Well, the PL tile isn't that big, so I would use just one PP to place on there. Not every single PP you got that turn needs to be on there.

Again, this mostly works except possibly when prestige expenditures are involved.

All the messy corner cases in the Prestige rules stem from Prestige expenditures in the middle of a round. You guys can ignore them; I don't get to.

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mar hawkman
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I ignore those corner cases by not using Prestige leader.
 
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Tom Lehmann
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marhawkman wrote:
I ignore those corner cases by not using Prestige leader.


We get that. You're welcome to play any variant you want to. But, that's not what the OP is trying to do in this thread.
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mar hawkman
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
marhawkman wrote:
I ignore those corner cases by not using Prestige leader.


We get that. You're welcome to play any variant you want to. But, that's not what the OP is trying to do in this thread.
Ok, yeah, good point.

But yeah, you need to re-check who is Prestige leader any time anyone gains or loses Prestige.

How many things actually care about it if PL changes during a round?
 
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Tom Lehmann
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The PL changes is just about whether some player gets a VP and a card next round.

How big is that (perceived) effect? Well, it's big enough that some players consider the prestige lead unbalanced and others play without it, so it would seem to be fairly big! ;-)

Are the PL game play benefits worth the effort spent tracking it? That's a judgement call. You decided it wasn't. I, as the designer, obviously think it's worth it or I wouldn't have put it in the game. Tastes clearly vary. (In other news, water is wet.)
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marhawkman wrote:
Tom Lehmann wrote:
marhawkman wrote:
I ignore those corner cases by not using Prestige leader.


We get that. You're welcome to play any variant you want to. But, that's not what the OP is trying to do in this thread.
Ok, yeah, good point.

But yeah, you need to re-check who is Prestige leader any time anyone gains or loses Prestige.

How many things actually care about it if PL changes during a round?

You need to check for your powers anyways. I've seen way to many people boost about building a great card like Interstellar Bank, but forget to take the card every II (and then I have to remind them of that).
 
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Todd McCorkle
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
(In other news, water is wet.)


surpriseWHAT?!surprise
When did this happen?

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Piotr Konieczny
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Thanks for the corrections. I've added them to the op post in bold. Does it make sense and covers all weird cases now?
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Tom Lehmann
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Nope.

Now, your description of the Prestige Leader gaining prestige is incorrect. Try something like "while being or becoming sole Prestige leader" for the first bolded section.

In the second section, you don't cover the case where someone becomes Prestige Leader due to the former Prestige Leader expending Prestige and then gains Prestige later in the turn (and, therefore, should draw a card at the start of next round in addition to gaining a VP). This paragraph would seem to say they don't draw a card.

Note that the Prestige spent for the Prestige bonus occurs immediately upon revealing action cards (not during the phase in which the bonus takes place).
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Piotr Konieczny
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I have updated the bolded sections per your corrections, I hope I got it right this time. If something is still wrong or could be better said, please suggest how to say it better. As I said earlier, prestige rules are among the most confusing rules I have encountered (perhaps due to the unfortunate exception-to-exception style of implementation), and I would like to help everyone by creating a friendlier/clearer rule explanation (maybe one day someone will make a pdf file or such from it).
 
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