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Subject: Buildings 401 and 402 and end game. rss

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Amilcar Piedade
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Do these bonuses apply to each of a player's Power Plants when resolving highest sum of Time Travel ranges or do they count as +1 and +2 overall bonuses only?

Thanks.
 
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Dan Collins
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It adds to the range of a power plant when you use it to focus back on the timeline.

For example if you had both buildings 401 and 104: You can use a scientist on building 104 and then set your focus up to 3 eras back on the timeline.
(2 eras back from building 104 + 1 extra era back because of building 401)
 
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Adrian Schmidt
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Slyzx1 wrote:
It adds to the range of a power plant when you use it to focus back on the timeline.

For example if you had both buildings 401 and 104: You can use a scientist on building 104 and then set your focus up to 3 eras back on the timeline.
(2 eras back from building 104 + 1 extra era back because of building 401)


That doesn't answer the question though. Are they in any way counted when resolving the endgame bonus for highest sum of time travel ranges? And if so, how exactly?
 
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Emanuela
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Page 29, where this Endgame Condition card is explained states as a Note:
Quote:
Labs 401 and 402, and the Temporal Tourism Superproject also count towards this sum. Power plants with an X in their range count as 1 towards this sum.


So yes. They do get counted.
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Adrian Schmidt
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EPratt wrote:
Page 29, where this Endgame Condition card is explained states
Quote:
Labs 401 and 402, and the Temporal Tourism Superproject also count toward this sum.


Then I'd assume that you add the bonus range to each power plant when counting the sum for endgame purposes…
 
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Amilcar Piedade
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I read the note in the rulebook. My question is about how they count. Not if they count.
For end game purposes, do we add up the bonus just once or once for every power plant we've built.
In my session we added up for each power plant, and the question arose because if we only add the bonus once a different player would have won.
 
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Emanuela
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Orckimedes wrote:
I read the note in the rulebook. My question is about how they count. Not if they count.
For end game purposes, do we add up the bonus just once or once for every power plant we've built.
In my session we added up for each power plant, and the question arose because if we only add the bonus once a different player would have won.


Ah, my mistake.

Well, it doesn't make sense to me to make it a flat +1 or +2 because the rulebook does not limit the range increase to just one of your Power Plants--it's "Power Plants," plural. So, since the Labs apply their effect to each Power Plant, I'd argue that it's not a simple +1 or +2 to your range total but dependent on how many Power Plants you have. (Ex. if you have two Power Plants and one of these Labs, you'd get +2 or +4 to your range total. And then if you have both of these Labs and two Power Plants, you'd have +3 or +6.)

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David Turczi
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My ruling would be they count +1/+2 per power plant you have (temporal tourism is not a power plant), but I'm not entirely sure it was Viktor's intention as well when he conceived of that objevtive. Let me ask

When i put the 4 vp on 401, this objective didn't yet exist, and i fear ruling it my way would make this building too strong, hence why I need to ask.

EDIT: See below, indeed for balance purposes they count only once towards the objective.
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Alexa Elvrayen

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I would say that during the game, they add on every action taken in a Power Plant building. But for end game scoring, they add +1/+2 flat to total power, because otherwise it basically becomes a 7 point building (because end game bonus), which is nuts - most superprojects are worth 6, and they're harder to build!
 
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Robert Pratt
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Alexa_Elvrayen wrote:
I would say that during the game, they add on every action taken in a Power Plant building. But for end game scoring, they add +1/+2 flat to total power, because otherwise it basically becomes a 7 point building (because end game bonus), which is nuts - most superprojects are worth 6, and they're harder to build!


I agree with this... 401/402 add to the range of any PP by specific amount, so that's a range that is set for that Lab. +1/+2 is something that can be added to any number of PP per turn, but it is still a set number allowed by the lap, not really an increase to each PP. So, there should only be a single added range based off of what is added by the respective lab.

TDaver wrote:
My ruling would be they count +1/+2 per power plant you have (temporal tourism is not a power plant), but I'm not entirely sure it was Viktor's intention as well when he conceived of that objevtive. Let me ask

When i put the 4 vp on 401, this objective didn't yet exist, and i fear ruling it my way would make this building too strong, hence why I need to ask.


I agree that ruling this way, which is how it seems according to the rules, would make the building(s) too strong and is why I think it should be a set amount total and not dependent on the number of PPs that one has. It would be nice to get a ruling from Viktor as this is one of the few unclear things that I cannot see a definitive/fair ruling being obvious.
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Viktor Péter
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These buildings only count once for the Longest Range endgame condition once - otherwise, like Alexa said, they would pretty much guarantee acing that Condition, and they are worth quite a lot of VPs by default.

Perhaps it would have been a little bit clearer if the note on Page 28 said "...also count towards this sum once".
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Marco Tuzzi
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petervik wrote:
These buildings only count once for the Longest Range endgame condition once - otherwise, like Alexa said, they would pretty much guarantee acing that Condition, and they are worth quite a lot of VPs by default.

Perhaps it would have been a little bit clearer if the note on Page 28 said "...also count towards this sum once".


I agree that adding "once" would seal the deal
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