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Subject: Which from 1914 series rss

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Łukasz
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To all you veterans of 1914 GMT system (1914: Twilight in the East, 1914: Offensive à outrance, 1914: Serbien Muss Sterbien) which one would you recommend as an introduction? Complexity does not bother me as much as access to well developed Vassal module. What I am for is a long, complex system--other than MMP's OCS--which could fit learn-once-play-for-life and 1914 seems to fit the bill nicely. Not to mention it has been recommended by few fellow wargames in the past, so, you know, I've been just wondering.

Thanks.
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Cameron Taylor
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Serbien Muß Sterbien is the smallest of the games and only consists of a single map (22 x 34"). I would start there. The other games are huge monsters by comparison.

Twilight in the East is the largest at four maps, whilst Offensive à outrance has three maps.
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M St
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Hmmm... if play-for-life is a goal, I would recommend the Der Weltkrieg Series instead. Separate games on every major theatre of WWI, and the "Duration Game" covers the whole war. (There is a Vassal module for it.)
Really elegant system, OCS style supply use but much less onerous, and the history is at least as good as the 1914 series.
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Łukasz
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Thanks.

Regarding Der Weltkrieg Series--yes, I did take that under consideration; my major gripe is it is not that popular in my country and, as far as I can see, on BGG. Whatever we can think of free market, GMT is juggernaut in boardgaming industry (wargame-wise) and anything it publishes--unless that's a total flop--gains substantially more friction that blockbusters from any other company. Sad or not sad, not me to judge, but that does impact my buying choices as I rather steer away from less known publishers :/

Now I reckon my original question limited possible choices--nowhere (in my mind, that is) I wanted to confine the scope to WWI--anything past that would work fine and anything of at least operational scale. Tactical systems are not my cup of tea so those I would leave behind. OCS is fine but I am not really fond of MMP different policies and would refrain from diving in deep (I let Baltic Gap go, so far keeping my Tunisia II but thinking of parting with it anyway). There is GMT's front series but it is old system and I know nothing about Vassal support (which, let me stress it once again, is very important for me). Next War? Maybe, though potential conflicts are not really what I fancy most.

So basically it all boils down to modern, widely-known, acclaimed modern system with a decent Vassal support, WWI and post-WWI.
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Russ Williams
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grouchysmurf wrote:
Regarding Der Weltkrieg Series--yes, I did take that under consideration; my major gripe is it is not that popular in my country

If you ever visit Wroclaw, I'll happily play Der Weltkrieg with you.
(Deja vu!)
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Łukasz
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russ wrote:
If you ever visit Wroclaw, I'll happily play Der Weltkrieg with you.
(Deja vu!) :)


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Russ Williams
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Nope, I'm still not a Vassal player, sorry!
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Jim F
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I have played TitE and dabbled with SMS. I liked TitE very much. Thought that forcing players to attack even if not ideal circumstances felt right.
The reliance on the rail network was also a winner.

SMS is a bit more of a slog in difficult terrain but much smaller in terms of scale, so more likely to be played to completion.

I admit I was frightened off by the negative comments on OO.

I own DW games and thought that was an excellent series too.
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Łukasz
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I couldn't find any comments re OOB you are referring to. Mind hinting me on directions?

As you've been appointed a wargame god, I may indeed take a closer look at DW, given your recommendation :-) Thanks.
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Charles Lewis
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OaO featured some streamlining of the combat system, that in my opinion, and several others, took the flavor right out of the system that was so engaging in TiTE. It also has a lot of special cases and exceptions that makes it a burden to play.

TiTE is one of my favorite WWI games. I've not tried the Serbian game, as it supposedly was closer to OaO than TiTE, so I can't speak to it.
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Łukasz
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Meisterchow wrote:
OaO featured some streamlining of the combat system, that in my opinion, and several others, took the flavor right out of the system that was so engaging in TiTE. It also has a lot of special cases and exceptions that makes it a burden to play.


Highlight mine.

That, again, does not really sound like a recommendation. But then again TiTE is long OOP and second hand copies are valued as a somewhat used kidney of an individual who didn't drink too much. I need to think.
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Umberto Colapicchioni
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I own both all 3 games of the 1914 series, and the complete collection of the Der Weltkrieg series and, while they are both very nice systems, and very different, the main issue I have with 1914, is there's not much consistency between games.

1914 TiTe and OaO rules are similar, but NOT the same. Combat is simpler in OaO, step reduction works very differently, the terrain is different (OaO doesn't have roads, for example), and the rules seem like a constant work in progress. This means, your investment in time learning it will be significant, and you have to un-learn several things when switching between the two. I often got frustrated when learning the system, because they kept updating the rules, even years after the game was released.
In addition to that, TiTe (which I guess might be more interesting to you, being from Poland, and it's IMHO the best of the three) is OOP now, so you might end up paying high prices for it. And, of course, you'll simulate only the first months of 1914.

Der Weltkrieg series, seem to fit exactly your "learn-once-play-for-life" requirement, because it's a very coherent system, with an unified map system, a standard ruleset which is the same for all games in the series, which is surprisingly tight and easy to learn, and there are not many "exceptions" from game to game, so you really get the most of the time invested learning it.

There are MANY scenarios covering every major action in WWI, on every front, every year, so the reply value is very high. Since you seemed to be interested in OCS, Der Weltkrieg shares a bit of its supply concepts, but in a more streamlined form. And, the Grand Campaign expansion, which allows to link up all games together, is really something that has no comparison in the wargaming world, because it introduces strong highly strategic elements like productions, materials, etc., so it becomes a "grand-strategy" game, but with the detail of an operational, like OCS. And, the whole series is available and in-print right now, so you can purchase the whole series (399$ at Decision Games), for what it will probably cost you 1914 TiTe+OaO.

I strongly suggest to take a closer look at Der Weltkrieg, because I think it fits your requirements very nicely.
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Charles Lewis
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grouchysmurf wrote:
Meisterchow wrote:
OaO featured some streamlining of the combat system, that in my opinion, and several others, took the flavor right out of the system that was so engaging in TiTE. It also has a lot of special cases and exceptions that makes it a burden to play.


Highlight mine.

That, again, does not really sound like a recommendation. But then again TiTE is long OOP and second hand copies are valued as a somewhat used kidney of an individual who didn't drink too much. I need to think.


My point being that TiTE is an excellent game, in my opinion, while OaO isn't worth the paper it's printed on. If you go that route, you now kn W which title I would recommend.
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Paul Hederer
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Quote:
But then again TiTE is long OOP and second hand copies are valued as a somewhat used kidney of an individual who didn't drink too much. I need to think.


Then used kidney's are cheap .

There's a copy for sale for 65 euros in France. I don't imagine the post to Poland would break the bank.

You need to register as a member. I've bought many games here--good and reliable sellers.

http://www.strategikon.info/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=2272...

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Jim F
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grouchysmurf wrote:
I couldn't find any comments re OOB you are referring to. Mind hinting me on directions?

As you've been appointed a wargame god, I may indeed take a closer look at DW, given your recommendation :-) Thanks.


Lol, I'm not sure if this was directed at me but it was precisely the comments that Charles made about the game that caused me to hesitate.
 
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Terry Lewis
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Łukasz, Der Weltkrieg, Tannenberg (2nd, 2015) is billed by GMT as the new Introduction to the whole Der Weltkrieg series, if you decide to go in that direction rather than the 1914 series. It is small and inexpensive, something we cannot say about some of the others. But, then again, they can become addictive . . and before you know it the whole series is sitting on your shelves.


grouchysmurf wrote:
To all you veterans of 1914 GMT system (1914: Twilight in the East, 1914: Offensive à outrance, 1914: Serbien Muss Sterbien) which one would you recommend as an introduction? Complexity does not bother me as much as access to well developed Vassal module. What I am for is a long, complex system--other than MMP's OCS--which could fit learn-once-play-for-life and 1914 seems to fit the bill nicely. Not to mention it has been recommended by few fellow wargames in the past, so, you know, I've been just wondering.

Thanks.
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grouchysmurf wrote:
But then again TiTE is long OOP and second hand copies are valued as a somewhat used kidney of an individual who didn't drink too much. I need to think.

I decided I wanted a copy of TiTE and was able to arrange what I felt was a fair trade for it. It isn't all that hard to get (GMT printed quite a few copies, and not all the people who own it are clinging to it.)

I traded SPI's Battles for the Ardennes and Okinawa for it, by the way.
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Paul Hederer
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Quote:
Łukasz, Der Weltkrieg, Tannenberg (2nd, 2015) is billed by GMT as the new Introduction to the whole series.


SPW/Decision Games vice GMT.
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Terry Lewis
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Yup, not the 1914 series.


hedererp wrote:
Quote:
Łukasz, Der Weltkrieg, Tannenberg (2nd, 2015) is billed by GMT as the new Introduction to the whole series.


SPW/Decision Games vice GMT.
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