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Subject: Add-On Speculation rss

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Jon Snow
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Thiago has now said there will be three Add-Ons for Rising Sun--meaning extras you have to pay separately for, and which are usually made available later to retail customers--as opposed to Kickstarter Exclusives. The first were the coins just revealed. The second of the three, supposedly The Big One, will be released next week.

Unless something new is coming out of the blue, my guess is that it will be the hypothesized two additional clans. I'm also thinking that six players at a time will be the maximum, but that swopping different clans in and out will be fun, since they all have a special power, unlike in Blood Rage where all clans start out equal.

So eventually retail customers will also be able to play with six, and have one extra to swop (in this scenario, we backers would have two). One poster on the KS discussion has said it would be sad to not be able to play with Fox if you were a retail customer. But of course you could take any clan's minis and just declare them Fox, or any other clan, with that power, couldn't you? And you can use any clan with any variant power you personally come up with as well.

Of course, its still very early, and CMON's plans could be modified down the line. But for now, which Add-Ons do you expect to see?

As for the coins, personally I prefer things that affect game play. Since we've already got plastic coins, I see no need myself for metal here, although I did get a few for another game, Age of Conan: Adventures in Hyboria. I'd have been more willing to consider them if they were being upgraded from only cardboard, as in this other game; but to each their own level of pimping out their games.
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André Gärtner
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My guess is that the big addon includes both a new clan and monsters.
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ah kaiser
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Looking back on Massive Darkness

1. There were 4 BIG ($32-$40) Add-ons: Elementals, Troglodytes, Reptisarians, Ratlings

2. There were 3 medium ($20-32) Add-ons Hero Set Priest, Hero Set Assassin, Tile Set

3. There were 6 small ($8-$17) Add-ons Dice, Plastic Tokens, Cross Over for BP, doors, chests

Based on that, and having coins already as an add-on ; I am guessing one will be in the $32-40 range and maybe a large monster pack with game board extension and 7th clan and the other will be in the $25 range an 8th full clan.

Just guesses though
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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I would bet on:

1. Metal Coins (confirmed)

2. Two Clans (one female) + another monster*

3. Art Book

* As I wrote before, keep in mind that the KS version may come with miniature fortresses and clan tokens. In case those are packed in the KS box (much like BR) that's not a problem. But otherwise it may not be wise to wait with buying the other 2 clans later @retail.
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Jason Brown
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I'm thinking there will be something akin to the Gods expansion in BR. Maybe a Kami expansion with minis, where whomever worships that Kami the most can place them in a province for a special effect.

The Gods expansion is the one thing in BR I never use though, as it's just one more little thing to remember and it messes up the game flow. If they do go that route, I hope it plays smoother.

Another cool one, although highly unlikely, would be a semi-coop expansion featuring a Korean Invasion. Imagine if the kamikaze winds hadn't saved Japan from the conquering Army and the clans had to band together to defeat them. Everyone loses if Korea wins, but each clan wants to position itself to be the most powerful after the invaders are expelled. Maybe there's a hidden traitor who allies with the Koreans, but hidden traitor has been done to death...
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Paul
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Teowulff wrote:
I would bet on:

1. Metal Coins (confirmed)

2. Two Clans (one female) + another monster*

3. Art Book


I hope it's this, as I'd like to stick to my "one addon" budget
 
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Emils E
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Teowulff wrote:
I would bet on:

1. Metal Coins (confirmed)

2. Two Clans (one female) + another monster*

3. Art Book

* As I wrote before, keep in mind that the KS version may come with miniature fortresses and clan tokens. In case those are packed in the KS box (much like BR) that's not a problem. But otherwise it may not be wise to wait with buying the other 2 clans later @retail.


Why does everyone believe that it will be a 2 clan add-on and not a 1 clan add-on with some other stuff?
I'm sure it would have had 7 spots for honor because if you have spare clans then why not use them in game? This is what Scythe had - even with an expansion it was planned to still be 5 players only, but ended up being up to 7 players since everything for that is included so people would play it 7 players anyway.
 
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Jay Wrobel
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I REALLY hope it is a crossover to Blood Rage. Playing Rising Sun with the Blood Rage minis/monsters and/or playing Blood Rage with the Rising Sun minis/monsters. They have done crossovers for Masmorra-Arcadia Quest and Massive Darkness-Black Plague.

It seems the second would be easier as it is only the making of cards and player boards. Not sure how hard it is to port vikings into Rising Sun.

Would be awesome!
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Private Blinky
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hybry wrote:
Why does everyone believe that it will be a 2 clan add-on and not a 1 clan add-on with some other stuff?
I'm sure it would have had 7 spots for honor because if you have spare clans then why not use them in game?


Q1) A perceived level of game component symmetry, mostly.
Q2) I presume that having 7 or 8 players would just be too much to allow all player a fairly level playing field. Plus per current rules, in a 7 player game that would mean the first person performing a political mandate would ALWAYS perform the first mandate every round.

There are 8 territories in the game, and with each clan having their own starting territory, it would just seem a little off (strictly from a 'completionist' perspective) if there was one territory that would never be used under any and all game setups in its entirety. (the irony of my statement is that WILL be the case for any retail copies & players who do not house rule any of the factions to simulate the KSE Fox Clan) This is going on the assumption that like Scythe, all factions have been placed accordingly for balancing purposes, and that they simply didn't randomly place each clan on the Rising Sun map.


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Christophe Muller de Schongor
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hybry wrote:
I'm sure it would have had 7 spots for honor because if you have spare clans then why not use them in game?

Maybe they have / will change this upper-left corner of the board, once everything is unveiled? Because you're right: playing 8 might trick the game a bit, but I can't see hardcore players not going for it anyway...
 
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Jerome Nowak
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ejwrobel wrote:
I REALLY hope it is a crossover to Blood Rage. Playing Rising Sun with the Blood Rage minis/monsters and/or playing Blood Rage with the Rising Sun minis/monsters. They have done crossovers for Masmorra-Arcadia Quest and Massive Darkness-Black Plague.

It seems the second would be easier as it is only the making of cards and player boards. Not sure how hard it is to port vikings into Rising Sun.

Would be awesome!


Someone told me they mentioned in the comments that this WOULD NOT happen.
 
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Private Blinky
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I'm not trying to get myself excessively hyped up, I would personally expect to see 1 to 2 more clans, and maybe a smattering of new monsters on the new Add-On.

What I WOULD like to see... I could easily see this game taking an element of Risk Godstorm, and likely implement that there is a specific unique god belonging to each clan that enters the battlefield. This particular god only provide a passive bonus within a territory, but when there are two opposing gods in the same territory, they will eliminate each other based on Shinto Priest presence on the battlefield. Right now the real draw for Shinto priests is to really go up to the temples, their weight of battlefield presence is just exactly equal to any other units, so you will only see them show up on the grounds if a specific battle or two is overwhelmingly more valuable than any of the Kami bonuses at the time.
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Richard Sampson
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I think if they add more clans, it won't add more players to the game beyond 6. I expect it to be like BR where you have 6 clans but can only play with 5 max. It actually makes more sense here since the factions actually have distinct powers and starting locations so switching them out, even if you can't use them all, does create more variation.

I also would like to see Blood Rage crossover. Eric did mention something in the works for that game recently, and lots of people were speculating it could be a cross-over set.
 
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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PrivateBlinky wrote:
There are 8 territories in the game, and with each clan having their own starting territory, it would just seem a little off (strictly from a 'completionist' perspective) if there was one territory that would never be used under any and all game setups in its entirety. (the irony of my statement is that WILL be the case for any retail copies & players who do not house rule any of the factions to simulate the KSE Fox Clan) This is going on the assumption that like Scythe, all factions have been placed accordingly for balancing purposes, and that they simply didn't randomly place each clan on the Rising Sun map.

Fully agreed. 6 players - but 8 clans to choose from: one for each province.
That would also add to replayability and variation. Which is good.

With a bit of luck (not for your wallet though) there may even be a 9th clan: a "wandering" clan with no fixed strating province that may begin on any not occupied territory. So retail buyers can also start on all of them and the KS backers have one extra to choose from.
But I think not.
 
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Keith Pishnery
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1. Thiago said "Expect a very small amount of add-ons. Right now it's looking like 3 (but of course, things may change). But at least one of them is pretty substantial." So let's stop changing his words to a hard 3, and one of them will be The Big One, or magnificent or amazing.

2. A 2 clan expansion is so weird, I don't even know what to say about that.

3. There will definitely be an art book, so that's 2 of 3 we already know.

My bets for the last substantial one are a retail 6th clan or a retail expansion on the order of Gods or Mystics. However, both of those were included with BR, so maybe we will get a SG expansion and an add-on SG?

They may also be still figuring out what's going to be an SG vs Add-on as they monitor the flow of cash coming. An expansion planned as a SG could become an add-on if flow dies down.
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Jack Reda
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I hope it's not the kami, but I suspect the big one will be just that.
 
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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The Warp wrote:
I hope it's not the kami, but I suspect the big one will be just that.

Nah!

No way CMON won't make a 6th player expansion .. there's about zero chance that it won't happen.
And with the added value of the unique clan abilities and the 8 starter provinces an 8th seems very probable as well.
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Emils E
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PrivateBlinky wrote:
hybry wrote:
Why does everyone believe that it will be a 2 clan add-on and not a 1 clan add-on with some other stuff?
I'm sure it would have had 7 spots for honor because if you have spare clans then why not use them in game?


Q1) A perceived level of game component symmetry, mostly.
Q2) I presume that having 7 or 8 players would just be too much to allow all player a fairly level playing field. Plus per current rules, in a 7 player game that would mean the first person performing a political mandate would ALWAYS perform the first mandate every round.

There are 8 territories in the game, and with each clan having their own starting territory, it would just seem a little off (strictly from a 'completionist' perspective) if there was one territory that would never be used under any and all game setups in its entirety. (the irony of my statement is that WILL be the case for any retail copies & players who do not house rule any of the factions to simulate the KSE Fox Clan) This is going on the assumption that like Scythe, all factions have been placed accordingly for balancing purposes, and that they simply didn't randomly place each clan on the Rising Sun map.

If there are 8 clans in total that that would mean that one clan doesn't get to choose a political mandate as I believe there are only 7 spaces for those. So it would make sense that there are 6 clans available in retail, but there is 7th as a KS extra which is not really meant to be there in a sense that the game is capped at 6, but playable at 7.

Plus you really need a "free" territory in this kind of a game. If everyone has his/her territory that doesn't encourage expansion and fighting so there needs to be something to fight over
 
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Jeff Wagner
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Someone posted that this would eventually be an 8 player game with 8 different clans once all the add on's and KSE's were revealed.

Thiago explicitly stated it will be a maximum of 6 players. He did not deny that 8 clans will be available.

This plus the reveal of a substantial add on, is why everyone believes/expects next weeks big one to be a 2 clan non-exclusive add on.
 
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Scott Sheils
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I think the remaining two will be:

1. Two clan expansion and 4 more monsters
2. Seven Kami
 
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Michael
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I want to see an expansion that adds cool cavalry miniatures to all the clans!
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Becq
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I'd say that one of the two add-ons will certainly be a (non-exclusive) 6th player expansion. It's possible that it will include two additional clans, as others have suggested. But I can't imagine they won't have a 6p expansion available for retail.

There will likely eventually be a "monster" expansion of some sort built around the non-exclusive Oni. I don't think this will be the second add-on, though; I think that much of this expansion will be introduced as stretch goals that will be repackaged as an expansion for retail (like the BR gods expansion).

It seems likely that an art book would be added on at some point ... but frankly, I hope that's not one of the two remaining add-ons, as it really doesn't interest me much.
 
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Thaddeus MacTaggart
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Becq wrote:
There will likely eventually be a "monster" expansion of some sort built around the non-exclusive Oni. I don't think this will be the second add-on, though; I think that much of this expansion will be introduced as stretch goals that will be repackaged as an expansion for retail (like the BR gods expansion).

It seems likely that an art book would be added on at some point ... but frankly, I hope that's not one of the two remaining add-ons, as it really doesn't interest me much.

Well there will only be one big expansion according to Thiago .. it seems very likely it's the extra clan(s). The non KS Oni .. I think it will actually be part of the core box.
After all, we already have a lot of Oni so there won't be extra (perhaps 1), let alone in a themed box.

What is possible of course is that the expansion will contain a few extra monsters, a few season cards, perhaps 2 new Kani.
All in order to make it a complete expansion package.
 
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Nigel McNaughton
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The Fire Dragon is also not exclusive, so we now have 2 monsters towards a retail expansion.
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Max Maloney
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ahkaiser wrote:
Looking back on Massive Darkness

I wouldn't compare it to Massive Darkness. It's a very different type of game and it's not as easy to crank out expansions for a strategy game as for a thematic game (where you can always create new enemies).

New clans seem likely.

There could also be something a little like the Gods expansion for Blood Rage. The gods completely warp how a province is treated by the rules, but only one god per game and only one province at a time so that it didn't upend the whole feel of Blood Rage.

I would look for something like that: an expansion with some modular rules changes that provide a real change to gameplay without transforming the basics of what makes it Rising Sun.
 
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