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Subject: Shadow War Armageddon announced - a new Necromunda? rss

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matthew mclaughlin
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I'm not so sure.

While the game looks promising, a 40K skirmish game set in sprawling hives - I like 40K Kill Team a lot, as I've vowed never to play a large scale 40K game again - I'm not sure we're getting a new edition of Necromunda like we wanted. For starters, this set contain factions of Blood Angels Space Marines and Space Orks, which is not what Necromunda is about.

Will this game be supported (like Blood Bowl), or is this a one-off like several of GW's other recent games? Time will tell, but we'll probably be able to guess when we see the miniatures - if they're previously released minis, it's probably a minis dump.

I was very excited when I heard rumors about a new edition of Necromunda. I'm not sure this is it, but I hope so!

Link: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/03/14/new-game-anno...

Note: I'm not being negative about this game, as I happen to rate most of GW's new game very highly. Betrayal at Calth, Deathwatch Overkill, WHQ Shadows Over Harrenhal, and Gorechosen rate high for me; Assasinorum, WHQ Silver Tower, and Burning of Prospero are good as well. I like GW lately, and I think they're doing really good things. But that said - I want more Necromunda!
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Steve Williams
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While this may play Necromunda adjacent, I do not think it is intended to be Necromunda. Patience fields should remain powered up.

That said, I'll be shocked if this doesn't have some good terrain you can use for Necromunda.
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Tim M-L
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It seems more like a kill team replacement. Oddly, the Kill team box set does not seem to be on GW's web site any more. You can still get the rules ebook.
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matthew mclaughlin
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IncrediSteve wrote:

That said, I'll be shocked if this doesn't have some good terrain you can use for Necromunda.


You called it. This terrain will be most welcome in my Necromunda games, and hopefully GW gives us more.

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Mark
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Do some Googling, and there is interesting info out there. Basically, this is Necromunda with all the 40K factions. Uses the Necromunda rules (so they say), on a skirmish level. Like, buy a box of Eldar Guardians, and you have a faction. New terrain is supposed to be modular.
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matthew mclaughlin
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I've since read those reports - I'm not sure how I feel about that.

I like Necromunda's rules, but barring any significant updates/changes, I already have them. I started playing Necromunda because the game DIDN'T use 40K factions. I liked the gang aspect.

But I do really like Kill Team, and that's the only way I play 40K anymore, so Kill Team with Necromunda-like campaign rules sounds cool to me!
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Jon Karlsson
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ZombieMark wrote:
Uses the Necromunda rules (so they say), on a skirmish level.

Are the Necromunda rules much different from the regular WH40K rules?
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Paul Thompson
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Jon Karlsson wrote:
ZombieMark wrote:
Uses the Necromunda rules (so they say), on a skirmish level.

Are the Necromunda rules much different from the regular WH40K rules?


They are a version of the 2nd 40k rules and all that entails.
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Mark
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Jon Karlsson wrote:
ZombieMark wrote:
Uses the Necromunda rules (so they say), on a skirmish level.

Are the Necromunda rules much different from the regular WH40K rules?

They are based on 40K Second Edition rules. The 2E/Necromunda rules are designed for a smaller model count. Necromunda rules have models take individual actions, instead of squad actions. Any 40K player of any edition would recognize their fundamentals.
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Mark
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Pretty damn busy day. This IS the new Necromunda.

Now, try to convince me this new Age of Sigmar faction is not going to be the new Squats. Just try.

Well, close enough. And, even cooler.
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/03/must-see-gws-new-stea...
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Michael Matecha
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I'm disappointed shake
 
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Steve Williams
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I still don't think this is meant to replace Necromunda. It borrows a lot of Necromundas rules, but I still think this is just another game in their series of boxes designed to "prerelease" new miniatures and/or bulk shift older miniatures.
 
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matthew mclaughlin
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IncrediSteve wrote:
I still don't think this is meant to replace Necromunda. It borrows a lot of Necromundas rules, but I still think this is just another game in their series of boxes designed to "prerelease" new miniatures and/or bulk shift older miniatures.


I'd have to agree. I think this is meant to replace Kill Team as THE 40K skirmish game, which is fine by me. I like to play 40K, but huge games are tedious at this point; I've enjoyed playing Kill Team, but a campaign was much wished-for. We'll have to wait for a new Necromunda, but I'll be happy with this set: I'll use the terrain for Necromunda and the rules for 40K skirmish games.
 
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Mark
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Not saying you guys are wrong, but I think the evidence is against you. What we do know about the new Specialists Games is they are being replaced/revamped/reinvisioned. To wit...

Blood Bowl: Complete update.
Epic: Update in the form of Adeptus Titanicus (which was the ancient pre-Specialist Games precursor to Space Marine/Epic).
BFG: To be determined?
Mordhiem: Shadespire?
GorkaMorka: Gangs of Commorragh.
Necromunda: Shadow War: Armageddon.

All current info tends to point in the direction that Shadow War: Armageddon is Necromunda's replacement. This would not be my first choice. I have a Necromunda scenario set up right now on my gaming table. I only have to peel my son away from the X-box. When I told him about SW:A he said he would like to play that game. The goodness of Necromunda blended with the excitement of 40K, I guess. What ever it takes, IMHO. For that reason, I'm not starting a support group just yet.

All will be revealed in due time.
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matthew mclaughlin
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Oh, I don't want you to think I'm arguing with you. I agree with you, really. I think it just comes down to "what is Necromunda?" to any given person. For me Necromunda is small-time gang warfare. Shadow War seems like "40K with Necromunda campaign rules", which is cool. Necromunda and 40K both scratch different itches for me - this is like a crossbreed, which is cool.

If we get gang rules later in WD or an expansion, I'll be 100% happy!
 
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Mark
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Right. I'm not saying what I think this should be. Only what I think it is.

For all of the reasons we like Necromunda (setting, gangsta's, campaign, emphasis on people, not things), GW resisted officially introducing the outside 40K Universe into Necromunda. I know I did. I found 40K to be a bad influence that tended to distract and detract from my main Necro campaigns.

On the otherhand, I'm not a Troglodyte. My favorite 40K Second Edition games were small skirmishes fought across a street to take a building. Or, battles over clumps of woods and rocky mounds too small to be called hills. I would have loved a 40K campaign fought in a Hive like Archeron on Armageddon. Planning the fighting was easy. The details of putting together a campaign was not.

SW:A is obviously not the best of both worlds. But, it might be the Best New Thing in the world. Besides, the scope and depth of SW:A's campaign could render this discussion moot. How they fit in skills and income for 12 very different factions is intriguing. Or, do they go with a campaign-lite like Gangs of Commorragh? The former emphasizes the campaign. The latter emphasizes the game.
 
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John Middleton
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Gangs is most certainly not am update of Gorkamorka. The only similarity is 40k and vehicles.


Gorkamorka used the Necromunda ruleset with new rules for vehicles, which were sorta based on 2nd ed 40k vehicles.


I'm not even sure Shadowspire will be anything close to Mordheim. I think it is going to be a different thing entirely.
 
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Mark
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Are we sure? GorkaMorka was almost not a Specialist Games. I think it's only support was Gubbins Magazine. And, I don't think there is much desire inside GW or outside for it's return. Again, just an observation, not an opinion. The closest thing to GorkaMorka from GW is obviously Gangs of Commorragh. Yes, a different system and setting. But, 40K vehicles (of sorts) and a campaign. Cleverly set in the skies above Commorragh, obviating the option for foot troops, forts, or 40K-ish ground-pounder rules. You're not wrong to say it's a throwaway comparison, for sure. And, if GW does redo GorkaMorka, no one will be more surprised and happy than me. But, I'm fairly certain GorkaMorka re-envisioned is already on my gaming table right now.

Yes, we don't know much about Shadespire. But, I didn't invent the Mordheim speculation. Feel free to shoot the messenger, but not in the face!

I'm not trying to be a Prophet or Pariah. I just can't help noticing games similar (or nearly identical) to our favorite Specialist Games are coming out before (or instead of?) our favorite Specialists Games.

Gotta ask ourselves, WWGWD?
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Mark
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http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/03/shadow-war-armageddon...

It's starting to remind me of my bachelor days (which ended exactly 3 freaking decades ago!), waking up hungover and seeing what the person lying next to you looks like the morning after.
 
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John Middleton
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Well Shadowspire looks to be an expanded, team play version of Gorechosen.

It's arena combat, so not a new Mordheim.

Gorkamorka relied heavily on foot troops, even if they stayed in vehicles.

Gorkamorka never took off and was discontinued very quickly. Part of the reason was that not everyone like orks and the human Diggers came a bit late to save it.

It was also more expensive to get into than Necromunda becasue you had to buy multiple vehicles for it to work at all.

The Ork fort was awesome though.


Another thing, it used weird little bases so you could cram minis into vehicles. Those bases SUCKED and metal minis were super unstable. Plus they didn't really work with 40k.
 
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matthew mclaughlin
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DegenerateElite wrote:
Well Shadowspire looks to be an expanded, team play version of Gorechosen.


So, like GW's version of Heroclix?!

I like Gorechosen. It's good fun. I'm not sure I like the idea of a "full size" version of it, but I'll check it out.
 
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Besides the words arena and combatants, how are folks drawing comparisons to Gorechosen? Based on what else?
 
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matthewabair wrote:
Besides the words arena and combatants, how are folks drawing comparisons to Gorechosen? Based on what else?



It was the last GW arena combat game. Many people asked for more factions to be playable.

It featured fast combat that incorporated cards and unit cards, which is what will likely happen here.


It won't likely be an exact copy, but how could it not be close?
 
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DegenerateElite wrote:
matthewabair wrote:
Besides the words arena and combatants, how are folks drawing comparisons to Gorechosen? Based on what else?



It was the last GW arena combat game. Many people asked for more factions to be playable.

It featured fast combat that incorporated cards and unit cards, which is what will likely happen here.


It won't likely be an exact copy, but how could it not be close?


Since Gorechosen and Necromunda aren't similar except they both have minatures and dice, I guess we will see. We play Gorechosen every week, not much like anything we have played from GW, and if this will be Necromunda rules it won't be anything like Gorechosen.
 
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John Middleton
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matthewabair wrote:
DegenerateElite wrote:
matthewabair wrote:
Besides the words arena and combatants, how are folks drawing comparisons to Gorechosen? Based on what else?



It was the last GW arena combat game. Many people asked for more factions to be playable.

It featured fast combat that incorporated cards and unit cards, which is what will likely happen here.


It won't likely be an exact copy, but how could it not be close?


Since Gorechosen and Necromunda aren't similar except they both have minatures and dice, I guess we will see. We play Gorechosen every week, not much like anything we have played from GW, and if this will be Necromunda rules it won't be anything like Gorechosen.



I think you are confused.

Shadow War is the 40k faction game with Necromunda based rules.

Shadowspire (Shadespire, sorry)is the Mortal Realms AoS fantasy game that will be arena team combat and likely an expanded Gorechosen.

Two different games.
 
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