Francois-Xavier
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I just got myself the UK Exp.1 and half the cards are hostile UK troops, which require you to get the German expansions to be of any use. So why couldn't the packs be organised along the lines of

UK exp.1: all player UK soldiers and gear
UK exp.2: all hostile UK cards.

The way it's organised now feels a bit like a cash grab as 20 euros for a small pack of cards of which you only use half is very steep. Especially compared to the base game cost which was quite reasonable. I hope that the future expansions will be organised a bit differently.


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Matt A.
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See
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1710163/expansions-seem-mes...

And then maybe
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1656030/type-and-number-car...
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Francois-Xavier
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thanks, I have seen these threads and it's useful to have a better idea of the contents of the expansions. I still think they could be better organised in the future though
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Robert
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macfix wrote:
I just got myself the UK Exp.1 and half the cards are hostile UK troops, which require you to get the German expansions to be of any use. So why couldn't the packs be organised along the lines of

UK exp.1: all player UK soldiers and gear
UK exp.2: all hostile UK cards.

The way it's organised now feels a bit like a cash grab as 20 euros for a small pack of cards of which you only use half is very steep. Especially compared to the base game cost which was quite reasonable. I hope that the future expansions will be organised a bit differently.




The way you suggest packaging is EXACTLY the way it should be done. Obviously that would hurt sales, as you wouldn't be buying over and over more or less recycled content with different pictures and instead you could focus on what you actually want. Like building up a UK team - it all could have gone into one expansion, and should have.





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Scott Key
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Very unhappy with the way the cards were distributed in the expansions.
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Francois-Xavier
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Let's hope Dan takes this on board for the next wave of expansions then
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Ken McElhaney
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macfix wrote:
Let's hope Dan takes this on board for the next wave of expansions then


I seriously doubt that DVG will make any significant changes to how they sell expansions for one reason, economics.

Put simply, you are suggesting that Dan should "put all the cards you like in one expansion so you don't have to buy two expansions."

Of course, doing that means one expansion will sell more than the other, probably considerably more. I understand your intentions, but the effect is reducing the expansions to only what most people clearly want and forgetting the rest.

It makes more economic sense to not spend the time, money, and effort to produce expansions that are just not going to sell that well in the first place. Let's just stick to the Americans, UK, and Russians going up against the Germans. Whatever sells the most is what will be provided to maximize profits.

Dan is trying to sell all the expansions as much as possible to provide all of us with choices. To do that means splitting up the cards you like so they help provide all the choices we want. That is nothing new, it is actually quite an old marketing tactic used in several different industries.

Personally, I like having more choices and it's worth paying more to have them even if I do not buy all of them.


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Robert
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Choices? What choices? I don't see them. I see recycled game content with pasted on pics so now you have more nations / hostiles, but they are really all the same. Use the same missions, same objectives and same action deck. They all have access to the same skills, all play the same generic campaign and there are only slight differences in equipment.

Then you take the valuable cards which actually do create game play, like locations, missions, skills, equipment, service records and soldiers and you split them up through multiple expansions to encourage people to buy more.

Had more time been spent developing differences between the Nations I'd be more open to seeing the value of choice that DVG is supposedly giving. I've bought most of the expansions and consider it a waste. Too samey- no matter who you are playing. So yeah, terrible packaging for me and highly discouraged to further support the game or future expansions.

 
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Ken McElhaney
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P.O.G.G. wrote:
Choices? What choices? I don't see them. I see recycled game content with pasted on pics so now you have more nations / hostiles, but they are really all the same. Use the same missions, same objectives and same action deck. They all have access to the same skills, all play the same generic campaign and there are only slight differences in equipment.

Then you take the valuable cards which actually do create game play, like locations, missions, skills, equipment, service records and soldiers and you split them up through multiple expansions to encourage people to buy more.

Had more time been spent developing differences between the Nations I'd be more open to seeing the value of choice that DVG is supposedly giving. I've bought most of the expansions and consider it a waste. Too samey- no matter who you are playing. So yeah, terrible packaging for me and highly discouraged to further support the game or future expansions.



If they are all alike as you say, then what is your beef exactly?

That you had to purchase two UK expansions to get the cards that were "identical" to the US? And once you made this discovery, you purchased "most" of the expansions anyway and now are disappointed?

Looks like you have no one to blame but yourself. If as you say you find it all the same and are "highly discouraged" in supporting the game in the future, then your original statement in the thread, "I hope that the future expansions will be organised a bit differently." is rather meaningless since you won't be buying them anyway, right?


 
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Robert
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busco wrote:

... your original statement in the thread, "I hope that the future expansions will be organised a bit differently." is rather meaningless since you won't be buying them anyway, right?




Well I could debate whether such a statement is in fact in conflict with being discouraged - can you clarify please where I did write that? I think you might be confusing me with another poster.
 
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Robert
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busco wrote:


That you had to purchase two UK expansions to get the cards that were "identical" to the US? And once you made this discovery, you purchased "most" of the expansions anyway and now are disappointed?




You must know something I don't know. As far as I recall, I don't even own the UK Expansions ... nor was my discovery in such a manner.

And also, I didn't use the word "identical", please don't quote me as though I had.
 
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Ken McElhaney
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P.O.G.G. wrote:
busco wrote:


That you had to purchase two UK expansions to get the cards that were "identical" to the US? And once you made this discovery, you purchased "most" of the expansions anyway and now are disappointed?




You must know something I don't know. As far as I recall, I don't even own the UK Expansions ... nor was my discovery in such a manner.

And also, I didn't use the word "identical", please don't quote me as though I had.


I apologize, I mistook you for the author of the thread and in my haste did not verify it. It did not occur to me at the time that someone else apart from the author would respond to my post since it was only directed at that person. However, that is no excuse, so again, I apoligize for it.

Having said that in re-reading your statement it strikes me as odd that anyone who has clearly disliked the expansions as you have stated would take one second out of your day to post any type of response at all.

When I purchase and play a game that turns out not to be to my liking or expansions that are disappointing as you say, I do not go back to the game's BGG page at all. I have far better things to do than waste my time on something like that.

Clearly, you have different priorities in your life, so, more power to you if you find it productive.
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Robert
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busco wrote:


...

When I purchase and play a game that turns out not to be to my liking or expansions that are disappointing as you say, I do not go back to the game's BGG page at all. I have far better things to do than waste my time on something like that.

Clearly, you have different priorities in your life, so, more power to you if you find it productive.


Well, you obviously aren't crazy then, are you? Obviously the same can't be said for me.

Anyhow, it was always my intention to write a review on the game even before I bought it. I bought expansions en masse and I even bit the bullet on the Ammo Box to see if it was worth buying. (Kind of a Catch-22 isn't it?) This is what happens when you have more time and money than sense.
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David in Sydney (now in Coffs)
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I'll talk to Dan about the concerns with the organisation of expansions.

Mea Culpa
The original Wave 1 intention was to provide a single Expansion pack of Soldiers and Frontline Hostiles per nation (exception being core box and German Expansion would have German soldiers and US hostiles).
When expanding to include 2 levels of hostiles and more soldiers and more of everything.. it upset the planning somewhat (in three cases NPS's got separated from weapons, etc)

Current planning for Wave 2 is starting with the assumption that people will be interested in backing, and if as successful as wave 1, we might have to bring in wave 3..

More later...
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David in Sydney (now in Coffs)
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macfix wrote:
I just got myself the UK Exp.1 and half the cards are hostile UK troops, which require you to get the German expansions to be of any use. So why couldn't the packs be organised along the lines of

UK exp.1: all player UK soldiers and gear
UK exp.2: all hostile UK cards.

The way it's organised now feels a bit like a cash grab as 20 euros for a small pack of cards of which you only use half is very steep. Especially compared to the base game cost which was quite reasonable. I hope that the future expansions will be organised a bit differently.




Dan is looking at the above for Wave 2 later this year, and possibly for the next print run of Wave 1..

I'm also trying to sell him on Theatre Expansions and Logistics Packs.

More later..

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Francois-Xavier
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Thanks for the explanation and for offering to relay my concerns to Dan. I'm curious to see what you guys have planned for wave 2.
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David in Sydney (now in Coffs)
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Here is what has been proposed to date

Pacific:
USMC
Japanese
Australians
Chinese
French
Finns

and on my wish list (need to convince DVG):
Fallschirmjager (German #3 1939-45)
Clandestine (still working on it)
Dieselium (very early drafts of Diesel Punk)
 
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Aaron Day
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P.O.G.G. wrote:
Choices? What choices? I don't see them. I see recycled game content with pasted on pics so now you have more nations / hostiles, but they are really all the same.

I just got the game, but are the expansion enemy cards just -exact- copies of the Germans?
 
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David in Sydney (now in Coffs)
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Hedgehobbit wrote:
P.O.G.G. wrote:
Choices? What choices? I don't see them. I see recycled game content with pasted on pics so now you have more nations / hostiles, but they are really all the same.

I just got the game, but are the expansion enemy cards just -exact- copies of the Germans?


Yes - some differences are the picture - but there is more too it than just that.

National and Elite/Frontline differences
Some are very similar - after all 3 riflemen are 3 men with rifles, however they may have different to hit numbers, different cover values, are more or less common etc.
Some have more differences - eg Ambushers - some Cost 1 XP to avoid Surprise, others 2 XP, others 3 XP etc.
Some Flankers will hit the Rearmost soldier(s) others the Targeted soldier.

But - The mix of different types of Hostiles will vary between nations.
Each nation has somewhat different flavour and different challenges - eg the Polish Hostiles have a lot of Fearless troops - these require a different approach to overcome them.


 
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