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Subject: Pioneers - Adrenaline shots and Secret Passage rss

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Christopher Melenberg
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1. For Adrenaline shots (reward = take up to 2 more adventure actions) - do you need to use exosuits/workers and pay for the actions? Or do you take up to two more adventure actions with the same suit and use whatever your existing bonus/penalty is when take the two actions?

2. Also for Secret Tunnels (reward = take either a research/recruit/construct action, do it again) Again does this require using more exosuits and workers or are they immediate actions that do not cost anything (construct would obviously still cost resources).

There may be another card or two that has similar effects, but a ruling here will help me to apply it more broadly.

Thanks
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Marco Tuzzi
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TopherMel wrote:
1. For Adrenaline shots (reward = take up to 2 more adventure actions) - do you need to use exosuits/workers and pay for the actions? Or do you take up to two more adventure actions with the same suit and use whatever your existing bonus/penalty is when take the two actions?

2. Also for Secret Tunnels (reward = take either a research/recruit/construct action, do it again) Again does this require using more exosuits and workers or are they immediate actions that do not cost anything (construct would obviously still cost resources).

There may be another card or two that has similar effects, but a ruling here will help me to apply it more broadly.

Thanks


They both don't cost additional workers/exosuits: you get them for free with the worker+exosuit you used to take the first adventure action
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Christopher Melenberg
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Tootzo wrote:
TopherMel wrote:
1. For Adrenaline shots (reward = take up to 2 more adventure actions) - do you need to use exosuits/workers and pay for the actions? Or do you take up to two more adventure actions with the same suit and use whatever your existing bonus/penalty is when take the two actions?

2. Also for Secret Tunnels (reward = take either a research/recruit/construct action, do it again) Again does this require using more exosuits and workers or are they immediate actions that do not cost anything (construct would obviously still cost resources).

There may be another card or two that has similar effects, but a ruling here will help me to apply it more broadly.

Thanks


They both don't cost additional workers/exosuits: you get them for free with the worker+exosuit you used to take the first adventure action


Okay so your power bonus is identical for adrenaline shots.

And for the bonus actions do they count your current worker as limiting/benefitting how you take the actions?
Edit: Eg - engineer in exosuit so can't research, can't recruit geniuses, but gets a discount on construct
 
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Marco Tuzzi
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TopherMel wrote:
Tootzo wrote:
TopherMel wrote:
1. For Adrenaline shots (reward = take up to 2 more adventure actions) - do you need to use exosuits/workers and pay for the actions? Or do you take up to two more adventure actions with the same suit and use whatever your existing bonus/penalty is when take the two actions?

2. Also for Secret Tunnels (reward = take either a research/recruit/construct action, do it again) Again does this require using more exosuits and workers or are they immediate actions that do not cost anything (construct would obviously still cost resources).

There may be another card or two that has similar effects, but a ruling here will help me to apply it more broadly.

Thanks


They both don't cost additional workers/exosuits: you get them for free with the worker+exosuit you used to take the first adventure action


Okay so your power bonus is identical for adrenaline shots.

And for the bonus actions do they count your current worker as limiting/benefitting how you take the actions?
Edit: Eg - engineer in exosuit so can't research, can't recruit geniuses, but gets a discount on construct


Obviously, for both
With Adrenaline Shots you're just taking more adventures with your worker (that's the point of shooting some adrenaline in the worker's blood).
With secret tunnels, the worker you sent out on adventure found a tunnel leading to the capital, so it's him/her taking those bonus actions and all requirements/bonuses apply (regarding workers, I mean, not the bonuses on eventual collapsing capital tiles; you're copying capital actions, just as you would do with a World Council action or a Guardian action so bonuses/costs on the hex spaces of those actions do not apply). Unfortunately you draw adventure cards randomly, but knowing that you could end up with Secret Tunnels, it would be wise sending a genius out
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Christopher Melenberg
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So your logic is that it what worker you send matters, which makes thematic sense. There are also it cards which are research actions and maybe others trade with nomads etc.

Was this the design intention? Originally I didn't think so, but you've got me wondering. A ruling would be useful maybe just for me. As the rulebook doesn't address this.

Thanks for your input though Marco.
 
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Marco Tuzzi
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TopherMel wrote:
So your logic is that it what worker you send matters, which makes thematic sense. There are also it cards which are research actions and maybe others trade with nomads etc.

Was this the design intention? Originally I didn't think so, but you've got me wondering. A ruling would be useful maybe just for me. As the rulebook doesn't address this.

Thanks for your input though Marco.


Rules don't take into account what doesn't need to be addressed. Those adventures let you immediately take another actions. They don't let you put another worker on the board, so it's implicit that you use that very same worker out on adventuring to take the other bonus actions.
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Jon David
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Tootzo wrote:
TopherMel wrote:
So your logic is that it what worker you send matters, which makes thematic sense. There are also it cards which are research actions and maybe others trade with nomads etc.

Was this the design intention? Originally I didn't think so, but you've got me wondering. A ruling would be useful maybe just for me. As the rulebook doesn't address this.

Thanks for your input though Marco.


Rules don't take into account what doesn't need to be addressed. Those adventures let you immediately take another actions. They don't let you put another worker on the board, so it's implicit that you use that very same worker out on adventuring to take the other bonus actions.


By the wording, I believe you still pay 1/2 water for each of those adventures depending on which you choose.
 
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Christopher Melenberg
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Takenokojon wrote:
Tootzo wrote:
TopherMel wrote:
So your logic is that it what worker you send matters, which makes thematic sense. There are also it cards which are research actions and maybe others trade with nomads etc.

Was this the design intention? Originally I didn't think so, but you've got me wondering. A ruling would be useful maybe just for me. As the rulebook doesn't address this.

Thanks for your input though Marco.


Rules don't take into account what doesn't need to be addressed. Those adventures let you immediately take another actions. They don't let you put another worker on the board, so it's implicit that you use that very same worker out on adventuring to take the other bonus actions.


By the wording, I believe you still pay 1/2 water for each of those adventures depending on which you choose.


I would think you don't pay any additional water... Again would be good to get an official ruling.
 
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Marco Tuzzi
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You pay water when you place your worker on the hex space. Any bonus actions that worker may do don't cost anything since he/she is already there.

Edit: the water cost is actually tied to choosing one of the adventure decks, so you have to pay water for those additional adventure actions if you choose to take them (or just one of them)

Oh, and I keep on forgetting: you keep your power rating to some extent; you don't put another path marker on one of the round-shaped spots (you keep the one you just used) but you roll the die again, since rolling is tied to drawing adventure cards.

So, to resume: if you succeed on Adrenaline Shots, you get 3W and may take up to 2 more adventure actions; if you choose to do so, you pay 1/2W and draw from the corresponding adventure deck 1 adventure card (+ any more yo may have access to based on your sensor range); you choose one, as usual; you keep your power bonus from the pioneers board and your exosuits upgrades, but you roll the power die anew, since it represents the random events that occur while adventuring. After succeeding or failing, you may choose to take the second bonus adventure from Adrenaline Shot. If you choose so, proceed as before.
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Viktor Péter
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Marco is right on both accounts (thanks Marco!). When you take an additional action as a result of the Adventure, you take it with the Worker you sent on that Adventure - you don't need to send another Exosuit/Worker, or occupy that Action's space. This also means that Worker restrictions apply, so there is a small risk of hitting Rogue AI with, say, an Administrator, who just won't understand what the Rogue AI is talking about.

As for Adrenaline Shots, it's still that same Worker taking the two more Adventures, and he/she does need to spend their Water cost. Conveniently, the card gives 3 Water first

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Christopher Melenberg
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petervik wrote:
Marco is right on both accounts (thanks Marco!). When you take an additional action as a result of the Adventure, you take it with the Worker you sent on that Adventure - you don't need to send another Exosuit/Worker, or occupy that Action's space. This also means that Worker restrictions apply, so there is a small risk of hitting Rogue AI with, say, an Administrator, who just won't understand what the Rogue AI is talking about.

As for Adrenaline Shots, it's still that same Worker taking the two more Adventures, and he/she does need to spend their Water cost. Conveniently, the card gives 3 Water first



Thanks Viktor for clearing this up for me.
 
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Barry Miller
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Tootzo wrote:
... you don't put another path marker on one of the round-shaped spots (you keep the one you just used)

Can you cite a reference for this? Because that's definitely not how I interpret the rules.

The Adrenaline Shot is very clear that it lets you take two additional Adventure Actions. Well, according to the module rulebook, the steps for taking an Adventure Action as listed on page 4 include placing a Path Marker as Step #2 of the Action sequence.

So the way I read it, is that for each additional Adventure Action, you must place an additional Path Marker. I.e., if you take two additional Adventure Actions, then by the time you've completed the 2nd additional action, you'll have three of you Path Markers on the board. This only makes sense, when you think about it... each additional action provides a lessor power bonus.

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