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Subject: Routing pathways rss

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Tankboy
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So I have already routed the broken Squad that was in F8 into G9. I obviously cannot Route the broken Squad & Leader in E9 to F8 because they would still be adjacent to enemy Squads and eliminated.

Can they go to F9 and then into G9? I'm thinking no, only in the fact that shifting them into F9 keeps them at a 3 Hex range from the Broken German Leader in G7 but by moving into G9 brings them 1 Hex closer. Do I need to Route out of the building an into the Forest Hex located in H10?

Advice?
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Fly by Night wrote:

So I have already routed the broken Squad that was in F8 into G9. I obviously cannot Route the broken Squad & Leader in E9 to F8 because they would still be adjacent to enemy Squads and eliminated.

Can they go to F9 and then into G9? I'm thinking no, only in the fact that shifting them into F9 keeps them at a 3 Hex range from the Broken German Leader in G7 but by moving into G9 brings them 1 Hex closer. Do I need to Route out of the building an into the Forest Hex located in H10?

Advice?


Assuming they can currently see the units in G7, then your guess is correct. But if no LOS exists between G7 and E9, then there is no problem with a route to F9-G9.

If LOS exists, you can low crawl or route to H10.
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Tankboy
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Nuts, I forgot about the caveat. OK, I just checked the LOS between the Routing Broken Units and the Broken German Leader and there is no LOS. So the Russians route to F9 and then into G9.

They now have LOS to the German Broken Leader in G7. However, they are no longer adjacent to a known enemy unit and they are inside a building, so they can legally stop here or continue into H8, correct?

EDIT: Or, I can just use Low Crawl to F9 and be done with it, Yes?
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JP Laurio
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Yes to both, as far as I can see.
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Shawn Viney
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Fly by Night wrote:
They now have LOS to the German Broken Leader in G7. However, they are no longer adjacent to a known enemy unit and they are inside a building, so they can legally stop here or continue into H8, correct?


Yes, that is correct.

Fly by Night wrote:
EDIT: Or, I can just use Low Crawl to F9 and be done with it, Yes?


Not quite. Low crawl requires the entire MF allotment of the routing unit (It is a rout of 1 hex only). You cannot do a low crawl after starting your rout. In this case, you cannot low crawl to F9 since no German unit has LOS to that hex.

At the start of this unit's rout you have 3 possible destinations, G9, H8 & H10.

G9 - Rout to F9 and then G9
H8 - Rout to F9, G9 and then H8
H10 - Rout to F9, G10 and then H10

H10 is legal, even though it is further away in MF than G9, because G9 is the same distance as E9 from the German units in F7. You are not required to rout to a hex that is equidistant from a KEU. This makes H10 a legal destination.

Regards,

Shawn



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Tankboy
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The above situation is in regards to the Squad currently in E9. The Broken Unit in G9 has already routed (Low Crawled) from F8.

Cannot the broken Squad that's in E9 just Low Crawl out of the building into F9?
 
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Shawn Viney
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Fly by Night wrote:
The above situation is in regards to the Squad currently in E9. The Broken Unit in G9 has already routed (Low Crawled) from F8.


The broken unit cannot Low Crawl from F8 to G9. It routs from F8 to G9. Low Crawl is special Rout case that is used to avoid interdiction and interdiction only occurs in an open ground hex in the normal range and LOS of a Known Enemy Unit. If a unit is routing in a building, interdiction cannot occur and Low Crawl does not apply.

Fly by Night wrote:
Cannot the broken Squad that's in E9 just Low Crawl out of the building into F9?


Unless there is on part of the board that I cannot see, Low Crawl will not apply. None of the German units have LOS to hex F9 so interdiction is not possible. The broken unit will rout normally, and must route to one of the three hexes I mentioned earlier (G9, H8 or H10). Remember, a unit MUST rout to the nearest legal building or woods hex. It cannot choose to stop before it reaches such a hex. The only exception to this is if the unit is subject to interdiction. Then the unit can choose to use low crawl to move only 1 hex and avoid the interdiction.

Regards,

Shawn
 
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JP Laurio
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You can choose to Low Crawl even if there is no risk of Interdiction.
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JP Laurio
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Fly by Night wrote:
Cannot the broken Squad that's in E9 just Low Crawl out of the building into F9?

Yes, it can.
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Well now I'm in a predicament zombie
 
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The broken squad moving from F8 to G9 is legal, but its now a question if its considered a Low Crawl or a Route?

And, now, I have no idea about the unit in E9. Can he low crawl to F9 (out of a building and into a clear space that is out of enemy LOS

or, since it is the Route Phase and units are required to Route to the closest building or forest hex, they have to Route to G9 and then to H10 once discovering they entered the LOS of the broken German Leader?
 
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Let me see if I can clear the murky waters here....


sviney wrote:

The broken unit cannot Low Crawl from F8 to G9. It routs from F8 to G9. Low Crawl is special Rout case that is used to avoid interdiction and interdiction only occurs in an open ground hex in the normal range and LOS of a Known Enemy Unit. If a unit is routing in a building, interdiction cannot occur and Low Crawl does not apply.


There is no rule which prohibits low crawling to a hex where interdiction would not occur normally. That is, the broken units in E9 can choose to low crawl to F9.




norev wrote:
You can choose to Low Crawl even if there is no risk of Interdiction.


Correct.



Fly by Night wrote:
The broken squad moving from F8 to G9 is legal, but its now a question if its considered a Low Crawl or a Route?

And, now, I have no idea about the unit in E9. Can he low crawl to F9 (out of a building and into a clear space that is out of enemy LOS

or, since it is the Route Phase and units are required to Route to the closest building or forest hex, they have to Route to G9 and then to H10 once discovering they entered the LOS of the broken German Leader?


Let's talk about the broken unit in E9. It is the start of the route phase, and he is adjacent to a known enemy unit. He must route away, to the closest woods or building hex. Remember that he cannot move closer to a KNOWN enemy unit during his route. So, as we discussed: If he had LOS to G7, he could not route to G9. Since we know there is no LOS (and you are free to check this LOS in-game), G9 is a legal route destination. Note that the fact the squad in G7 is broken does not matter, i.e. your broken unit will not move closer to an known enemy unit, broken or no.

It will take 3 MFs to reach G9, so it seems like that will be the routing destination. But, remember that you can ignore G9 if you want to, because it is part of the same building the broken unit began its route phase in (3rd paragraph of rule 3.6). But again, you do not have to ignore G9 if you don't want to.

If you choose to ignore G9, you would then have to route to H10 for 4 MFs.

So, you have 3 options:

1. Route F9-G9 (Having LOS to G7 does not prohibit you from routing here. Nothing compels you to route further to H8, but you could if you wanted).
2. Route F9-G10-H10 (you ignore the building in G9, because it's part of the same building you're already in)
3. Low crawl to F9.

Note that you can choose to low crawl, even though you wouldn't be interdicted in F9 if you did not low crawl. Note also that the rules we followed for routing apply to low crawl (we moved away from the adjacent unit, and towards the woods/building).



I strongly recommend reading this tutorial on the route phase by Jay Richardson: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/122340/explanation-rout-pha...

The route phase is one of the hardest parts of the game to wrap your head around. I think what helps is realizing that the broken unit doesn't route where you want him to go, but rather acts in his own self interest. So, a broken unit routes away from the action, will not move closer to an enemy unit it is aware of, and will drop heavy equipment that would otherwise slow it down. You don't have a say in any of these matters.

Hope this helps!
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Shawn Viney
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My mistake; JP is correct. A unit can low crawl even if interdiction is not possible. This is much clearer in the full ASL rules. SK rules seem to indicate that a unit must move to the nearest legal route destination if possible.

See Explanation of the Rout Phase for a very detailed explanation of routing in ASLSK.

Regards,

Shawn


Edit: Kris beat me to it. I just posted the exact same link.
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Yes, I have Jay's Tutorial all printed out. I read the Route chapter once already. I'm now back at the beginning of the Tutorial, just started rereading the "Infantry Attacks" section last night. Route chapter and ROF will be next up on the reread list along with the now 8th reread of the rulebook.

Good thing I really want to learn this gamecool
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Fly by Night wrote:
The broken squad moving from F8 to G9 is legal, but its now a question if its considered a Low Crawl or a Route?
Regardless of the fact that it routed one hex, it is a normal Rout, as G9 is a building and is a legal rout destination.
BTW Low Crawl is a form of rout, anyway.

Fly by Night wrote:
And, now, I have no idea about the unit in E9. Can he low crawl to F9 (out of a building and into a clear space that is out of enemy LOS)
Enemy LOS is not revelant. He can Low Crawl into F9.

Fly by Night wrote:
or, since it is the Route Phase and units are required to Route to the closest building or forest hex, they have to Route to G9 and then to H10 once discovering they entered the LOS of the broken German Leader?
Low Crawl can be chosen.
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Fly by Night wrote:
Yes, I have Jay's Tutorial all printed out. I read the Route chapter once already. I'm now back at the beginning of the Tutorial, just started rereading the "Infantry Attacks" section last night. Route chapter and ROF will be next up on the reread list along with the now 8th reread of the rulebook.

Good thing I really want to learn this gamecool


Isn't it bizarre how much literature there is that exists for this game? I love how much there is to learn.

In one of the examples Jay provides, a broken unit is forced to route towards a building behind which there is an enemy unit. So, it looks like the broken unit is routing towards the enemy, but the idea is that the enemy unit is not a known enemy unit. Once the broken squad reaches the building it was routing to, it finds itself adjacent to the enemy unit, and now must flee the building. Now that it has already moved, it can no longer use low crawl.

I think if you can understand the intuition behind that example, you will understand most of the routing issues that come up in the starter kits.
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Ruben Rigillo
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Remember that a unit in a building that MUST rout can ignore its building as its destination. So, unless you must keep that building at all costs, it could be better to let all of them rout away, along with the (unbroken/unpinned) leader.....
(hope I have not repeated something already said, I read the fellows' answer a bit in a hurry)
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