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Fury of Dracula (third/fourth edition)» Forums » Rules

Subject: Hide after a revealed location rss

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Francesco Meucci
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If Dracula play the Hide power card after a location that has been revealed, it has to be placed face up or face down?
 
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H-B-G
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Kikki wrote:
If Dracula play the Hide power card after a location that has been revealed, it has to be placed face up or face down?


Face up. Note that this does not seem entirely clear, but there are a number of places that suggest it to be so. Most clearly, I think, in the learn to play book's description of the Hide card.

Quote:
If a location associated with “Hide” is revealed, the “Hide” power card is also revealed.


Once a location is reveals it remains that way, so if you play Hide when the location is already revealed Hide must be revealed and so is played face up.
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Francesco Meucci
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Perfect, is the same way I've played it last night.
Thanks again!
 
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Maciej Górski
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What if the Hide was played after the location was revealed by event card like Newspapers Reports or Hired Scouts?

To me it seems that Hide would be played face-down (and with encounter) in such situation.
 
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Randal Divinski
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mg6maciej wrote:
What if the Hide was played after the location was revealed by event card like Newspapers Reports or Hired Scouts?

To me it seems that Hide would be played face-down (and with encounter) in such situation.

No. From the RR on Hide: "When a hunter ends a move in the associated location, or otherwise reveals that card, Hide is also revealed."

So the means by which the associated location is revealed is irrelevant.
 
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Maciej Górski
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randiv wrote:
mg6maciej wrote:
What if the Hide was played after the location was revealed by event card like Newspapers Reports or Hired Scouts?

To me it seems that Hide would be played face-down (and with encounter) in such situation.

No. From the RR on Hide: "When a hunter ends a move in the associated location, or otherwise reveals that card, Hide is also revealed."

So the means by which the associated location is revealed is irrelevant.


I'm asking about a case where Hide is not yet played at the point in time current location is revealed.

Thematically the difference is that when Dracula decides to Hide in a city where a hunter stays, the Hunter knows about it, but when Dracula decides to Hide on the night after hunter read about him in newspapers or from hired scouts (and they are already drinking in a pub for Godalming's money and will not tell hunters about Dracula staying in the same city). These events' effects are immediate and do not continue when for example Dracula uses Misdirect on that and reuses it, so I'm not sure why it would make sense to reveal Hide in such case when there is no effect in play.

To make it clear:
trail: [face-down Athens]
someone gets Hired Scouts and call Athens
trail: [face-up Athens]
Dracula moves
trail: [face-down Hide with encounter] [face-up Athens]

If someone steps in Athens after that, they would of course know Dracula stayed there a bit longer then they learned from scouts or newspapers.
 
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Randal Divinski
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In addition to my reasoning, I am also agreeing with the first answer in the thread:
DaveD wrote:
Once a location is reveals it remains that way, so if you play Hide when the location is already revealed Hide must be revealed and so is played face up.

If you want to house rule that the means by which the location was revealed matters, that is up to you. But there is no precedent in the actual rules for keeping track which effect revealed something and using that information to effect the game state later. There is nothing to indicate that this is a game mechanic.
 
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Mark L
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randiv wrote:
In addition to my reasoning, I am also agreeing with the first answer in the thread:
DaveD wrote:
Once a location is reveals it remains that way, so if you play Hide when the location is already revealed Hide must be revealed and so is played face up.

If you want to house rule that the means by which the location was revealed matters, that is up to you. But there is no precedent in the actual rules for keeping track which effect revealed something and using that information to effect the game state later. There is nothing to indicate that this is a game mechanic.

Randal, I think the point Maciej is making is not about the mechanism, but about the timing.

If the location is revealed, Hide is also revealed. But what if the location has already been revealed and then Hide is placed? It doesn't seem unreasonable that, having been discovered, Dracula might then be able to hide in the same city by pretending he moved to a different one.

(This would not be possible if a hunter was in the city, which is why I think Newspaper Reports and Hired Scouts were mentioned - not because the mechanism matters, but because the fact that no hunters are present to force Dracula to play the card face up might.)

Having said that, though, I do actually think the Hide card must still be played face up in this case. I just don't think that's very clear in the rules.
 
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Maciej Górski
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Thanks for the input.

I just looked again at the most obvious place (the Hide card itself) and it says "If the location card to the right of this space is revealed, reveal this card too". In that sentence "If" suggests that the effect is permanent. If it said "When" or "Whenever" instead, I'd be more eager to argue that the effect is triggered every time the location is revealed.

I still like the idea of Dracula hiding without Hide being revealed in these cases tho. Another example would be that Dracula is revealed by hunter entering his location, then that hunter is pushed to a different location during night ambushed by Bats or from Vampiric Influence event (or even moving by themselves with Long Night), so Dracula could thematically stay hidden at the same location as there is nothing that can tell hunters if he stayed or moved.
 
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