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Vast: The Crystal Caverns» Forums » General

Subject: Canada shenanigans rss

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Chris Pollitt
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Hi Patrick, i note in your latest kickstarter update that there is a delay in Canadian backers getting their copies and yet certain stores in Canada has 25 copies available to freely sell. I must say that i feel disappointed that those who helped with kickstarter are not getting the game earlier than those who did not back you. I'm going to assume that these stores are also kickstarter backers but it still is really frustrating.
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Dom Hiob
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Yeah, I can understand that frustration, sitting in the EU. Update 14 said the games would get to the fulfillment center on March 15th. A timeline for fulfillment was to be there in the week of March 6th. We never heard anything about that again.

Now, in the KS comments section, it says the games were scheduled to arrive at the fulfillment center on the 21st (I have no idea where that date comes from, or where the 15th came from, but somehow someone needs to get their dates in order). And the addresses were sent to the fulfillment center only today (!)

I'm still looking forward to a March delivery. Even if I get it later than retail (official street date seems to be March 21st). Patrick never said there were any advantages in kickstarting the game rather than getting the retail version. And I guess there aren't.
 
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Patrick Leder
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Let me starts by saying I fully intended for you to get your game before it came out in stores.

Street Date - The street date was set months ago and was set to push back on a constant barrage of questions I was getting from the retailers and their customers. I could have tried to move it again, but in the US if even one had ignored it (which did happen anyway) then I was going to have some angry people also.

EU/Worldwide - Sorry about that. I misread the shippers directions. It was supposed to hit the port on the 15th and get to the fulfillment center on the 21st. I didn't know what the names of the city meant. I was socked last week while on the road with a sizable bill for the VAT which I wasn't informed about until it was due. That could have delayed things but I went pretty far out of my way to make sure it was paid for what that is worth. I would be surprised if EU stores have received it yet anyway. I just got notice they will begin shipping to backers later in the week.

Canada - Its not really my business to air what happened here but Canada just plain got the wrong number. The amount that arrived was claimed by the distributors involved. I checked our numbers again and a mistake was made with how many were sent to Canada. We asked the distributors to give up a portion of theirs to fix the problem and we would get them back late, but both reported having less left in inventory than we needed after their pre-orders. These orders were not KS orders, but came to us before the KS had started.

I am really sorry this happened and it was never my intent for the backers to receive it later then stores. Most of the circumstances were beyond my control and you are seeing some of the growing pains I am facing.
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Dom Hiob
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GreenM wrote:
Let me starts by saying I fully intended for you to get your game before it came out in stores.

Street Date - The street date was set months ago and was set to push back on a constant barrage of questions I was getting from the retailers and their customers. I could have tried to move it again, but in the US if even one had ignored it (which did happen anyway) then I was going to have some angry people also.

EU/Worldwide - Sorry about that. I misread the shippers directions. It was supposed to hit the port on the 15th and get to the fulfillment center on the 21st. I didn't know what the names of the city meant. I was socked last week while on the road with a sizable bill for the VAT which I wasn't informed about until it was due. That could have delayed things but I went pretty far out of my way to make sure it was paid for what that is worth. I would be surprised if EU stores have received it yet anyway. I just got notice they will begin shipping to backers later in the week.

Canada - Its not really my business to air what happened here but Canada just plain got the wrong number. The amount that arrived was claimed by the distributors involved. I checked our numbers again and a mistake was made with how many were sent to Canada. We asked the distributors to give up a portion of theirs to fix the problem and we would get them back late, but both reported having less left in inventory than we needed after their pre-orders. These orders were not KS orders, but came to us before the KS had started.

I am really sorry this happened and it was never my intent for the backers to receive it later then stores. Most of the circumstances were beyond my control and you are seeing some of the growing pains I am facing.



First of all: thank you a lot for addressing things clearly and quickly. I really appreciate that. Personally (and not wanting to jijack the thread), I didn't ask before, because I kind of felt shouted down during the KS (though I posted then, as I do now, with the best of intentions).

So all that just to say: I'm fine with the EU status that you're describing. I just felt confused by the different dates that were put out before. Sometimes, giving clarifications in a KS update helps (yeah, I know it takes time to write those, but communication is the key to backers). Also, as a hint: You've posted several times in the KS comments about missing pieces and such and that people should contact this-and-this-email. You may as well put that in the next update. That way everyone (well, a few more people at least) will see it, not only those reading the KS comments.
 
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Chris Pollitt
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I don't want to hurt you Patrick but we are your fans and I agree that we were never promised anything. We did feel great sympathy for your funding problem and wanted to support you. We did this by backing you through kickstarter.

Most of us paid for priority shipping alongside paying full retail price for the game through kickstarter. I am assuming that there is some margin between production costs and what was paid by us. We are currently looking at getting the game at least 2 weeks later than if we hadn't supported you.

If it was me, I'd do more than say sorry. I'd be not using the distributor that has taken all of YOUR personal customers copies for their own and paid for priority individual shipping from the US through that distributor. If that's not possible, I'd personally sign the bonus cards that are planned to ship to us in August as a demonstration of recognising the problem.

I apologise to everyone, as this is not the normal tone here at BGG, but as I said, I'm seriously disappointed. I want to credit Patrick with being so involved with the community here at BGG.
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Miguel Pacheco
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GreenM wrote:
Its not really my business to air what happened here but Canada just plain got the wrong number. The amount that arrived was claimed by the distributors involved. I checked our numbers again and a mistake was made with how many were sent to Canada. We asked the distributors to give up a portion of theirs to fix the problem and we would get them back late, but both reported having less left in inventory than we needed after their pre-orders. These orders were not KS orders, but came to us before the KS had started.


Why were distributors getting copies before KS backers were? I thought you were sending copies to Caryl directly to distribute out to Canadian backers?
 
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Caryl Tan
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ilpalazo wrote:
GreenM wrote:
Its not really my business to air what happened here but Canada just plain got the wrong number. The amount that arrived was claimed by the distributors involved. I checked our numbers again and a mistake was made with how many were sent to Canada. We asked the distributors to give up a portion of theirs to fix the problem and we would get them back late, but both reported having less left in inventory than we needed after their pre-orders. These orders were not KS orders, but came to us before the KS had started.


Why were distributors getting copies before KS backers were? I thought you were sending copies to Caryl directly to distribute out to Canadian backers?


Caryl here, chiming in. Copies were indeed meant to be sent directly to me but due to erroneous numbers and communication issues, distributors were still able to get their copies first, despite us trying to avoid that issue. Some mistakes were made and there's no excuse for that and we apologize for that.

We're doing our best to pull numbers from other facilities to fulfill the Canadian pledges as soon as we can and we totally understand that this will delay everyone a bit compared to retail. In recognition of the delay and the frustration this is causing some backers, we're adding something a bit extra just for the canadians as well as apology notes in each box.
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Patrick Leder
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Dom, I mentioned the email address in the last 2 updates and several before then.
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Dom Hiob
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GreenM wrote:
Dom, I mentioned the email address in the last 2 updates and several before then.


True. I somehow more or less skipped Update 14's beginning and went straight for the "EU" heading. I guess that teaches me to read the full update instead of blurting out un-needed advice
 
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Patrick Leder
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No you just perfectly highlighted the key issue.
 
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Miguel Pacheco
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What in the world did you guys set the MSRP at? I just realized I paid $96 CAN for the kickstarter and 401 Games has it for $52CAN. I'm all for supporting creators directly....but almost double the price seems a bit crazy no?

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Caryl Tan
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ilpalazo wrote:
What in the world did you guys set the MSRP at? I just realized I paid $96 CAN for the kickstarter and 401 Games has it for $52CAN. I'm all for supporting creators directly....but almost double the price seems a bit crazy no?



Hey Miguel, MSRP is $60USD. Unfortunately we're not able to regulate pricing stores or distributors choose to sell our games for.

Your concerns are totally legitimate and your honesty is appreciated since it's what we need in order to run our kickstarters better and to keep supporters like you happy. We definitely hear your criticism and we're already taking it with us in any future project regarding how we handle pricing to avoid such a large discrepancy again.
 
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Björn Fink
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QuicheGames wrote:
ilpalazo wrote:
What in the world did you guys set the MSRP at? I just realized I paid $96 CAN for the kickstarter and 401 Games has it for $52CAN. I'm all for supporting creators directly....but almost double the price seems a bit crazy no?



Hey Miguel, MSRP is $60USD. Unfortunately we're not able to regulate pricing stores or distributors choose to sell our games for.

Your concerns are totally legitimate and your honesty is appreciated since it's what we need in order to run our kickstarters better and to keep supporters like you happy. We definitely hear your criticism and we're already taking it with us in any future project regarding how we handle pricing to avoid such a large discrepancy again.


Uhm well there is still a lot of difference between 60 and 96!...:-O
 
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Aaron Converse
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Less between $60 USD and $96 Canadian...right now, $60 USD is about $80 Canadian. Still some difference, but it's about 20% cheaper, not 40% cheaper.
 
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Alice Penn Howard
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xbjoernx wrote:
QuicheGames wrote:
ilpalazo wrote:
What in the world did you guys set the MSRP at? I just realized I paid $96 CAN for the kickstarter and 401 Games has it for $52CAN. I'm all for supporting creators directly....but almost double the price seems a bit crazy no?



Hey Miguel, MSRP is $60USD. Unfortunately we're not able to regulate pricing stores or distributors choose to sell our games for.

Your concerns are totally legitimate and your honesty is appreciated since it's what we need in order to run our kickstarters better and to keep supporters like you happy. We definitely hear your criticism and we're already taking it with us in any future project regarding how we handle pricing to avoid such a large discrepancy again.


Uhm well there is still a lot of difference between 60 and 96!...:-O


Is that 96 CAD for just the bas3 game or did you get addons
 
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Miguel Pacheco
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The base game! 60 USD plus 10 USD in shipping is 70USD which adds up to 96CAN. If suggested MSRP is 60 USD then 401 games is severely, dramatically underselling it then. They are a brick and mortar FLGS but do have an online business.

It just feels kind of bad to know that Kickstarting the game was by far the worst possible way to go about getting vast as a Canadian. I could have bought a whole other game with the savings from getting vast at a FLGS
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Mike
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Has there been any new word on when the Canadian orders might start shipping out?

I understand that these things happen and it'll get sorted out eventually, but seeing it on local shelves while we are waiting, and all of these pricing discussions... is making me feel sad.
 
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Miguel Pacheco
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Deleted my comment: Caryl has explained that Canadian postcards are coming later so they wouldn't affect shipping dates. Irrelevant anyways, the games are here now and that's all that really matters.
 
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Mike
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Sorry, your post doesn't make sense.
Maybe it would make more sense if I had seen your deleted post?
 
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David Chong
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At this point, I wouldn't dwell on it despite the injustice of it all. It will only lead to frustration and anger. What's done is done. Just put it out of your mind until a month from now. We'll rock this sucka down if we don't have an update by then. Peace bro!

 
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David Chong
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Received my copy yesterday (Toronto), minus personalized apology or anything obvious that's supposed to be special for Canadian backers. Meh. I'm just glad I finally received my copy and will put the inflated price I paid out of mind.
 
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Caryl Tan
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ilpalazo wrote:
Deleted my comment: Caryl has explained that Canadian postcards are coming later so they wouldn't affect shipping dates. Irrelevant anyways, the games are here now and that's all that really matters.


Repeated for visibility Canadians should start receiving their letter mails next week and base games have already started arriving in Ontario/Quebec so far.
 
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Lloyd Crosby
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QuicheGames wrote:
ilpalazo wrote:
Deleted my comment: Caryl has explained that Canadian postcards are coming later so they wouldn't affect shipping dates. Irrelevant anyways, the games are here now and that's all that really matters.


Repeated for visibility Canadians should start receiving their letter mails next week and base games have already started arriving in Ontario/Quebec so far.


Received my copy in Calgary on April 6th. Base game only. I'm looking forward to our first game this weekend.
 
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Mike
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Well I'm glad some people in Canada are getting them (no sarcasm intended). Still waiting here in Vancouver three weeks later. =(
 
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Chris Pollitt
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We received our copy on Vancouver Island last week and our letter via Quiche games yesterday - thank you for the letter, we love it! The only explanation for faster than average arrival must surely be the high quantity of (delivery) bears living on the island!
 
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