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Advanced Squad Leader: Starter Kit #2» Forums » General

Subject: 60mm Mortars and To Hit Dice Roll Modifiers rss

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Kilgore Trout
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Good afternoon. I'm trying to grok the new concepts of SW sized mortars. I get that they only use Area Target Types. What is not clear to me is which dice roll modifiers are applicable when rolling "To Hit" and which are then applicable as DRM on the IFT table. Using the "To Hit Dice Roll Modifiers" chart supplied with ASLSK#2, which cases are to be considered in each die roll?

As an example: When determining "To Hit" with a US 60mm mortar, HE rounds against infantry, do I only consider cases 1-6 AND 11-16? When determining DRM on the 4FP column of the IFT, do I use 1-6 & 11-16 again? I thought I had read somewhere that TEM wasn't considered for TOHIT but was for DRM on the IFT,, but now I'm not so sure.

Any help clarifying by case in each phase (TO HIT, IFT) would be greatly appreciated.
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Ruben Rigillo
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Hi!
To fire a mortar you must first secure a hit.
Mortars always use Area Target Type. (for the 60 the basic To Hit is always 7, from 3 to 24 hexes range)
You modify the To Hit DR applying Cases 1-7 and 12-18 (where applicable).
Case 11 (TEM) is applied on the IFT DR after the hit is secured.
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Kilgore Trout
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Thank you, Ruben. As I understand it the, once a HIT has been established using a <=60mm (SW) mortar, the only DRM to be applied to the IFT is TEM (Case 11).
 
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kilgore234 wrote:
Thank you, Ruben. As I understand it the, once a HIT has been established using a <=60mm (SW) mortar, the only DRM to be applied to the IFT is TEM (Case 11).


This is true, and it's true for any unit using the Area Target Type.

Might help to think of it this way:

Infantry Target Type: You are taking aim at the particular squad/gun in the hex. If a squad is in a building, the protection of the building will make it more difficult to score a hit. Thus, apply the TEM to the TH roll.

Area Target Type: You are firing in a less concentrated way, at the entire hex. So your firepower is lower (it's spread out across 40 meters), and the TEM doesn't affect the probability of scoring a hit. Instead, once you score a hit, you apply the TEM to the IFT roll. The squad being in a building doesn't affect your aim into the hex, but will affect the result against the squad itself.
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Kilgore Trout
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Sorry to belabor this issue, but I'm still not sure I have this concept down. Perhaps an example will be illustrative:

[/q]

It is during the German Movement Phase.
A squad enters hex Z9 with the 4th of his allotted 4MF.
He enters the LOS of the mortar in AA7. Grain is not a hindrance.

The American, as Defensive First Fire, uses the mortar. Range is 3. Basic TH is 7.
TH DRM are: -1 (Case #13) and -1 (Case #14). American rolls a "2-3" and scores a HIT while retaining ROF.

Now, since the German is in the open, there is no TEM.

Question 1: On the IFT, do I then roll at 4FP/+0 (i.e. do not apply FFMO and FFNAM)?

Question 2: Since the German only expended 1MF entering Z9, does that mean that the American cannot fire the mortar again at this target, but COULD fire the mortar at another target within its LOS? What choices remain available to the American, either as Defensive First Fire or Subsequent First Fire, if any?
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Ruben Rigillo
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kilgore234 wrote:
Sorry to belabor this issue, but I'm still not sure I have this concept down. Perhaps an example will be illustrative:


It is during the German Movement Phase.
A squad enters hex Z9 with the 4th of his allotted 4MF.
He enters the LOS of the mortar in AA7. Grain is not a hindrance.

The American, as Defensive First Fire, uses the mortar. Range is 3. Basic TH is 7.
TH DRM are: -1 (Case #13) and -1 (Case #14). American rolls a "2-3" and scores a HIT while retaining ROF.

Now, since the German is in the open, there is no TEM.

Question 1: On the IFT, do I then roll at 4FP/+0 (i.e. do not apply FFMO and FFNAM)?


Exactly. You apply those modifiers ONLY to the to Hit DR
Quote:

Question 2: Since the German only expended 1MF entering Z9, does that mean that the American cannot fire the mortar again at this target, but COULD fire the mortar at another target within its LOS? What choices remain available to the American, either as Defensive First Fire or Subsequent First Fire, if any?


Since you retained ROF you'll not mark the mortar anyway. So you will be able to fire it again normally at other targets.
Remember that Mortar marked First Fire can fire again using Intensive Fire (+2 DRM and B# penalties). An Ordnance doesn't fire as Area Fire in SFF. (I.e. You have a to hit DRM but no FP halved once secured the "Intensive Fire" Hit)
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Perry Cocke
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Qwirz wrote:

Remember that Mortar marked First Fire can fire again using Intensive Fire (+2 DRM and B# penalties). An Ordnance doesn't fire as Area Fire in SFF. (I.e. You have a to hit DRM but no FP halved once secured the "Intensive Fire" Hit)


Not quite.

As you said, with ROF maintained, the MTR can fire at sone other moving unit, or it can wait till DFPh to shoot again at the squad.

But it can't Intensive Fire (nor can the BAZ). No SW can.

Only 5/8" Guns (including vehicle MA) can Intensive Fire.
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Ruben Rigillo
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perrycocke wrote:
Qwirz wrote:

Remember that Mortar marked First Fire can fire again using Intensive Fire (+2 DRM and B# penalties). An Ordnance doesn't fire as Area Fire in SFF. (I.e. You have a to hit DRM but no FP halved once secured the "Intensive Fire" Hit)


Not quite.

As you said, with ROF maintained, the MTR can fire at sone other moving unit, or it can wait till DFPh to shoot again at the squad.

But it can't Intensive Fire (nor can the BAZ). No SW can.

Only 5/8" Guns (including vehicle MA) can Intensive Fire.


Mortars can't Intensive fire?!?!? Dang!
May I ask to point me to the rule I missed?
 
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Perry Cocke
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The Index entry for Intensive Fire says a Gun or vehicle may do it.

The 1.2.6 definition of a Gun is on a 5/8" counter.

This is in contrast to a Light Mortar, which is a SW (4.5), not a Gun.

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Ruben Rigillo
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Thanks Mr. Cocke.
A bit much mistakes recently. It's time to reread the rules carefully.....
shake
 
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Peter Di Cioccio
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I was under the impression that the DRM doesn't apply to Area target fire to hit chart.
 
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Steve Woodyatt
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Following up on the ROF being retained. Can the mortar continue to fire at that same moving target in the same hex until ROF is lost? Or is the mortar limited to just the one shot and then have an opportunity to fire again at the next hex the squad moves into assuming LOS is maintained? Thanks.
 
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Mark Buetow
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RenzoP wrote:
Following up on the ROF being retained. Can the mortar continue to fire at that same moving target in the same hex until ROF is lost? Or is the mortar limited to just the one shot and then have an opportunity to fire again at the next hex the squad moves into assuming LOS is maintained? Thanks.


You can fire once per MF expended. So in the same hex, yes, but only if it expended more than 1 MF.
 
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Perry Cocke
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Malacandra wrote:
RenzoP wrote:
Following up on the ROF being retained. Can the mortar continue to fire at that same moving target in the same hex until ROF is lost? Or is the mortar limited to just the one shot and then have an opportunity to fire again at the next hex the squad moves into assuming LOS is maintained? Thanks.


You can fire once per MF expended. So in the same hex, yes, but only if it expended more than 1 MF.


During the MPh, Fire is thusly limited.

During DFPh(or PFPh), there is no such limitation.
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