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Subject: Moon symbol character ** spoilers ** rss

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Chris Andrews
United Kingdom
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Please don't read further if you are avoiding spoilers!

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I don't have a copy of the game yet (I am down for a 2nd printing) but wanted to ask about the moon symbol character. He is by far my favourite looking of all the classes, probably because I always play a rogue in most games! laugh

I just wanted to ask those veteran players who might have unlocked him, how he plays? I am assuming he is very similar to the scoundrel (using shadows and high burst single target damage?) but as each character class seems to have its own flavour I am wondering what extra tricks he has?

Also is the quest to unlock him a difficult one? What are the requisites? Don't worry, I will be playing solo so I don't mind spoilers.
 
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Christoph M.
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Re: Shadow symbol character ** spoilers **
I think you are talking baout the moon icon class, aka the Nightshroud.

Scoundrel does absurd numbers of damage; Nightshroud cannot compete by far. But the Nightshroud has many possibilities to become invisible (and gets many bonusses when invisible) and can curse enemies. Due to being invisible that oftne, defense is not much of a topic for him. Some similarities to Scoundrel, but a different beast.

regarding unlocking: There are two different quests to unlock him. One is killing 2 of every demon type. May be hard, may be easy, depending on the class and scenarios you are playing.
I dunno the other one yet.

EDIT: I forgot his greatest strength: already a t level , he has the ability to one-hit normal enemies (with darkness). (see openMfly below)
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Chris Andrews
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Re: Shadow symbol character ** spoilers **
Thanks Christoph. Yes, I meant the moon character. Will edit my previous post.
 
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open Mfly
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Moon Class is a one hit killer every round, if you get moon elementel every round.
It was part of my strongest char-combo.
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Alex Russo
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Craigie
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this class adds so many curses on the enemy deck that is almost impossible to get killed... so far this and cragheart are the classes that can "break" the game if played with this intention.
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Jay I

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I'm playing him now. He is similar to the Scoundrel in that he is a powerful single-target killer, but his style of play is a bit more intricate. He relies heavily on two things: consistent availability of the dark element and invisibility. His cards allow for playstyles that either focus on one or the other or combine elements of both. Moon element-based approach is really strong in that it allows for a lot of instant kills and high burst damage attacks. However, it also has fewer defensive options. Invisibility, on the other hand, is defensively powerful but doesn't have as many instant kill effects going for it. I haven't focused as much on his cursing abilities but I imagine that he could be quite effective for that (although perhaps not as effective as a couple of other classes in this regard). Overall, I've found him to be really fun to play. He's pretty self-sufficient and doesn't rely on any particular party make-up to be effective. Chaining together 4-5 rounds of instant-kills and invisibility is really satisfying.
 
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Chris Andrews
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HuxleyJP wrote:
Overall, I've found him to be really fun to play. He's pretty self-sufficient and doesn't rely on any particular party make-up to be effective. Chaining together 4-5 rounds of instant-kills and invisibility is really satisfying.


Sounds like my kinda style!
 
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Eric Bridge
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He is more lethal alone. Scoundrel does better with an ally.
 
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This class has saved our asses a handful of times with the Insta kill and invisible combo. The best part is that you don't need to rely on drawing a personal quest card to get this class.
We unlocked it by being evil.
 
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Brent Cooley
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I know you can also unlock him with a personal quest that involves completing two scenarios in the Lingering Swamp and then completing a quest (or quest chain?) that unlocks from there. I'm lvl 3/4 and have only found one Lingering Swamp scenario so far so I don't have any more details beyond that.
 
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Jens Leber
Germany
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bcool680 wrote:
I know you can also unlock him with a personal quest that involves completing two scenarios in the Lingering Swamp and then completing a quest (or quest chain?) that unlocks from there. I'm lvl 3/4 and have only found one Lingering Swamp scenario so far so I don't have any more details beyond that.


I unlocked the nightshroud through this personal quest. Maybe it was just because this was the first quest where one of us didn't just had to complete some Missions or kill a certain type of monsters and so we felt more engaged to the story and the goal, but this quest had two of the best and thematic scenarios of the game we've played so far.
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Nicholas
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I don't think he relies on invisibilty. I threw out almost all of the invis cards and he felt a lot more powerful afterwards. Sure, you can become invisible for a LOT of turns consecutively.
But this only means, that your other party members have to be more on guard....
If I remember correctly, I retired him on lvl 8 and he was a beast.

The basic options are dark element or invisibility.
 
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Emile Mulder
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I think it's fairer to say that there are three themes and any two can work in a build.

1 - insta kills - two cards contribute to this, both require dark element to work. There are about 4 cards making up the core of this theme (dark creation and kills)
2 - invisibility - lots of ways to get invisibility, can combo to get spike damage of 10, but the combo is intricate and requires 2-3 turns. There are 6 or so cards making up the core of this theme (dark creation-same as 1, damage increase and stealth/damage)
3 - curses several easy ways to grant curse and muddle. Muddle combos very well with curse, so this is one of the few instances where it may be worth taking those rolling muddle modifier cards. There are 4 ways to give curse as well as rolling curse modifiers.

You only get 9 cards so it's really only feasible to have two focuses. The most popular build seems to be 1+2, but I'm thinking of trying 1+3.

Whatever your build, you spend a lot of time trying to make and use darkness with amazing results if you can do it right and middling results if you can't.

The class also has a big weakness at first in terms of mobility. While this gets better later, it can really be crippling if you don't try to account for it somehow (enhancements, boots, etc.)
 
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Wes Holland

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More precisely, I find that you can either go heavy on Invisibility or Dark Element usage. It's hard to do both, though you can be heavy Dark with a bit of Invisibility.

Nightshroud holds the record for single-turn damage output, and we aren't counting Insta-Kill as damage. We have all classes unlocked. (Nightshroud did 32 damage in one round. Turns out that X card that doubles all your damage for the round is *really good*.)
 
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Stefan
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The Nightshroud is one of the classes with which in play you can bump up the difficulty level without needing to worry.

I think it is pretty much a better version of the Scoundrel. You have 3 cards in your deck that let you do insta kills on single targets. None of those are lost effects and all of them are easy to setup. With one of them you can even kill an Elite Monster by just using two elements, then use something to create the two elements, pick up the card again with a stamina potion and repeat...

Now Insta kills are pretty awesome and they are also independent of monster levels, but what about Boss fights? The Scoundrel has a pretty decent single target damage output, but I would argue that the NS, if played correctly, can even rival that with the help of the dark element and the Card, that CrushU mentioned above (even without that card he could still play non-lost attack 8 as top effect when he is invis and uses darkness and he could combine that with a bottom attack).

So basically the class has 3 "weaknesses", one is that the card maximum is 9, the second one is that it heavily relies on dark elements and sometimes on being invisible and the third one is that it mostly can target single enemies only. Now the first two weaknesses can be eliminated easily by equipping your Nightshroud with some cool items. This even results into something ridiculous: You can play him in a way that he is permanently invisible. This is how I completed the Solo Scenario with ease. We just recently played scenario 48 where our group due to some unlucky card draws got annihilated after a few rounds by all of the enemies on the board. So all of them were exhausted except for the Nightshroud, who was invisible. He then continued to play alone for about 10 rounds and finally managed to kill the Boss on his own, without ever recieving any attacks during that time, because he was constantly invisible. There was another scenario, No 60, where the group had to open a couple of rooms, loot chests, and then flee within a limited time. Due to slow moving guys, the group decided to just stay ontop of the exit tiles and deal with the arriving enemies, while the NS rushed forward, opened all doors and looted the chests while being invis which resulted in another scenario being very easy.

What CrushU mentioned above is true, invis AND element creation simultaneously is not that trivial. But chose the right cards when leveling up and especially support yourself with some benefitial items, and this is doable too. Especially the Solo Scenario item will help you alot.

So to summ up, the Nightshroud is, similar to the Music Note, Triangle and Double Mini, one of the classes that are pretty much overpowered. I enjoy playing it alot at the moment, but I will soon retire and in order to keep up the difficulty, I think I will not chose that class again in the near future
 
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Scot Rose
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I didn't see it mentioned, but I unlocked this class by getting a party reputation of -10. This is mentioned in the Special Conditions for Opening Envelopes section of the rule book on page 49.
 
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Ivan Petrov
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Didn't want to create a new topic just for one question, so i'll rather ask it here.
Does this class become significantly worse as the number of players grow? His "kill one normal enemy" would be pretty strong at 2 characters and keep some of its utility at 3, however, we play with 4ppl most of the time and there's not so many regular monsters left to spawn.
So, to me at least, it seems that while this class is not affected by the scenario level, he gets progressively worse with the number of players rising.
 
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fre kol
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Sobakaa wrote:
Didn't want to create a new topic just for one question, so i'll rather ask it here.
Does this class become significantly worse as the number of players grow? His "kill one normal enemy" would be pretty strong at 2 characters and keep some of its utility at 3, however, we play with 4ppl most of the time and there's not so many regular monsters left to spawn.
So, to me at least, it seems that while this class is not affected by the scenario level, he gets progressively worse with the number of players rising.


This is true to an extent. However, I noticed that the invisibility build can be more dangerous for 2 players, as that turns all monsters on the one remaining character. I imagine (haven’t tried) that that would be less of a problem with larger parties.
 
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Stefan
Germany
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You still have alot of normal monsters for 3 and 4 player games depending on the scenario. We always played this guy in 4 player games and independent of the number of players, that class is without a doubt one of the strongest or better to say most overpowered ones in the game. Even without his kill abilities, he still has very good attacks.

Besides
Spoiler (click to reveal)
On level 6 or something you get another kill ability that also works on elite monsters.
 
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Mike Weisz
Sweden
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danom wrote:
The Nightshroud is one of the classes with which in play you can bump up the difficulty level without needing to worry.

I think it is pretty much a better version of the Scoundrel. You have 3 cards in your deck that let you do insta kills on single targets. None of those are lost effects and all of them are easy to setup. With one of them you can even kill an Elite Monster by just using two elements, then use something to create the two elements, pick up the card again with a stamina potion and repeat...

Now Insta kills are pretty awesome and they are also independent of monster levels, but what about Boss fights? The Scoundrel has a pretty decent single target damage output, but I would argue that the NS, if played correctly, can even rival that with the help of the dark element and the Card, that CrushU mentioned above (even without that card he could still play non-lost attack 8 as top effect when he is invis and uses darkness and he could combine that with a bottom attack).

So basically the class has 3 "weaknesses", one is that the card maximum is 9, the second one is that it heavily relies on dark elements and sometimes on being invisible and the third one is that it mostly can target single enemies only. Now the first two weaknesses can be eliminated easily by equipping your Nightshroud with some cool items. This even results into something ridiculous: You can play him in a way that he is permanently invisible. This is how I completed the Solo Scenario with ease. We just recently played scenario 48 where our group due to some unlucky card draws got annihilated after a few rounds by all of the enemies on the board. So all of them were exhausted except for the Nightshroud, who was invisible. He then continued to play alone for about 10 rounds and finally managed to kill the Boss on his own, without ever recieving any attacks during that time, because he was constantly invisible. There was another scenario, No 60, where the group had to open a couple of rooms, loot chests, and then flee within a limited time. Due to slow moving guys, the group decided to just stay ontop of the exit tiles and deal with the arriving enemies, while the NS rushed forward, opened all doors and looted the chests while being invis which resulted in another scenario being very easy.

What CrushU mentioned above is true, invis AND element creation simultaneously is not that trivial. But chose the right cards when leveling up and especially support yourself with some benefitial items, and this is doable too. Especially the Solo Scenario item will help you alot.

So to summ up, the Nightshroud is, similar to the Music Note, Triangle and Double Mini, one of the classes that are pretty much overpowered. I enjoy playing it alot at the moment, but I will soon retire and in order to keep up the difficulty, I think I will not chose that class again in the near future


Just wondering can the insta-kills work on bosses or is there something in the rules that prevent this?
 
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John R
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There are 4 types of enemies in the game: Normal, Elite, Named, Bosses. The insta-kill card will tell you which types they work on. To my knowledge they only ever say normal or elite, so, no, you could not use the insta-kill on bosses or named enemies.
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Atlee Dinsmore
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MikeyMike666 wrote:
Just wondering can the insta-kills work on bosses or is there something in the rules that prevent this?


No.
Per the FAQ:
Are bosses elites?
No, bosses are their own class of monster and are thus unaffected by abilities that target normal or elite monsters. Also note that named monsters specified in the scenario book are their own class of monster as well.
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