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Escape from the Aliens in Outer Space» Forums » Rules

Subject: Confused about Winning conditions rss

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Kenny Johnson
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Torrance
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The Ultimate Edition Rules state:
ATTACKING:
When Human players are killed, during their next turn they
start again from the Alien Sector as Aliens, without inheriting
any special abilities or items from their previous life.


THE END OF THE GAME:
The game ends after 40 turns or as soon as the last Human player either
escapes or is killed. It is possible that both the Aliens and some of the
Humans can jointly win the game when the last living Human on board
is killed. Any Human player that is killed by the Aliens loses the game.


These seem contradictory. If I'm a human and I'm killed by an alien, I become an alien. The aliens win when the last living human on board is killed... So I'm an alien and I win because the aliens killed the last human on board, but I'm also a human that was killed, so I lose?



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Paul Liolio
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Hm. good point.

Your human character you played as, loses for sure. But the way the rules are written, there are no losers in this game. Even if you're the last human player to be killed, the following thematic events would be, you become alien and join the winning team.

I guess think of it as teams of characters?
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Joshua Kimble
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This game definitely has some issues when it comes to winning and losing. The best way to play this game is to think of it as a game you are just experiencing, and not REALLY trying to win.

For us, humans escaping are the real winners. As are the aliens who shut out all the humans. All other wins are "lesser" wins. Humans who have turned into alien, but still ate another human have done a good job, but aren't "real" winners. So, yeah, the shades of gray of winning conditions is a bit weird and shouldn't be that important to the players. You will have more fun if you just don't care.
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JJ Breese
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I was also confused when I read the rules. There doesn't seem to be a losing condition for the Aliens. My idea is to add a points system. X points for the alien team depending on how many humans they let escape. Bonus for each human kill. Penalty for killing other aliens. Big points for humans who escape.

However, this could cause other problems. The game might become too long if multiple rounds are needed to build up scores. Could also lead to weird kingmaking plays (alien attacks leader even if leader is also alien).

Anyway this was just a brainstorm post, hopefully someone can make something more solid.
 
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Chris Merritt
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In my opinion, this game is designed to have multiple winners and losers.

Any human who escapes is a winner. As long as at least one human is killed, those who began the game as aliens win. Any human who is killed loses, despite becoming an alien afterward. Any alien who is killed loses. If all humans escape with none being killed, the aliens lose.

If there absolutely must be a "best winner" for your games, then aliens get two points for every human they kill and minus one point for every alien they kill. Humans get points based upon the number of human players in reverse order. Say in an eight player game with four humans, the first player to escape gets 4 points, the next gets 3, the third gets 2, and if the last player escapes they get 1 point for it. Also, humans get a point for killing an alien.
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Kirk K

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This is why I have such a problem with "Team Changing" games- the human that did the worst job at his original role (got killed early) can win over the person who did the best job at the role (held out to the end). In games like this I've seen players die on purpose so they could join the other side because they thought they had a better chance of winning there.

To be honest I'd much rather see straight player elimination. It's a shame, because this is such a great game otherwise. But every time I play, regardless of what side I'm on, I always secret root for all the humans to escape of for the 40 turns to pass with no fatalities, just so it feels like we have a legit winner.
 
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Ben Turner
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Seems a good fix would be eliminated humans who come back as aliens can ONLY win if they score a kill themselves.

This means not only do they have an uphill challenge to revert the fact they are losing now, but they also might go "lone wolf" to get the win, meaning the aliens don't get quite as much assistance as simply having a full-fledged new team member.
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Rob McArthur
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About to play this for the first time tomorrow and I thought I'd revive a dead thread...

My re-wording of the victory conditions in the rule book:

- Any human that escapes is an individual winner.
- Any alien that kills a human is an individual winner. (My addition)

- Complete alien victory: all starting humans turned to aliens.
- Partial alien victory: at least one human escapes, the rest become aliens.
- Partial human victory: A least one human still alive on board after 40 turns.
- Complete human victory: all starting humans escape

When a human becomes an alien, they win or lose as an alien.

I think this is just tightening up what the rules say. Does anyone see any holes with this?
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Jozan
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IMO this is a team play game for the aliens, solo for the humans. We have the first edition and we always play this way:

A human that scapes, wins.

A human that dies, loses.

If all human dies, aliens win.

You might imagine that alien players would lose motivation when the first human scapes, well.. The satisfaction for an alien is chasing down the defenceless humans anyway, and I also think the game it's pretty hard for humans by default. So if a single human manages to escape.. that should be the winner and a hero

( PS: humans turn into aliens now? It's not a very long game anyway)
 
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Brian D

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I personally find it pretty clear on how it's read.

Any human that escapes win, all starting aliens win should the last human die.

Thus you get the possible shared victory between some humans and Aliens, while all dead humans don't win.

We personally don't play it this way, human victory for escaping like normal, but any human who became an alien does join the alien team and thus wins with the rest of them (obviously the last human to die just loses cause never becomes an alien since game is over).
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Kirk K

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niarBaD wrote:
I personally find it pretty clear on how it's read.

Any human that escapes win, all starting aliens win should the last human die.

Thus you get the possible shared victory between some humans and Aliens, while all dead humans don't win.

We personally don't play it this way, human victory for escaping like normal, but any human who became an alien does join the alien team and thus wins with the rest of them (obviously the last human to die just loses cause never becomes an alien since game is over).
Going back to my original point though, that's my problem with the win condition: The person who was the best a playing the humans loses, while everyone who was worse at it gets the win. That's so obviously unsatisfactory that I assumed I was missing something...
 
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Chris Merritt
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Dice is Right wrote:
niarBaD wrote:
I personally find it pretty clear on how it's read.

Any human that escapes win, all starting aliens win should the last human die.

Thus you get the possible shared victory between some humans and Aliens, while all dead humans don't win.

We personally don't play it this way, human victory for escaping like normal, but any human who became an alien does join the alien team and thus wins with the rest of them (obviously the last human to die just loses cause never becomes an alien since game is over).
Going back to my original point though, that's my problem with the win condition: The person who was the best a playing the humans loses, while everyone who was worse at it gets the win. That's so obviously unsatisfactory that I assumed I was missing something...
No, the person who was best at playing humans should have been the first one to reach an escape pod and get off the station, netting them a win.
 
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Rob McArthur
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Dice is Right wrote:
niarBaD wrote:
I personally find it pretty clear on how it's read.

Any human that escapes win, all starting aliens win should the last human die.

Thus you get the possible shared victory between some humans and Aliens, while all dead humans don't win.

We personally don't play it this way, human victory for escaping like normal, but any human who became an alien does join the alien team and thus wins with the rest of them (obviously the last human to die just loses cause never becomes an alien since game is over).
Going back to my original point though, that's my problem with the win condition: The person who was the best a playing the humans loses, while everyone who was worse at it gets the win. That's so obviously unsatisfactory that I assumed I was missing something...
That’s why in my winning conditions we consider it a partial win for the humans if at least one survives the 40 turns without escaping.
 
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Paul Liolio
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You could also think of it as a game where only the humans have a chance to win. Aliens aren't included in those who can win or lose. They just want to make sure no human is alive. The only true victor is a surviving human and aliens hate that. If you start the game as alien, you already lost and now you want everyone else to lose too.
 
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Kirk K

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COMaestro wrote:
Dice is Right wrote:
niarBaD wrote:
I personally find it pretty clear on how it's read.

Any human that escapes win, all starting aliens win should the last human die.

Thus you get the possible shared victory between some humans and Aliens, while all dead humans don't win.

We personally don't play it this way, human victory for escaping like normal, but any human who became an alien does join the alien team and thus wins with the rest of them (obviously the last human to die just loses cause never becomes an alien since game is over).
Going back to my original point though, that's my problem with the win condition: The person who was the best a playing the humans loses, while everyone who was worse at it gets the win. That's so obviously unsatisfactory that I assumed I was missing something...
No, the person who was best at playing humans should have been the first one to reach an escape pod and get off the station, netting them a win.
If no humans make an escape pod, then by default the best human player is the one who stayed human the longest. Also, making it to an escape pod is a win for that human, not all of them.
 
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Kirk K

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Polioliolio wrote:
You could also think of it as a game where only the humans have a chance to win. Aliens aren't included in those who can win or lose. They just want to make sure no human is alive. The only true victor is a surviving human and aliens hate that. If you start the game as alien, you already lost and now you want everyone else to lose too.
Why would I possibly want to play a game where I've already lost before it starts...?
 
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Paul Liolio
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Dice is Right wrote:
Polioliolio wrote:
You could also think of it as a game where only the humans have a chance to win. Aliens aren't included in those who can win or lose. They just want to make sure no human is alive. The only true victor is a surviving human and aliens hate that. If you start the game as alien, you already lost and now you want everyone else to lose too.
Why would I possibly want to play a game where I've already lost before it starts...?
Well the game is still fun, isn't it?
Surely there are plenty of other examples in games where you know you can't partake in the victory, so your goal is to make sure no one else can either. I think it's somewhat exciting.
 
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