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Subject: Miniatures rss

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William Hadjison
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This is like Secrets of the Lost Tomb but I assume as it will be on KS it will not have cardboard standees but rather miniatures? Correct? If so great.

I would like to know more about the mechanics. I don't own Lost Tomb but I'm willing to try this game first.

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Day Life
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With luck they will continue the awesome idea of selling the horrible grey plastic expensive junk as a separate choice.. the glut of miniatures is imo the worst thing to have happened to the hobby in decades.

Lucky for us some forward thinking devs like the guys of Lost Station realise this and offer a better looking, more functional, cheaper and all around cooler version of cardboard standees.

Well that is what they did with the original.. so I expect it to be the same.. cardboard by default and then options to add grey plastic for those that want ot.
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A Swagman
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I believe they have said that it will have cardboard standees with the option for an upgrade to miniatures.
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Christopher Batarlis
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foreshadow wrote:
This is like Secrets of the Lost Tomb but I assume as it will be on KS it will not have cardboard standees but rather miniatures? Correct? If so great.

I would like to know more about the mechanics. I don't own Lost Tomb but I'm willing to try this game first.



Henry,

Currently yes! It's Sci-Fi Secrets of the Lost Tomb with an entirely new storyline. The mechanics are being worked on as are the rules to make everything a bit less "fiddly" without losing the amazing storytelling and exploration!

The miniatures are going to be a very important part of this campaign! We've hired an outstanding artist to do them justice!

We're thinking of having the minis in the game for these now, not separate The Standees will not be a regular part of the game.. However, regular minions and base/elite creatures will have Cards in a Stand. Reason this is so we can have a ton of unique monsters without having 150 minis in the game tripling the cost

The minis will be of the main Adventurers and the Boss Creatures only still being a lot of great minis.

Thanks!

Chris
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Christopher Batarlis
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DayinDaLife wrote:
With luck they will continue the awesome idea of selling the horrible grey plastic expensive junk as a separate choice.. the glut of miniatures is imo the worst thing to have happened to the hobby in decades.

Lucky for us some forward thinking devs like the guys of Lost Station realise this and offer a better looking, more functional, cheaper and all around cooler version of cardboard standees.

Well that is what they did with the original.. so I expect it to be the same.. cardboard by default and then options to add grey plastic for those that want ot.


LOL!

The Kickstarter will be the place to get the minis As I said, we're considering a "Mini-version" and a Standee Version of the game

Either way, we're making the minis because the artwork deserves to be sculpted
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Tom Zebro
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I've been waiting for this on Kickstarter. I was interested in Tomb but saw how much product was out and thought it would be better for my wallet to catch this when it launches. And the standees are just fine with me.
 
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I (obviously) much prefer standees.

Miniatures, imo just look ugly and bloat the price of the game to unacceptable levels.

I mean, sure if you are a painter, then they can look awesome... but 90% of gamers never paint them and you end up with a sea of grey plastic that is hard to tell the models apart.

I actually think in the long run games look WORSE with a lot of them, and that a nice cardboard standee, not only looks better on the table as it can feature nice full colour art, it also makes the entire game so much cheaper.

cbatarlis wrote:
The Standees will not be a regular part of the game.. However, regular minions and base/elite creatures will have Cards in a Stand. Reason this is so we can have a ton of unique monsters without having 150 minis in the game tripling the cost


This is exactly the problem with miniatures.. they bloat the game cost so much and are ultimately unneeded. Why have 1/2 and 1/2? When you can have none? It just seams silly and unndeed imo.

I think that the growing divisions between card board standees and miniatures fans are both on the "all or nothing" side.. as in they want a miniature for everything or they want no miniatures at all.

I think you should just have 3 pledge levels... 1 all cardboard, 1 this crazy 1/2 and 1/2 idea and 1 with a model for a minitire for everything.
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Jason Brown
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cbatarlis wrote:
DayinDaLife wrote:
With luck they will continue the awesome idea of selling the horrible grey plastic expensive junk as a separate choice.. the glut of miniatures is imo the worst thing to have happened to the hobby in decades.

Lucky for us some forward thinking devs like the guys of Lost Station realise this and offer a better looking, more functional, cheaper and all around cooler version of cardboard standees.

Well that is what they did with the original.. so I expect it to be the same.. cardboard by default and then options to add grey plastic for those that want ot.


LOL!

The Kickstarter will be the place to get the minis As I said, we're considering a "Mini-version" and a Standee Version of the game

Either way, we're making the minis because the artwork deserves to be sculpted

In every campaign that I've seen offer two versions, the standees version accounts for less than 5% of total backers and the creators lose money on the additional SKU. It's awesome if you can pull it off as I agree that good standees can be a better option some times, but it's a proven fact that KS LOVES minis.
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MAJBrown22 wrote:
it's a proven fact that KS LOVES minis.


I get that everything boils down to the horrid reality of finances.. but there is a big difference between quality and what the masses "want".. That is why Justine Beaver has outsold the Beatles.

Integrity is its own reward, or at least I would like to think.

I'm not suggesting they they do not offer miniatures to the ravenous plastic collectors to add an extra 200 bucks to every game they buy... offer it for sure.. but offer it as a ADD-ON (and they get both), or as a different pledge (they get one or the other). Then everyone is happy and it adds little is anything to the developers.

A great example was the "878 Vikings - Invasions of England" kicker... All kickers should look like this.. and I would be hugely surprised if the minis outsold the regular versions.

It should be noted the mini version is 150bucks unpainted and the regular version of the SAME GAME is 65....
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Christopher Batarlis
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Again here...

Guys!

Sorry for my absence! I've seen none of these messages as my subscriptions never alerted me on any of these!

I'm here now! Checking multiple times a day! I'll be doing a ton of updates!

Sorry all!

Chris
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Christopher Batarlis
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DayinDaLife wrote:
MAJBrown22 wrote:
it's a proven fact that KS LOVES minis.


I get that everything boils down to the horrid reality of finances.. but there is a big difference between quality and what the masses "want".. That is why Justine Beaver has outsold the Beatles.

Integrity is its own reward, or at least I would like to think.

I'm not suggesting they they do not offer miniatures to the ravenous plastic collectors to add an extra 200 bucks to every game they buy... offer it for sure.. but offer it as a ADD-ON (and they get both), or as a different pledge (they get one or the other). Then everyone is happy and it adds little is anything to the developers.

A great example was the "878 Vikings - Invasions of England" kicker... All kickers should look like this.. and I would be hugely surprised if the minis outsold the regular versions.

It should be noted the mini version is 150bucks unpainted and the regular version of the SAME GAME is 65....


Regarding Minis,

Yes, Kickstarter demands amazing minis, and so we will have to provide them indeed! They are coming out amazingly! We're doing our best and planning hard to make them EPIC as well as keep the price as reasonable as possbile.

No current plans for a standee only version.

Thanks so much again for your Hype and Support and sorry for the lack of info..... the Subscriptions really messed me up by missing alerts!

Chris
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cbatarlis wrote:
No current plans for a standee only version.


bummer... I'm out then.. good luck guys.
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Christopher Batarlis
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DayinDaLife wrote:
cbatarlis wrote:
No current plans for a standee only version.


bummer... I'm out then.. good luck guys.


Thanks for your support and for being hyped!

Stay tuned to it! It will certainly be interesting to watch and follow along with!

Thanks,

Chris
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William Hadjison
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I agree with Day Life, a gamer like him should have a choice if he wants standees. I think the issue will be must he buy them even if you offered Standees with the game, or as an Add On.

I think it would be a case of 'let's see the mini's'. I want to see them too. Have you 3D printed any of them out. Seeing them will be critical information.

I will say when I looked over the minis for Lost Temple it was hard to see them up close and I have that kickstarter as a guide. This game without miniatures I could see being an option, but have the minis as an option.

I suppose it depends on if you will put the minis in all core boxes. If they are nice minis I don't see why not to.

I just got Fate of the Elder Gods and Beasts from Beyond. Those minis are quality (enough I think) so if these are similar great. I also saw some of the minis for Big Trouble in Little China and I pre-ordered the Limited Edition game. I also backed the Metal Storm and would like a set of minis for that game and yes I would want the to be nice quality. I see nice minis for other games (like Street Masters that just was on KS) or a few other games. I can point out some not so great ones.

If these minis are only ok, and it is a costly venture to back the game I think I would not back either, but I am thinking if they are good that I would back a larger sized pledge. I don't own Lost Temple, and I don't know if I want it, but I am willing to try this game out. If I really like it I might look to the lost temple.

One thing I am not a fan of is the smaller tile sizes with puzzle locking sections. I see other games with tiles like Aliens vs Predators, Space Hulk, Siege of the Sentinel, Endure the Stars so I am comparing this game to those, or like Deep Madness. I own or will own most of those.

I look foward to seeing what you guys have for this. My decision won't effect how I feel about the other two games I just got from Everything Epic. I also will be looking at the Rambo game and yes Rambo needs good solid miniatures. When I spit out my Rambo lines I want a good plastic enemy miniature to face and it would be great to have a compound to infiltrate, and/or other locations. Unless i'm mis-reading how Rambo will be. If it is more like Metal Storm that might work where you have abstract locations. Either way include a Rambo miniature. Make him very nice and of 28mm scale. Gamers like to use those things for other purposes. I know I would love a good Terminator miniature so I can take my Rambo and my Terminator miniature and use them in a miniature battle game for a convention of my own design. Home-made stuff like that is the essence of fun gaming.
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Christopher Batarlis
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foreshadow wrote:
I agree with Day Life, a gamer like him should have a choice if he wants standees. I think the issue will be must he buy them even if you offered Standees with the game, or as an Add On.

I think it would be a case of 'let's see the mini's'. I want to see them too. Have you 3D printed any of them out. Seeing them will be critical information.

I will say when I looked over the minis for Lost Temple it was hard to see them up close and I have that kickstarter as a guide. This game without miniatures I could see being an option, but have the minis as an option.

I suppose it depends on if you will put the minis in all core boxes. If they are nice minis I don't see why not to.

I just got Fate of the Elder Gods and Beasts from Beyond. Those minis are quality (enough I think) so if these are similar great. I also saw some of the minis for Big Trouble in Little China and I pre-ordered the Limited Edition game. I also backed the Metal Storm and would like a set of minis for that game and yes I would want the to be nice quality. I see nice minis for other games (like Street Masters that just was on KS) or a few other games. I can point out some not so great ones.

If these minis are only ok, and it is a costly venture to back the game I think I would not back either, but I am thinking if they are good that I would back a larger sized pledge. I don't own Lost Temple, and I don't know if I want it, but I am willing to try this game out. If I really like it I might look to the lost temple.

One thing I am not a fan of is the smaller tile sizes with puzzle locking sections. I see other games with tiles like Aliens vs Predators, Space Hulk, Siege of the Sentinel, Endure the Stars so I am comparing this game to those, or like Deep Madness. I own or will own most of those.

I look foward to seeing what you guys have for this. My decision won't effect how I feel about the other two games I just got from Everything Epic. I also will be looking at the Rambo game and yes Rambo needs good solid miniatures. When I spit out my Rambo lines I want a good plastic enemy miniature to face and it would be great to have a compound to infiltrate, and/or other locations. Unless i'm mis-reading how Rambo will be. If it is more like Metal Storm that might work where you have abstract locations. Either way include a Rambo miniature. Make him very nice and of 28mm scale. Gamers like to use those things for other purposes. I know I would love a good Terminator miniature so I can take my Rambo and my Terminator miniature and use them in a miniature battle game for a convention of my own design. Home-made stuff like that is the essence of fun gaming.


Great feedback and ideas!

Thanks for sharing! We will definitely take it into account!

Chris
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I wonder how many more sales you would have gotten if you had a NO MINIATURE pledge level. At this rate it is looking doubtful you will make the goals.

1) A low key game not known to maney
2) A 250usd entry point (lets face it most kicker prefer to buy the entire thing or nothing)

This is just bad.

If you followed the advice in this thread for a standee option you would have a full package for like 100usd less, maybe even more... and then many more backers would take the plunge of unproven developers. Yes I know you have Tomb under your belt, but lets face it... most people that know that exists are either in on this already or decided not to.. it was NEW players you needed to get.. and a 250ysd price point was just way to much (not including shipping)

Miniatures are the WORST thing to happen to boardgaming in the last 30 years. The bloat the price, increase the shipping costs, take more room on the shelf and look UGLY AS SIN, unless you paint them.

If you could get the full set for x dollars cheaper with standees you would have attracted a lot more people to make the leap of faith that it would be worth it ... JUST like how it happened with tomb.

Sorry if this sounds aggressive, but it angers me so that a game I was so hyped for is destroyed AGAIN (this is not a uncommon thing) by devs insistence that we want miniatures.
 
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I too am disappointed there is not a standee option. I KSed and still often play SotLT with just the standees. I have the miniature characters, but haven't even taken them out of the box.

If there had been a standee's option, I would have been in on this KS too. But as it is with just miniatures as an option I will not be pledging.

I agree with the last poster that having both a standee and miniature option would have added way more backers (including me).
 
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