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Subject: Flame demon rss

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Dave Walsh
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My group played the other day (still pretty new) and we encountered flame demons. They have a printed stat for both range and melee. Are we supposed to assume their attacks are melee unless specifically stated otherwise? We were doing that with archers until we realized they only have a range stat.

On that note, they had created traps the turn before. We flipped the card and they were attacking (again, unclear if it was range or melee). We had been assuming melee until one demon had focus and range to move in...but only if it stepped in its own trap. Since we didn't know if they all should have been shooting fire at us or charging...we decided to split the difference and have that demon stay out of the trap while the others charged and attacked. Should they all have been range? In a situation where the enemy spawns a trap, will it step on it if its the only way to attack that turn? Or would it close in and wait until it could strike without blowing itself up?

Thanks in advance for any help!
 
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Frank Pelkofer
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davethebabe wrote:
My group played the other day (still pretty new) and we encountered flame demons. They have a printed stat for both range and melee. Are we supposed to assume their attacks are melee unless specifically stated otherwise? We were doing that with archers until we realized they only have a range stat.

On that note, they had created traps the turn before. We flipped the card and they were attacking (again, unclear if it was range or melee). We had been assuming melee until one demon had focus and range to move in...but only if it stepped in its own trap. Since we didn't know if they all should have been shooting fire at us or charging...we decided to split the difference and have that demon stay out of the trap while the others charged and attacked. Should they all have been range? In a situation where the enemy spawns a trap, will it step on it if its the only way to attack that turn? Or would it close in and wait until it could strike without blowing itself up?

Thanks in advance for any help!


If a monster has a number for range on it's stat card (the big square one that does in the sleeve), then all of it's attacks are ranged by default. If a monster has a - for range on it's stat card, then all of it's attacks are melee by default. This can change based on the ability card that the monster turns up. If the melee monster ability card gives it a range, then in that case the monster has a ranged attack for that round only.

A monster will only step on a trap if it's the only path it can use to get to a character. If there's an open path, no matter how long, it will take the open path instead. Also remember that the monster is looking for the closest open space that it can attack from, not the path to the character itself.

Finally, remember to check for monsters that fly. They don't get hurt by traps, so they ignore them completely.
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Dave Walsh
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So the Flame demon that shows a stat for both range and melee on the unit card would always indicate range unless one of their order cards says otherwise? I was thrown off by this as the archer unit is clearly range only and likewise a melee only unit sometimes has range orders which allow it to strike at range.

The flame demon had only enough movement to move into the trap and attack with melee (lets say it was a melee only unit if the flame demon was in fact ranged). From what you are saying, it sounds like it would wait until it could move into range on a later turn as opposed to move into the trap...as their was an open path but it was blocked by it's ally (can't end its movement in same space). the only way a monster would ever step on a trap is if there was a wall of traps that cut off any other way (unless it has flying in which its not worried about it unless it ends it's movement on the trap).

Thanks for the quick response btw
 
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David desJardins
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davethebabe wrote:
My group played the other day (still pretty new) and we encountered flame demons. They have a printed stat for both range and melee.


I have no idea what "printed stat for both range and melee" means. There are four stats on the monster card: hit points, movement, attack value, and range. There's no separate figure for melee attack value or ranged attack value; there's a single figure for the attack value, which can be either melee or ranged.
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Frank Pelkofer
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davethebabe wrote:
So the Flame demon that shows a stat for both range and melee on the unit card would always indicate range unless one of their order cards says otherwise? I was thrown off by this as the archer unit is clearly range only and likewise a melee only unit sometimes has range orders which allow it to strike at range.

The flame demon had only enough movement to move into the trap and attack with melee (lets say it was a melee only unit if the flame demon was in fact ranged). From what you are saying, it sounds like it would wait until it could move into range on a later turn as opposed to move into the trap...as their was an open path but it was blocked by it's ally (can't end its movement in same space). the only way a monster would ever step on a trap is if there was a wall of traps that cut off any other way (unless it has flying in which its not worried about it unless it ends it's movement on the trap).

Thanks for the quick response btw


Both the archer and flame demon stat cards have numbers for attack and range (there isn't a "melee" number). In both cases, the number by attack is the damage it's going to do and the number by range is how far away it can hit something. I'm not sure why you're saying they are different.

As for traps, that's basically correct. A monster will follow the open path as far as it can, even if it won't get to the character on the current turn. If you want to get into more detail, you can do a google search for "gloomhaven monster movement" and get a master's degree in the AI.
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Dave Walsh
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ohhhhhhh...For some reason I mentally applied melee to the attack value and didn't realize it when i was comparing it to the archers. Wow. Thanks guys, that makes perfect sense!
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Ben Greig
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also flame demons are flying so they will never hit their own traps (unless you disable their flying somehow)
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Cassio Santos Pereira
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aquillo wrote:
also flame demons are flying so they will never hit their own traps (unless you disable their flying somehow)


Just to make sure, read this! I missed it in a couple monster for a couple rounds in a couple scenarios, lol. The Wings symbol is right beside the monster name in the stat card.
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