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Subject: House Rules! rss

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Luke Smolinski
United States
Illinois
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My brother and I are a huge fan of house rules and want to share some ideas with the community! One of the biggest complaints we have seen is that the monuments being fully built ends the game, so it's a shame you barely ever get to see their full glory. Below is our idea for how to get that full monument glory and still have a compelling lategame.

once a monument is fully built, that victory condition is "locked in" (the winner is the person with the most cities) so you have one least round where everyone fights for control of the most cities and whoever comes out on top wins. This prevents someone who was going for a different style of victory from stealing it because once someone commits to a monument victory it would be cheap to let others win by another means. It just allows others to attempt to fight them for their victory condition.

This is similar to how RTS games handle Wonder victories. Building the wonder starts a doomsday clock where the game will end if nobody else can destroy the wonder. We think this new rule will make the end game hectic and action filled, which is always great for a satisfying end to a game!
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Gergo Tothmihaly
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1 The campaign did not even end yet, so it's probably a bit early to come up with house rules. This could even put people off. Why bother backing a game that already 'needs' house rules?

2 Adding mechanism changing rules for cosmetic reasons sounds a bit... unjustified?

3 Assuming the various paths to victory are balanced, any of this kind of changes would break that balance.

4 Lets say I went for the monster victory. Just before I could pull it off, you lock in the cities victory. Because I went for something else, I have no or very few cities and have absolutely no chance to win. Even though I was this close :shows-two-fingers-touching:
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Jason Miller
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Maybe play the game a few times before trying to change the rules?

I have to conclude you're not a game designer or developer based on you your willingness to preemptively alter a rulebook.
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Igor Persin
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Well, he can play how he wants with his copy and house rule it as much as he wants. Although doing it publicly, because he&his brother have already found the 'fix' for a game that is not out, nor is final rulebook out, nor does even AW know how some rules will loom up because they are developing stuff that community wants kinda makes no sense to me.
On the other hand, I would never asume for myself to know how to fix things I have never played, nor have they been published yet. But each to his own.
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BG.EXE
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The only house rule I'm even considering is that you have to achieve 2 victory conditions. For the same reason, using fully built monuments.

That said, I'm not trying it until I've played the game a dozen or so times. It's possible it would totally ruin the balance.
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Mouldy Banana
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boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
The only house rule I'm even considering is that you have to achieve 2 victory conditions. For the same reason, using fully built monuments.
And the first victory condition has to be a monument right?
 
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BG.EXE
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Not necessarily. I think that would probably break the game and also make it SUPER long. The point of alternate game endings was that not everybody will be ABLE to focus on the same things. Having "must build monument first" would break the game in that sense.

The "2 Victory Conditions to Win" rule wouldn't fix the problem in 100% of cases but it seems like it would increase the odds of seeing some full monuments in play. Monuments give stat bonuses after all.

Like I said though, I'm going to play the game Rules as Written several times before even considering that rule.
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Josh Worley
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boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Not necessarily. I think that would probably break the game and also make it SUPER long. The point of alternate game endings was that not everybody will be ABLE to focus on the same things. Having "must build monument first" would break the game in that sense.

The "2 Victory Conditions to Win" rule wouldn't fix the problem in 100% of cases but it seems like it would increase the odds of seeing some full monuments in play. Monuments give stat bonuses after all.

Like I said though, I'm going to play the game Rules as Written several times before even considering that rule.


Someone on here mentioned a variant they were trying where on the first piece of the monument you build, you actually place two pieces. So by the 4th "placement" you've actually completed the monument. You'd still have to "place" the 5th and final piece to achieve the victory condition, but at least you'd have the full monument on the board for a little while.

They also wrote that the designer was considering a variant where all players start with their monuments fully erected, and instead of building them throughout the game, the players are trying to destroy them. Which is an interesting variant since it wouldn't really require much of a change in the rules (only a few tweaks here and there, probably).
 
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Ken
United States
West Palm Beach
Florida
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I liked the idea of having them build and deconstructing them. Just building them in reverse keeping all of the same rules.

In that way you get the monuments to the gods as part of the experience. And the first monument torn down ends the game.
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Erwin Weiss
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Well if this ending/victory condition in the end product somehow doesn't 'feel' right, I really like your idea and would try it out. So thank you for your sharing your spark of creativity.

Although adapting ones' play within one gameround might not always be feasible for players going for a different strategy (going for monster kills for instance).

And... if there is a monument with 4 sections built on the board, I would expect the hectic fights over city control to happen BEFORE the final section is built. Because the player who wants to trigger that victory condition, must be in control of the most cities in the previous gameround already, and hold his/her lead for the complete round, else you would just trigger the victory for someone else. Right?
 
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Erwin Weiss
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Ken at Sunrise wrote:
I liked the idea of having them build and deconstructing them. Just building them in reverse keeping all of the same rules.

In that way you get the monuments to the gods as part of the experience. And the first monument torn down ends the game.


And inverse the benefits they bring as well I assume. (So you don't start with the best level of benefits, because that would make play order in the first round way to important I would think).
 
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Igor Iriarte
Spain
Pamplona
Navarra
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I watch some gameplays on youtube, and honestly believe that the problem with this game is victory conditions. I propose new ones.

New victory conditions:

After finishing the first statue, the last turn is activated. Until everyone has to spend shift because of getting out of actions (Luke Smolinski idea).
At that moment the points of victory of each player are counted:

City = 2pt
Complete land = 3 pt
Quest completed = 3 pt
Monster killed = 3pt
Monster EV killed = 4pt

The player with most points wins.

-----

These house rules try to solve two problems:

1 The end game is too sudden
2 Players only try to conquer territories fast, never kill monsters or make quests.

I think the system of building statues like an hourglass that ensures a limited game time works well, the blessing system too.

Pleased to hear criticism and opinions. Really sorry for my English.

By the way, I am new to the forum, and I have taken the Titan pledge of this game. Greetings to all.
 
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Gergo Tothmihaly
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Welcome!

It would be great to hear your analysis: why do you think there is a problem/multiple problems with the game?

I think at this point we simply don't have enough information to draw this kind of conclusions.
 
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Becq
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Cerritos
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Conceptually, I actually like the asymmetric, "specialized" victory conditions the game has. But I haven't played the game, so perhaps my opinion will change (perhaps because one path becomes "the best").

Even so, having an alternate set of victory conditions (such as Igor's point-based idea) that players can choose to use seems very reasonable. If I was AR, I would probably consider including a point-based victory condition as an optional rule.

Setting that aside, some comments:
* It is not at all clear to me that conquering cities is the preferred path to victory in the existing rules. If someone manages to kill a few monsters quickly enough, they can win the game even if they only own a single territory.
* Your current point system ignores non-city territories.
* What is a monster "EV"?
 
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