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Subject: Picking produced units question rss

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Alberto Natta
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Greetings,

In a game ongoing it came out different knowledge of production.

I know one first declares what they produce and then pick the units (ie: I call 2 INF, 2 PIL, 1 FTR2, 1 LND3) and then pick them out at random.

My opponents (3 player game!) went always by that you produce a unit and you fish it, then move on with the production.
That allows you to see if you got let's say the MIL or the Air unit that you wanted (a good one like!) and decide then if to go on (produce more of the same til you get the desired result) or move on another unit type.

Thanks in advance.
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Wendell
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No, you don't get to see what MIL (for example) you picked and then decide whether to build a second MIL.

Your first group is right. You should have worked out what you are producing ("Germany will build 3 INF, 2 MIL, an ARM, a CAV DIV, 2 pilots, and 2 FTR2") before drawing any unit from force pools.
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Bruce Jurin
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wifwendell wrote:
No, you don't get to see what MIL (for example) you picked and then decide whether to build a second MIL.

Your first group is right. You should have worked out what you are producing ("Germany will build 3 INF, 2 MIL, an ARM, a CAV DIV, 2 pilots, and 2 FTR2") before drawing any unit from force pools.


Note however that the answer is different if playing with Factories in Flames, 13.6.10, where it says:

After spending the required build points you may look at the unit being built before deciding in which location to build it. Note that this means in Factories in Flames you build units one after the other in the Production step giving you more flexibility in what and where you build units.

So the rules say 'If using FiF then you build one at a time'. This does not necessarily mean from pure logic that (converse) if playing without FiF the opposite occurs, but it is strongly implied.

So this is an explicit advantage of the FiF rules. But note that FiF is REALLY different - you basically spend one per unit per turn, it isn't laying down 5 on a unit which changes things dramatically.

 
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Alberto Natta
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I've read of FiF in the RAW8 and I'd really like to try it out - but indeed it changes a lot the dynamics.

From Damaged ships going in a port (and not in the repair pool magically) to the ability to hasten the production for extra cost, and so forth ... it's one of these rules that change the game drastically I believe (Especially as one produces just in Factories and have to determine what to produce where from the beginning) - and the Strategic Bombing too is altered. (For the better imo).
 
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Bruce Jurin
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Cohen wrote:
I've read of FiF in the RAW8 and I'd really like to try it out - but indeed it changes a lot the dynamics.

From Damaged ships going in a port (and not in the repair pool magically) to the ability to hasten the production for extra cost, and so forth ... it's one of these rules that change the game drastically I believe (Especially as one produces just in Factories and have to determine what to produce where from the beginning) - and the Strategic Bombing too is altered. (For the better imo).


Yes, FiF is a major change to the game. The biggest impact IMO is that it is very hard on the USSR. Now production occurs at a factory and you cannot simply place reinforcements at the closest city. Some of your units will be in factories that are farther away.

I think a lot of people feel that the rules in FiF are really cool - the ability to build faster at higher cost, shipyards, strat bombing is much more logical (specifically the Allies bombing factories not needed for production! in regular production rules); but despite that, there is so much overhead and space needed that I think most WIFFERS say 'this is neat but its too much'.

Shipyards are so popular that there have been a lot of attempts to try to make rules to use shipyards without Fif.
 
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Alberto Natta
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We indeed use Shipyards without FiF. Use at least 1 BP for that type of ship and get another BP off the Shipyard. They're long term investment. We also use the Specs admittedly.

Just at the present with Japan not starting with any of them as they're '39 both - it's a huge plus for the Allies.

And yes when discussed FiF usually that is the main argument - it's a lot of extra work on what is already a lengthy game.
 
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Wendell
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Cohen wrote:


And yes when discussed FiF usually that is the main argument - it's a lot of extra work on what is already a lengthy game.


Which is why I haven't used it and probably won't.
 
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Joseph Moore
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I totally agree with Wendell. I bought FiF when it first came out and sadly it languishes unused in my WiF storage box. I just didn't think the game was worth the candle as they say in the UK.

Sadly, I had a similar experience after purchasing the "Der Weltkrieg" Final Campaign module. Don't get me wrong here, I think that the Der Weltkrieg system may well be the most realistic and playable simulation that I have encountered in almost 50 years of wargaming. Having said that, the Weltkrieg module to me smacked of a rushed product created to meet a release timetable. (Does Decision Games come to mind here?)

As with FiF, the complexity of the Weltkrieg system did not enhance
the gaming experience even though in WiF I always use all of the other modules (PiF, Sif, CiF, CliF, CPiF, AfA, AsA, MiF etc.)

As a naval buff, I am, however, intrigued by the notions above about using FiF naval production by itself. Might just try it.
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