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Subject: Rulebook Request rss

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Big Tom Casual
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Cody!

What are the chances chances of us getting a new updated rulebook that has everything from the expansion and various errata all in one place as if all available material was released as a single product?

Right now the experience involves jumping between multiple rulebooks that have things crossed out and amended with notes and so forth. It's off putting and confusing AF for newcomers.

Thanks man! My favorite game!
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Joe !
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It is a bit of a slog, especially if you're starting from scratch and trying to solo. I'm guessing some intrepid BGGers will release tutorial videos.

Also, I found a somewhat confusing mistake in the original manual: In the components section and the ship overview section there is a picture of a white ship with engines on top. I really thought it was missing from my copy at first and can't find any mention of it on the web.
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Jason Miceli
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CasualToast wrote:
Cody!

What are the chances chances of us getting a new updated rulebook that has everything from the expansion and various errata all in one place as if all available material was released as a single product?

Right now the experience involves jumping between multiple rulebooks that have things crossed out and amended with notes and so forth. It's off putting and confusing AF for newcomers.

Thanks man! My favorite game!


While I too would love it, I doubt you'll see it. I presume this would be a fairly hefty task to fulfill. Regardless, I'll pin this post in hopes to see I'm proven wrong!
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Big Tom Casual
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I would be willing to kickstart it even. :-)
 
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Brian Torrens
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Perhaps when Cody makes the next Xia expansion, he could create an add on for a "master rulebook" that provides the full rules in one place with a detailed index.

Yes, I would back another Xia expansion in a heartbeat so Cody, if you are reading this. Don't rest too long! Looking forward to seeing what else you may have in store for Xia!
 
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Jason Miceli
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Brian T wrote:
Perhaps when Cody makes the next Xia expansion, he could create an add on for a "master rulebook" that provides the full rules in one place with a detailed index.

Yes, I would back another Xia expansion in a heartbeat so Cody, if you are reading this. Don't rest too long! Looking forward to seeing what else you may have in store for Xia!


+1000... on all counts. Xia FTW!
 
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Dan Zielinski
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Not going to lie... I'd back it too... but MAN this game is taking up a HUGE footprint already! How can it get bigger!?!?
 
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James Ridgway
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Personally, I have printed out both rule books and cobbled a comprehensive one together by mixing the pages, renumbering, making deletions and edits, and adding cross references so that we only have to flip through one and the obsolete portions are all eliminated or corrected.
 
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Big Tom Casual
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Vetinari wrote:
Personally, I have printed out both rule books and cobbled a comprehensive one together by mixing the pages, renumbering, making deletions and edits, and adding cross references so that we only have to flip through one and the obsolete portions are all eliminated or corrected.


You should scan that shiz and upload it for all us lazies!
 
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This is not that complicated at all. Far easier and faster than going through 18OE, Mage Knight, etc.
 
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Asher Thee Gravedigger
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Might be easier to do this as a PDF.
Do you think you could post a list of what you put together?
 
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Jeff Barrett
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TheeGravedigger wrote:
Might be easier to do this as a PDF.
Do you think you could post a list of what you put together?


I'd really appreciate seeing this as well!
 
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James Ridgway
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Here is the outline of the combined rule book. As I mentioned above, I printed both out, mixed the pages in a logical order, and hand-edited the text to revise or eliminate incorrect statements. (I also highlighted or underlined a bunch of easy-to-forget rules, but I won't detail those here.)

1 -- Base components page
2 -- Embers components page
3 -- Embers set-up page (base set-up page was recycled).
4 -- Base Overview page. Fame point track picture crossed out. Note added that events are described on page 20.
5-6 -- Base Ships pages
7-8 -- Base Outfits pages
9 -- Embers Outfits page
10-11 -- Base Nitty Gritty: Combat/Death/Movement. Note that ice damage is on page. 18. Death & respawn edited to eliminate references to losing turns and new rules on damage after respawn noted. Note that drawn mission cards are lost.
12 -- Base Player Turn Detail. Second line about what expanding tokens provide crossed out.
13-14 -- Base Game Board pages. Exploration tokens section crossed out. Note that exploration is explained on page 20.
15 -- Expansion rules on Sectors + Missions. Note that Ice asteroids and comets are on page 18
16 -- last Base board page (with planets and adjacency); Titles and Missions. Missions rules hand-edited with updates.
17 -- Base full page on missions. Notes under lawful and outlaw missions that more missions are described on the next page. Assassin rules edited.
18 -- Embers rules on Ice Asteroids, ice damage, ember, and new missions
19 -- Base rules on Capitalism. Buy & sell rules edited. Note under cube types that Ember is on page 18.
20 -- Embers rules on Event Deck and Economy
21 -- Base rules on Credits & NPCs. Exploration edited under credits.
22 -- Embers summary page

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Derek McCabe
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Vetinari wrote:
Here is the outline of the combined rule book. As I mentioned above, I printed both out, mixed the pages in a logical order, and hand-edited the text to revise or eliminate incorrect statements. (I also highlighted or underlined a bunch of easy-to-forget rules, but I won't detail those here.)

1 -- Base components page
2 -- Embers components page
3 -- Embers set-up page (base set-up page was recycled).
4 -- Base Overview page. Fame point track picture crossed out. Note added that events are described on page 20.
5-6 -- Base Ships pages
7-8 -- Base Outfits pages
9 -- Embers Outfits page
10-11 -- Base Nitty Gritty: Combat/Death/Movement. Note that ice damage is on page. 18. Death & respawn edited to eliminate references to losing turns and new rules on damage after respawn noted. Note that drawn mission cards are lost.
12 -- Base Player Turn Detail. Second line about what expanding tokens provide crossed out.
13-14 -- Base Game Board pages. Exploration tokens section crossed out. Note that exploration is explained on page 20.
15 -- Expansion rules on Sectors + Missions. Note that Ice asteroids and comets are on page 18
16 -- last Base board page (with planets and adjacency); Titles and Missions. Missions rules hand-edited with updates.
17 -- Base full page on missions. Notes under lawful and outlaw missions that more missions are described on the next page. Assassin rules edited.
18 -- Embers rules on Ice Asteroids, ice damage, ember, and new missions
19 -- Base rules on Capitalism. Buy & sell rules edited. Note under cube types that Ember is on page 18.
20 -- Embers rules on Event Deck and Economy
21 -- Base rules on Credits & NPCs. Exploration edited under credits.
22 -- Embers summary page

Yeah, but can you scan it and upload it to the files section so we can all skip the hard work?
 
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James Ridgway
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Maybe if Cody said he was OK with that. If I were a designer or publisher, I'm not sure if I would be comfortable with that. It's one thing for people to upload content that they built from scratch. Uploading a hand-edited copy of the rules might give folks the wrong impression that the rules are poorly written or that the publisher endorses this clearly unprofessional work.
 
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Derek McCabe
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Vetinari wrote:
Maybe if Cody said he was OK with that. If I were a designer or publisher, I'm not sure if I would be comfortable with that. It's one thing for people to upload content that they built from scratch. Uploading a hand-edited copy of the rules might give folks the wrong impression that the rules are poorly written or that the publisher endorses this clearly unprofessional work.
But that's literally what the files section is for. In the base game files section, there are a lot of player aids and even whole fan-written expansions/modules for the game, and Cody was totally cool with it - to the point that he included some of them in this very expansion. All you're doing is condensing the two rulebooks into one file for easier reading/reference. And also saving a bunch of other people the time and energy of doing the same thing. Haha
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James Ridgway
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I think there is a meaningful difference between fan-created content --- even stuff that uses templates with the original, copyrighted art work --- and uploading their copyrighted pages with my own ugly handwriting that does not add any content but merely implies that their work was inadequate and needed external editing.

Maybe they would be cool with that, maybe they wouldn't. Either way, I think they could believe that the effect on the reader would be different than the fan-created content that they approve. Game designers and publishers work really hard on the material that they produce. I respect them too much to assume that they would be fine with my handwritten, home-brew copy of the rules being printed out dozens or hundreds of times and becoming the face of their creation.
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Bill H
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Vetinari wrote:
I think there is a meaningful difference between fan-created content --- even stuff that uses templates with the original, copyrighted art work --- and uploading their copyrighted pages with my own ugly handwriting that does not add any content but merely implies that their work was inadequate and needed external editing.

Maybe they would be cool with that, maybe they wouldn't. Either way, I think they could believe that the effect on the reader would be different than the fan-created content that they approve. Game designers and publishers work really hard on the material that they produce. I respect them too much to assume that they would be fine with my handwritten, home-brew copy of the rules being printed out dozens or hundreds of times and becoming the face of their creation.


I think you're correct in your thinking here. It is one thing to post how you assembled your custom rule book for us to create on our own if compelled to do so (which is much appreciated), but to post a version of yours online without permission isn't in good form since it is more than just a player aid/summary.

[Edited for grammar]
 
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Big Tom Casual
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Vetinari wrote:
I think there is a meaningful difference between fan-created content --- even stuff that uses templates with the original, copyrighted art work --- and uploading their copyrighted pages with my own ugly handwriting that does not add any content but merely implies that their work was inadequate and needed external editing.

Maybe they would be cool with that, maybe they wouldn't. Either way, I think they could believe that the effect on the reader would be different than the fan-created content that they approve. Game designers and publishers work really hard on the material that they produce. I respect them too much to assume that they would be fine with my handwritten, home-brew copy of the rules being printed out dozens or hundreds of times and becoming the face of their creation.


Hard to argue with the best post I've read in months
 
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Jonathan Franklin
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If you worked with Cody on the combined rules, so they were 'official', maybe the two of you could KS the pdf for those who want it.
 
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James Ridgway
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I don't know that he needs my help. Combining them isn't that heavy a substantive lift. The real need is for someone who has whatever publishing program that they use. Whatever it is, I'm guessing it's not Word or Adobe, so I wouldn't be able to do the work of making it look nice, which is the hard part.
 
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Derek McCabe
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Well, nothing can be done until a PDF of the expansion rulebook shows up online...
 
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Derek McCabe
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Vetinari wrote:
I think there is a meaningful difference between fan-created content --- even stuff that uses templates with the original, copyrighted art work --- and uploading their copyrighted pages with my own ugly handwriting that does not add any content but merely implies that their work was inadequate and needed external editing.

Maybe they would be cool with that, maybe they wouldn't. Either way, I think they could believe that the effect on the reader would be different than the fan-created content that they approve. Game designers and publishers work really hard on the material that they produce. I respect them too much to assume that they would be fine with my handwritten, home-brew copy of the rules being printed out dozens or hundreds of times and becoming the face of their creation.
I personally don't see it as a sign of disrespect to combine the two rulebooks. If you design something and sell it, and someone finds a way to make it more accessible, then you shouldn't feel disrespected. But hey, to each their own.
 
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Shannon T
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TheLegoPirate wrote:
Well, nothing can be done until a PDF of the expansion rulebook shows up online...


You mean like this?
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James Ridgway
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TheLegoPirate wrote:
I personally don't see it as a sign of disrespect to combine the two rulebooks. If you design something and sell it, and someone finds a way to make it more accessible, then you shouldn't feel disrespected. But hey, to each their own.[/q]

It's not about respect. It's about presentation. They can totally understand that I respect them and still feel bad that their masterpiece is being presented in a less than ideal manner. If it were me, I'd understand, but it's not how I would want folks interacting with something that I'd spent so many years of my life on.
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