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Subject: Just got Lobotomy? Start here... rss

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Judgement Dave
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Knowing that another wave of Lobotomy is now arriving a few months after the 1st ones arrived, I thought it could help to remind people of the help/revisions available.

Contents:

It appears that the box contents were changed after the manual was created, changed from SGs during the KS and they even changed during production. This makes it very hard to know if you've got what you should have...
Luckily Rick Vinyard has created Kickstarter Inventory Checklist on Google Sheets which appears to be the best list (though see the post with my clarifications).

Rules and Scenarios:

The updated manual and the revised format scenarios are at:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/fsbjavnu8m15708/Lobotomy%20Manual%...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/vupuccgupebii1s/Scenarios.pdf

Note that I did the work on these but at the time did not have the core game, and so only had the original manuals/cards to go off, and made some changes from asking clarifications from the devs.

As such the revised manual does not correct the contents list (as I had no indication that it was incorrect).

I suggested several changes when I spotted inconsistencies, contradictions or gaps (even just to clarify/remove edge cases) and the revised manual contains the correct version. Note that there were some changes to combat, e.g. overwhelm changed to better cope with a mix of ranged and melee monsters.
Needless to say, my player aid agrees with the revised rules.

Oh - and don't overlook the biggest change I made - I came up with the name for normal difficulty of 'Seemingly Normal'!

The revised scenarios are (I think) generally regarded as far superior to the format shown in the printed rulebook, being easier to set-up and expanding on specific rules for each scenario. They also contain some minor doctor's notes flavour text I added.

Also - I've created revised format versions of the 'From the Deep' expansion Rituals (mini-scenarios), but they're not public yet - they'll hopefully be out soon...


From the Deep Expansion (and Rituals):

A pdf of the improved rules and revamped Rituals (mini-scenarios) for the From the Deep expansion is now available on BGG:

Revised From the Deep Manual & Rituals


Player/Rule Aids:

And now the shameless plug: If you haven't already, I'd heartily recommend going to the BGG Lobotomy files section and downloading the following:

Index to Lobotomy Manual
JD's Map Cards for Lobotomy
JD's Lobotomy Player Aids


Bling:

And if you want some card dividers and papercraft lockers to make see:
JD's Horizontal Card Dividers
JD's Papercraft Lockers & Cabinets for Lobotomy


Scenario Difficulty:

Off his early plays, General Grundmann suggested the following ratings for scenarios:

GeneralGrundmann wrote:
If beginners start the game with a too complex and/or too difficult scenario, they might get frustrated and annoyed, pushing the game from the table, putting it on a shelf and never touching it again. soblue

That should be avoided at all costs! cool

For example "Asylum Field Day" has easy to understand mechanics and has a beginner difficulty level.

"Memories", the first scenario in the rulebook, has complex mechanics AND a high difficulty level, so it really should better not be played as the first mission to learn the game. cry


Edit: These are my proposals concerning scenario complexity (sc) based on setup, special rules and special events as well as scenario difficulty (sd) based on objective and enemies.

1 to 4. 1 being the lowest level up to 4 the highest level.

My experience is mostly based on two-scenario-games with 4 characters, so no third monster spawn and active 4-players handicap in each mission where available.

Memories / sc 4 / sd 3
The 13th day of Christmas / sc 2 / sd 2
One day at the circus / sc 3 / sd 3
Frankenstein´s Tower / sc 1 / sd 4
Blood God´s offering / sc 3 / sd 2
Lesbian Vampires´ Diaries / sc 3 / sd 3
Blood Bond / sc 2 / sd 4
The Antichrist / sc 3 / sd 4
The Body Snatchers / sc 3 / sd 3
Asylum field day / sc 1 / sd 1
Dream World / sc 2 / sd 2
Twin Defense / sc 2 / sd 2
Monster Control / sc 2 / sd 2
Vampire´s Desires / sc 2 / sd 3
The Book of Revelation / sc 4 / sd 4
Balloon Frenzy / sc 3 / sd 3
Big Bad Wolf (unplayed, no rating possible)
Mamma´s home cooked dinner / sc 2 / sd 3
Rescue Mission / sc 2 / sd 3
The Mist / sc 2 / sd 2
Moonlight Shadow Ritual / sc 2 / sd 4
Siren´s Song / sc 2 / sd 2

The average scenario complexity is: 2,38

The average scenario difficulty is: 2,81

I've been planning to do some replacement (hopefully more useful) scenario cards (i.e. the playing cards you can use to randomise scenarios) and General Grundmann has kindly said that I can place his difficulty ratings on them. Stay tuned for them.


Hope this all helps!

Have fun & good luck!

As a final note, as I feel bad about this, there are some formatting errors/typos in the revised docs - the odd one by me as I ended up doing more rewriting than just proofing, but also several seem to have been added when TFG edited the versions I sent to them.

EDIT: 3 Aug 17 - added section on difficulty ratings
EDIT: 22 Dec 17 - added section on From the Deep
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Oliver Brettschneider
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Thanks for the hard work, TFG should be paying you for this.

I guess you don't know either if the revised rules will be edited once more (there are a bunch of annotations to the dropbox files) and if they will be made available in printed form, do you?
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Judgement Dave
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Imagine wrote:
I guess you don't know either if the revised rules will be edited once more (there are a bunch of annotations to the dropbox files) and if they will be made available in printed form, do you?

Your guess is correct - I don't know!

I've never heard TFG state anything other than that (IIRC) they are hoping to make a printed version of the revised manual available though it will probably have a charge attached to cover costs.

IIRC It's always sounded like they would do it free if they could, but the cost would prohibit that and they'd be looking to charge a minimal amount to help make it happen. i.e. they didn't seem to be using a reprint as an income stream.

Of course, that's my interpretation of what they've previously said. It's not a promise from TFG!


-------------------------
Now that's probably enough for most people, but if you want to read why I think further revisions may be limited and why they've been hard to do, read on.
-------------------------

I've just had glance at the annotations on the Scenarios (for the 1st time) and the Manual (for the 1st time since not long after it was posted).

There's an odd mix.

The scenario annotations I've seen are mostly reasonable - typos and things like changing 'Drugs' to 'Meds', which I didn't know had changed when I created the new format scenarios. They could easily be changed, and should be, but, on the other hand, most are easy to see what is actually intended.
There's also a couple of clarifications that should go into a revised version.

While there are some minor typos that I'm embarrassed about, and more errors and layout issues caused at TFGs end, the manual annotations do contain a lot of 'personal preference' suggestions. And a lot of nitpicking about stylistics - again, a matter of personal preference.

It almost looks to me like TFG took the edited files I provided and then retyped them. I can understand why they might do something like that (i.e. created their own version of the files I sent) but it does raise a question about whether any further editing would solve some errors just to introduce new ones...

This actually explains several of the formatting errors and missing lines, missing spaces etc. It's because TFG have used a slightly different font or resized it, so that means the size of the text changes, meaning that things may shift position on the page.

But surely that's not an issue is it?

Oh, read on...

Something many players won't appreciate is that the software used for creating the manual was actually photoshop - i.e. software designed for image manipulation and not designed for writing documents such as manuals.
That, coupled with my system struggling under the sheer size of the images/number of layers, was actually the source of some of the typos/errors I made. Even typing up text elsewhere and then copying/pasting into photoshop wasn't reliable, especially as I'd often have to re-edit on the fly to get the text-flow right.

Using photoshop also meant that you can't just add a paragraph and let the rest of the document flow onto the next page - if a line won't fit on a page you need to either rejig the page or text to make it fit or edit it into the next page. You can imagine how adding a few lines of additional text on page 5 or 6 could have knock-on effects on many, many subsequent pages.
This is partly why I had to use some of the language I did, whereas in other circumstances I probably would have littered the text with examples of play and more explicit descriptions.

Now if you've managed to make it through all of that, you may appreciate that editing the manual is a pig of a job. It's partly for this reason that I don't know how much more could/will be done. I can say that if TFG just used the photoshop files I supplied, without re-editing/recreating them, I'd be more hopeful and I'd be quite willing to address some of the real issues that do still exist. But as it is, I don't know if any changes would survive the recreation, and I have no idea if/when TFG would get around to publishing it.

If only I was given permission to directly publish the manual revision it'd be done very quickly and with fewer errors. e.g. I supplied TFG with the revised Siren's Song scenario months ago and they were to republish the scenarios file. I thought that this would be within days of the current file being published, but it's still not available.

I'd post the image of the revised scenario here if I knew for certain that I had permission to. I don't know that so I haven't posted it.

Admittedly, I was a bit naughty and posted the index I'd created for the manual. I only did this after I'd been told for my map cards that I didn't need to ask, but just in case I still haven't posted the revised scenarios/rituals.
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Oliver Brettschneider
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Maybe it's time we (the players) start bugging TFG about it.
devil
 
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Felix Grundmann
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@Judgement Dave
Thanks a lot for ALL you efforts! :-)


Best regards
Felix GENERAL Grundmann
 
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Perry Grosshans
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Thanks again for the work JD. I played my first game last night and found the player aid cards immensely useful!

I'm planning on printing and making those lockers/cabinets.

Also looking forward to using your set up cards for the boards. The game we played last night had doors on EVERY door marker, because (as others have noted in the other thread) the art isn't as clear on the boards. Knowing now, though, that each board should have between 6 to 8 doors is great. And those cards will definitely help!

And of course the scenario cards look pretty good as well. Will be easier to use instead of constantly having to flip through the big rulebook to reference the special scenario things.

EDIT: Played a game last night, and WOW, THANK YOU JD! The setup cards absolutely did make a difference in set up. And the separate scenario card helped so that I didn't have to keep flipping the heavy book every time. Great Play Aids!!
 
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Craig Thompson-Wood
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JD - thanks for all of your work. I will echo the words of the others here by saying that I played my first game and found your references very helpful.

There were a couple of things which I looked for and could not find in your index/etc. The first was "markers" which are mentioned in "The Mist" scenario. But I think this is what they were referring to as "tokens" later in the scenario. But it did confuse me for a bit.

Secondly, was the "basic skills". I would really think that this should be added to the index. These are the skills which are unique to each character. There are 4 cards for each character and you choose two. I could not remember during game play, and only found out afterwards how you get more (can trade in 2 memory cards for another basic skill card).

 
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Judgement Dave
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Thanks for the feedback.

Glad the aids/revisions helped - hope you enjoyed the game and stayed reasonably sane!

Spazzfist wrote:
There were a couple of things which I looked for and could not find in your index/etc. The first was "markers" which are mentioned in "The Mist" scenario. But I think this is what they were referring to as "tokens" later in the scenario. But it did confuse me for a bit.

You are correct that the tokens and markers are the same. In my defence, it's why it's 'tokens' and not 'Tokens' (capitalised) - it was referring to tokens/markers in the general sense.

I can't see it causing any great confusion, but I'll revise my version - not sure if/when it'll trickle down to the TFG published/hosted version though.


Quote:
Secondly, was the "basic skills". I would really think that this should be added to the index. These are the skills which are unique to each character. There are 4 cards for each character and you choose two. I could not remember during game play, and only found out afterwards how you get more (can trade in 2 memory cards for another basic skill card).

It could be worth me adding it, for completeness, depending on how many other entries may get added (space constraints), but it's not really hard to find...

The glossary has a brief entry for Basic Skills (on page 28), and the glossary isn't indexed (which I think is fair enough).

If I checked the index and couldn't find 'Basic Skills', I'd look at 'Skills', since 'Basic Skills' sounds like a subtype of all 'Skills'.

The index entry for 'Skills' says page 13. On page 13, the 1st sentence of the section titled 'Skills' says:

Characters have 4 personalised Basic Skills and can gain any number of additional skills from the Mental Disorder Decks (OCD, Schizophrenia etc.).

Gaining new Basic Skills by trading in Memory Cards is covered in the Memories section (also on page 13, immediately before the Skills section). Since you need Memory Cards to get the Basic Skill, I think it's probably fine staying there (given the current editing constraints I mentioned in a previous post).
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Craig Thompson-Wood
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JudgementDave wrote:
Gaining new Basic Skills by trading in Memory Cards is covered in the Memories section (also on page 13, immediately before the Skills section). Since you need Memory Cards to get the Basic Skill, I think it's probably fine staying there (given the current editing constraints I mentioned in a previous post).


But that's the problem I encountered: I didn't know that the memories could be traded in for basic skills. I mean, I had read the rulebook, but that one part did not stick in my brain. All I did remember (and clarified with a quick search) was that you pick two of the basic skills and then they say something about keeping the others handy as "you will need them later". It took a bit of searching for me to find how they were used "later".

 
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John Di Ponio
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Just downloaded all the new rules, faq's and component list for when it arrivesa t my house in 2020.
 
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Joe Cook
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Very helpful and much appreciated. Any chance at a quick-start setup guide? I'm getting very confused as to how I should set the board up before playing and I'm sure others will feel the same. Thanks! If one doesn't exist by the time I actually figure out what I'm doing, I'll try to help by creating one.
 
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Judgement Dave
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joboyogi wrote:
Any chance at a quick-start setup guide? I'm getting very confused as to how I should set the board up before playing and I'm sure others will feel the same.

Have you tried JD's Map Cards for Lobotomy?

They have a card that has set-up instructions on it and the map cards themselves help highlight doors/lockers and more.

I know that some have found them very helpful.
 
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John Bua
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Is it finally shipping? When is it coming to NY?
 
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Judgement Dave
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jbua wrote:
Is it finally shipping? When is it coming to NY?

It looks like the Rest of World orders haven't started arriving yet (and, may not even have been dispatched yet).

North American orders have been arriving for 2 (or 3) weeks now, but they are still arriving at a fair rate. As a result, obviously, some people in NA haven't received theirs yet.

See the KS comments for some people reporting them arriving (or not).

There seems to have been a major cock-up with the packing for NA, with the main recurrent issues being:
- Many (maybe everyone) who ordered the character pack is missing B A Dolly & Nicolas Jackson
- Many who ordered Cthulhu have not received him
- Many who didn't order Cthulhu have received him

Note: that the dice and dice bag have not been created yet, so it is not an error if you ordered these but do not yet have them.

Looking at the backers reports on KS, I suspect that there's been a misalignment (possibly a transposition) of fields in a spreadsheet or database query. If this is the case it ought to be quite easy to sort out who/what is missing.

IIRC it was over a week ago that TFG said that they were aware of the issue and taking steps to get the missing parts resent - I believe you don't currently need to contact TFG if these are the only errors you have.

On top of these known errors there are the occasional packing errors that you get in any KS involving lots of products, backers and individualised orders (due to add-ons) - e.g. got the wrong mini, broken minis etc. If you have these, then you definitely should contact TFG.
 
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Joe Cook
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I just saw it right now. This game would be impossible to play if it weren't for these guides and that's a real shame as I think it's going to be a lot of fun once I get it figured out. They should put a link to your guides on the Kickstarter page and their own website. They really need to make it clear to people that buy it that they recognize the shortcomings but have a community as dedicated as you have been to getting it right.
 
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Joe Cook
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@JudgementDave Do you have any plans to do a revised manual for the From the Deep expansion? If so, do you need any help?
 
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Judgement Dave
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joboyogi wrote:
@JudgementDave Do you have any plans to do a revised manual for the From the Deep expansion? If so, do you need any help?

I've done one and I love the new format I've created for Rituals - much friendlier and some more variety/handicapping.

I've sent a mid-res pdf version to TFG a month or two back. I'd clarified a few issues with the devs (or proposed solutions/changes) but there's a couple of queries I'm still waiting replies on. (e.g. whether there are doors on one of the small boards.)

Now past waiting to see if I get an answer, I've no idea what stage anything (related to this) is at. I tend not to pester the devs too much - if I ask a question I usually get a quick answer, but if they need to go off and check something I'll not raise it again unless a lot of time has passed. It's part of my strategy for hopefully not peeing them off and so keeping communication open!

It's quite frustrating to be sat here, knowing I've got a revised version 99% done (pending query answers) but knowing that I can't just make it available off my own back.

What I can say is that I love my new scenario format and hope it's worth the wait!

EDIT: On top of my usual caution in pestering the devs, Mrs JD has been on holiday this week, so I've been quite happy to give them another week to get some answers together... I'll probably chase things up next week.
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Balazs Szendroi
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Hello guys! The scenario guide comments (first comments in the pdf found in this topic) mentioned a difficulty rating for the scenarios. Where can it be found if it really exists? Only played 2 games on normal difficulty with 3 characters, but the games were too easy in my opinion, I would like to try the harder scenarios, or maybe I'll play the scenarios like I had 4 characters. I might have been just lucky, but most charcter has great movement skills, almost everyone has a good attack skill and mostly they can heal somehow. Also with 2 scenarios the bonus die can be used almost all the time when they are required. The scenarios I've played were where the clown buffed the enemies and ran around, one of the vampire ones, the one where the witches are summoning (?) Baba Yaga, and the last was the one with the twins and the smoke.
 
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John Bua
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Any news on this game shipping to New York.
 
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Joe Cook
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JD - Are you still doing updates on these guides to fix typos? Do you want feedback?
 
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Billy Crawford - Greybeard
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So, I just bought the retail box and expansion. From what I'm seeing listed in the OP, the box contents in the manual are off. I'm not getting a kickstarter version so I imagine the box contents are different.

Do we know for a fact, wherever it might be listed, what the contents of the retail box are?

Btw, thanks JD, started printing out all of your files a while ago. Appreciate the work you put into this for everyone!
 
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Joe Cook
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The only things you could be missing are mental patients and scavengers. Why don't you count them and put up how many you have and we'll tell you what we got in our boxes? Otherwise, if it fits in the molded plastic, then it's probably accurate.
 
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John Bua
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I am a Kickstarter backer in NY. When am I getting my game?
 
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Joe Cook
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You may have more success asking Titan-Forge on their website, Facebook or e-mail. We're just a bunch of random people that are trying to play the game.
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John Bua
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They don't reply so I am trying everywhere.
 
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